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Author Topic: Traditio -- an all-time low.  (Read 4371 times)

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Traditio -- an all-time low.
« Reply #20 on: February 19, 2013, 05:50:16 AM »
Quote from: Sigismund
Quote from: Canute
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Traditio needs to do a little bit of homework before they jump to any conclusions.

Traditio, a fun website, needs to issue a correction and even apologize because they really got this one wrong - way wrong.  The readers of Traditio are unlikely to have all that extra time on their hands to check and doublecheck everything Traditio puts out.  

I stopped trusting it a long time ago. "Father" Morrison is not a real priest and I think he just says provocative things he thinks will get him support from people who are gullible.


How is he not a real priest?  Is there some question about the validity of his ordination?  I am not being contentious here.  I honestly don't know anything about the man but his name and that his church is on Fisherman's Wharf.  


For years he wouldn't tell anyone who ordained him, but it turned out to be some Old Catholic "bishop" who I think was the brother of a mayor of San Francisco. Old Catholic "priests" have been trying to get in on the traditionalist movement from the beginning. "Fr." Morrison was one of the few who succeeded and has fooled a lot of people.

For Sigimund: He may say some interesting things but a "priest" who can't even be trusted to give a straight answer about his ordination (for obvious reasons in Morrison's case) doesn't seem to be a reliable source for opinions about anything else.

Traditio -- an all-time low.
« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2013, 06:18:46 AM »
Quote from: Thursday
Quote from: Canute
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Traditio needs to do a little bit of homework before they jump to any conclusions.

Traditio, a fun website, needs to issue a correction and even apologize because they really got this one wrong - way wrong.  The readers of Traditio are unlikely to have all that extra time on their hands to check and doublecheck everything Traditio puts out.  

I stopped trusting it a long time ago. "Father" Morrison is not a real priest and I think he just says provocative things he thinks will get him support from people who are gullible.


Saying he is not a real priest is going a little far. He was light years ahead of everyone else on Bishop Fellay and his old commentaries are there to prove it. Everyone talked about how irreverent he was when he talked about "Bernie" but look at what Fellay has done know. Same with those little smiley faces he had next to the parishes in the latin mass directory, people were offended that the SSPX parishes got those unhappy faces, but look what's happening in the SSPX now. And, he commented repeatedly that Ratzinger would abdicate on or near his 85th birthday.

I'm not saying he doesn't have his faults, this latest incident is proof enough of that, but you don't want to throw the baby out with the bath water.


Good post Thursday. He was obviously fed wrong information on this issue. I dont think he ever retracts or apologizes! The good thing about Traditio is that it saw through Fellay a long time ago, and has always worked like mad to scuttle any deal between the SSPX and rome. Another good thing was it's use of the name "Bernie". While many were upset when they first saw it, it gradually brought Bp Fellay down from that pedestal where so many had placed him.


Traditio -- an all-time low.
« Reply #22 on: February 19, 2013, 07:13:23 AM »
Quote from: Canute


For years he wouldn't tell anyone who ordained him, but it turned out to be some Old Catholic "bishop" who I think was the brother of a mayor of San Francisco. Old Catholic "priests" have been trying to get in on the traditionalist movement from the beginning. "Fr." Morrison was one of the few who succeeded and has fooled a lot of people.

For Sigimund: He may say some interesting things but a "priest" who can't even be trusted to give a straight answer about his ordination (for obvious reasons in Morrison's case) doesn't seem to be a reliable source for opinions about anything else.


That Old Catholic story comes from a guy named Terry Boyle.

I had a conversation on fisheaters a few years ago about this. This is what one poster wrote.

"Mr. Terry Boyle, who had made it a hobby of his to track the various Bishops(probably at the behest of someone in the the N.O.) lineages, including the Thuc lines and other independent groups. I asked him about "Father" Morrison. He showed me a letter from Mr. Merril Adamson who said he was "ordained" with "Father" Morrison in a ceremony performed by "Bishop" Thaddeus Alioto. Alioto claimed he was consecrated by "Bishop" de Ortega Maxey, who claimed orders through the Old Catholic Church of America (whose orders are disputed by the Old Catholics in Europe)."


