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Author Topic: SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.  (Read 3867 times)

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Offline ClarkSmith

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SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2015, 10:26:48 AM »
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  • I watched his show a few times in the past but I don't know  his position on Vatican II.

    Is Voris

    A.) A person that fully accepts Vatican II.  

    B.) A person that reluctantly accepts Vatican II and only sees a problem with a handful of bishops and priests.  

    C.) A person  that does not support Vatican II but still attends Novus Ordo masses

    D.) A person that does not support Vatican II and resists its teachings. He does not attend Novus Ordo masses.

    E.) Sedevacantist

    F.) Supports Pope Michael  


    Offline Charlemagne

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #16 on: April 24, 2015, 11:15:30 AM »
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  • Quote from: ClarkSmith
    I watched his show a few times in the past but I don't know  his position on Vatican II.

    Is Voris

    A.) A person that fully accepts Vatican II.  

    B.) A person that reluctantly accepts Vatican II and only sees a problem with a handful of bishops and priests.  

    C.) A person  that does not support Vatican II but still attends Novus Ordo masses

    D.) A person that does not support Vatican II and resists its teachings. He does not attend Novus Ordo masses.

    E.) Sedevacantist

    F.) Supports Pope Michael  


    He's a person who wears pink, has a bad haircut, and solicits donations to take "retreats" aboard cruise ships.
    "This principle is most certain: The non-Christian cannot in any way be Pope. The reason for this is that he cannot be head of what he is not a member. Now, he who is not a Christian is not a member of the Church, and a manifest heretic is not a Christian, as is clearly taught by St. Cyprian, St. Athanasius, St. Augustine, St. Jerome, and others. Therefore, the manifest heretic cannot be Pope." -- St. Robert Bellarmine


    Offline cassini

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #17 on: April 24, 2015, 11:48:34 AM »
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  • Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta
    4.
    Quote
    my grandfather and his family having been born Catholics in Connacht, making me a descendant Galatian with a right to read Knock’s allegory

    Can you explain "right to read.."?  
    (both my grandfather and grandmother and families were born Catholics in Connacht also)

    5.
    Quote
    Now while the Church has never officially interpreted the apparition at Knock

    Why is this?  


    The answers lie in the mystery of Allegory, which by its very nature is open to speculation. In other words, others can interpret the vison as they see it. The essay explained:

    'It is a fact that the only place where the word allegory is mentioned in Scripture is in St Paul’s Letter to the Galatians: ‘things are said by an allegory’ (Gal. 4:24). We also know that it was the Galatians who were advised that if an angel from heaven [let alone Vatican II] should preach a different gospel to that which they had been taught, to reject it (Gal 1:8).'

    As a direct descendant of a long Catholic family line that lived in Connacht I claim the right to offer our (my friend lives near Knock) interpretation. Your grandparents too PerEvangelicaDicta inherited this right from St Paul, as you yourself do. The fact that you can relate so much to it shows you too can share the gift to work out the true meaning of the apparition.
    For me the most profound vindication of the meaning of Knock was the fact - as we found out- it happened on the very day that the statue of Our Lady of La Salette was crowned by the Archbishop of Paris.

    On Sept. 19, 1846, the Mother of God appeared in a private apparition to two peasant children at La Salette in France. Our Lady did however give the children a message to tell the world some years later. She bewailed the weak faith and sinfulness of Catholics, especially the clergy, and foretold the consequences should such behaviour continue without repentance. Even though approved by three popes, Pius IX, Leo XIII and Pope St Pius X, the message was met with furious opposition from masonic or masonic controlled bishops. Among the most important messages were:
    (1) ‘The Church will be in eclipse.’
    (2) ‘Evil books will be abundant on earth and the spirit of darkness will spread everywhere a universal slackening in all that concerns the service of God.’
    (3) ‘Rome will lose the faith and become the seat of the Antichrist.’    