Well, according to Rama Coomaraswamy,  Malachi Martin verified (in Rome) the validity of both those men mentioned by the poster "Bishop Thaddeus Alioto" and "Bishop Ortega Maxey"
You can read his whole article here but I'll post the pertanent parts. http://www.the-pope.com/ordination.html

"Malachi Martin, who made inquiries on my behalf in Rome about the validity of various traditional Bishops – Rome up to recent times having maintained strict records about such matters – assures me that the ordinations and consecrations of Archbishop Thuc are beyond any question valid. The same is true of the ordinations of Bishop Patrick Taylor. (Bishop Taylor comes from a Brazilian line – a group that was initially schismatic but which reconciled to Rome before Vatican II. (I have in my possession and hand written letter from Malachi Martin affirming the validity of Bishop Patrick Taylor.) I never discussed with him the issue of the Lefebvre ordinations, but I assume from other comments that he considered them valid. Again, I never discussed with him the position of Bishop Vizelis, but since he derives his Orders from Archbishop Thuc, one must assume them to be valid. The other Bishop about which I asked him to make inquiries was Bishop Thaddeus Alioto in Mexico which again he assured me was valid. (Bishop Alioto was a Dominican who was ordained in 1950 by Pius XII and was consecrated by a BIishop Maxi before the changes.)"

Again from the poster at fisheaters.
"Thus we look to circuмstantial evidence: "Father" refuses to present his credentials. In the past it seems it was common for him to delete from his e-mail listserv those who asked for his credentials. There is some non-certified docuмented evidence from a fellow ordinand claiming that both were "ordained" by a bishop who claimed lineage through an non-Catholic Bishop whose Orders were questionable."

If you look on his website he addresses, though somewhat indirectly, these claims saying (paraphrasing) that if he tried to satisfy every person who had inquires he would have no time for anything else, and the text is dated 1998. Looking at the situation in light of this new information its no surprise that he didn't respond to requests for his Bona Fides (over the internet anyway) because he knew that whoever was asking for them probably saw Terry Boyles memo that the Bishop who consecrated him was invalid thus by providing the Bishops name he would only be confirming the false information coming from Boyle.

Traditio -- an all-time low.
« Reply #23 on: February 19, 2013, 12:45:04 PM »
Thursday,

I think you're gullible where you should be very careful. Fourth hand claims about what Malachy Martin claims he "saw" on a supposed list in Rome aren't convincing at all because a real Catholic priest can give you more proof for his ordination than that.

All you have to do is one Google search and you find out that Ortega Maxey was an apostate priest and an old Catholic "bishop," who later resigned to become a pastor of a Universalist church.

http://www.concentric.net/~cosmas/maxey.htm

Three items down the list, you find out that he did time in prison for producing an obscene book, The Sex Life of a Cop:

Quote
Aday and his partner, Wallace de Ortega Maxey, were both sentenced to twenty-five years in prison, the stiffest sentence for an obscenity conviction in United States history.

Aday belonged to the early gαy rights organization, the Mattachine Society, with Ortega Maxey, a retired Catholic priest who became minister of the Universalist Church in Los Angeles, where the Mattachine Society held their meetings.


http://blog.seattlepi.com/bookpatrol/2010/03/22/sex-life-of-a-cop-chows-down-big-donuts-at-paperbacks-show-for-record/

Do you think that the Vatican in the 1950s would bother to keep track of whether or not the orders of someone like this were valid?

No wonder "Fr." Morrison doesn't give out the information!

Traditio -- an all-time low.
« Reply #24 on: February 19, 2013, 06:15:00 PM »
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Quote from: Sigismund
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Traditio needs to do a little bit of homework before they jump to any conclusions.

Traditio, a fun website, needs to issue a correction and even apologize because they really got this one wrong - way wrong.  The readers of Traditio are unlikely to have all that extra time on their hands to check and doublecheck everything Traditio puts out.  


The first rule of Traditio is that they never apologize for anything.  The Fathers moderator are the new magisterium, exercising non-papal infallibility.


You will be proven correct, I would imagine.

However, any trad who does a five minute google search would know with certainty that Traditio mischaracterized the entire story - the story, as they saw it, was too good to bother to check it out before running with it.

I live near St Louis so I could physically visit St Stanislaus if I wanted.


It might be an interesting field trip.  If I am ever there I might go and sit in the back, very passively attending just to see how odd it really is.