    Why has the Church never interpreted the Knock vision? I suspect it is because some things only become clear in retrospect, hindsight. Similar to the Apocalypse, the Church has never given us a clear explanation of it and only as we see these things happening can we interpret what it probably meant. For example, as a 1950s Catholic I would never, in a 1,000,000 years, have believed what has happened in the Church since Vatican II. Up to the 1960s few in the Church knew what was going on in the greater picture. I recall being shocked that Our Lady would say such things about the Church of her Son. This led to the opinion La Salette HAD to be a false Marian message. Now that we traditionalists have seen what did happen at Vatican II and since, we can now see La Salette in its true light.

    Our effortts to interpret what Knock surely meant in the light of events, we put together a history of the battle since La Salette. I can put it up for what it is worth. It is a long read if any are interested.

    Offline cassini

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #18 on: April 24, 2015, 12:14:39 PM »
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  • Quote from: ClarkSmith
    I watched his show a few times in the past but I don't know  his position on Vatican II.

    Is Voris

    A.) A person that fully accepts Vatican II.  

    B.) A person that reluctantly accepts Vatican II and only sees a problem with a handful of bishops and priests.  

    C.) A person  that does not support Vatican II but still attends Novus Ordo masses

    D.) A person that does not support Vatican II and resists its teachings. He does not attend Novus Ordo masses.

    E.) Sedevacantist

    F.) Supports Pope Michael  


    Voris is a VICTIM of the times. Like many other good Catholics of our time, he really does not know how to approach the current crisis in the Church. There are those good Catholics of pre-Vatican II vintage who know and have the faith but simply cannot get past the paradox presented to them. Catholics are taught that popes are the same as St Peters, Vicars of Christ on earth and that we are bound to hold them as such or enter schism. When popes since Vatican II have instigated the NO Mass and beliefs the flock is to follow, like sheep they followed, and some of my good Catholic friends do follow, the only ones still attending the NO Mass their Pope says and attends.
    Others, like myself, simply could not follow because they considered the changes to be contrary to that of tradition and St Paul had told us that even if an angle for HEAVEN were to offer you a doctrine contrary to that taught you, reject it. So we simply sought out a 'Mass Rock' somewhere and ignored what Rome says. We are obliged by our faith to accept they are legally held Church positions of popes, cardinals and priests.

    Voris is one of those who believes he can have his cake and eat it. To criticize a pope is in the eyes of Voris an absolute no no. He does point out the many errors of 'the Church of nice' but that is as far as he can go. He refuses to acknowledge that the 'BUCK STOPS WITH THE CURRENT POPE IN OFFICE.'
    He wants to be with the Pope and therefore must sideline the SSPX and others who refuse to do what Rome has been doing and believing in since Vatican II.

    Voris is to me a very exceptional man, who would have loved to live and experience Catholicism of the 1940s and 50s. He sees many of the problems with the 'Church of Nice', but does not know where to go from there. Yes, he is a victim of the times and while none of us are perfect in any way should be understood as such.

    Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #19 on: April 24, 2015, 12:47:55 PM »
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  • I appreciate your thoughtful response Cassini.  You've given me (us) much to meditate upon and further research.

    Quote
    For me the most profound vindication of the meaning of Knock was the fact - as we found out- it happened on the very day that the statue of Our Lady of La Salette was crowned by the Archbishop of Paris.


    Profound indeed.  I was not aware of this either.


    Offline Croixalist

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #20 on: April 24, 2015, 01:00:52 PM »
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  • Judging by the speed of which Voris managed to backstab all the prominent trads after speaking at the Catholic Identity Conference in 2013, he's a rather clumsily disquised shill/sleeper agent for the sex-traffickers over in Rome. Instructions from his handlers from the Vatican probably went something like this: "Pretend you're one of them just long enough to get invited to one of their shindigs, then when we give the word, we'll need you to turn on them! By the time the Synod rolls around people won't know what to think. Speaking of turn ons, we love those pink shirts of yours!"
    Fortuna finem habet.

    Offline Columba

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #21 on: April 24, 2015, 01:51:59 PM »
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  • Why is everyone being so hard are poor Michael Voris? Someone even implied he is effeminate which is ridiculous. He is out there defending and taking flak for his understanding of the Catholic faith during a confusing time where nobody knows what to do with the pope or if he even exists.

    Voris' position might be described as soft R&R as compared to the medium R&R of Mezingen and the hard R&R of the Resistance. Voris thinks Mezingen is sede-leaning just as Mezingen says the same about the Resistance. Resistors say Voris is a hypocrite for not being fully on-board with Francis just as the real SV's say the same about them. NO's more mainstream than Voris probably consider him to be sede-leaning.

    I think Voris' primary mistake is his dogmatism regarding his particular spot on the sede spectrum, but then that shortcoming is shared almost everyone else on that spectrum.

    Offline Matto

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #22 on: April 24, 2015, 01:57:01 PM »
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  • Quote from: Columba
    Why is everyone being so hard are poor Michael Voris?

    I think it is because he attacks traditional Catholics instead of Bergoglio.
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.


    Offline wallflower

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #23 on: April 24, 2015, 02:18:16 PM »
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  • Quote from: Columba
    Voris' position might be described as soft R&R as compared to the medium R&R of Mezingen and the hard R&R of the Resistance.


    Haha, soft, medium and hard R&R. Never thought of it that way. Sigh. I know we need vocabulary and labels to express ideas and keep them clear, but it sure is getting more and more complicated. God help us.

     

     

    Offline Charlemagne

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #24 on: April 24, 2015, 02:33:53 PM »
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  • Quote from: Columba
    Why is everyone being so hard are poor Michael Voris? Someone even implied he is effeminate which is ridiculous.


    That would be me, and I didn't imply it, I stated it. Any man who wears pink and looks as though he uses a blow-comb and mousse every morning certainly comes across as effeminate...at least to me.
    "This principle is most certain: The non-Christian cannot in any way be Pope. The reason for this is that he cannot be head of what he is not a member. Now, he who is not a Christian is not a member of the Church, and a manifest heretic is not a Christian, as is clearly taught by St. Cyprian, St. Athanasius, St. Augustine, St. Jerome, and others. Therefore, the manifest heretic cannot be Pope." -- St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline GottmitunsAlex

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #25 on: April 24, 2015, 02:38:43 PM »
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  • Quote from: Charlemagne
    Quote from: Columba
    Why is everyone being so hard are poor Michael Voris? Someone even implied he is effeminate which is ridiculous.


    That would be me, and I didn't imply it, I stated it. Any man who wears pink and looks as though he uses a blow-comb and mousse every morning certainly comes across as effeminate...at least to me.


    I concur.


    "As the head of the Church, I cannot answer you otherwise: The Jєωs have not recognized Our Lord; therefore we cannot recognize the Jєωιѕн people." -Pope St. Pius X

    "No Jєω adores God! Who say so?  The Son of God say so."


    Offline Columba

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #26 on: April 24, 2015, 02:56:21 PM »
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  • Quote from: Matto
    Quote from: Columba
    Why is everyone being so hard are poor Michael Voris?

    I think it is because he attacks traditional Catholics instead of Bergoglio.

    And which group of traditional Catholics does not also attack fellow trads?

    Offline Columba

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #27 on: April 24, 2015, 03:11:23 PM »
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  • Quote from: Charlemagne
    Quote from: Columba
    Why is everyone being so hard are poor Michael Voris? Someone even implied he is effeminate which is ridiculous.


    That would be me, and I didn't imply it, I stated it. Any man who wears pink and looks as though he uses a blow-comb and mousse every morning certainly comes across as effeminate...at least to me.

    He comes from a commercial broadcasting background. That is why he knows the broadcasting business so well. He doesn't seem any more gussied up than the typical news guy--probably wears make-up as well. I don't do that but then I am only typing from behind and anonymous keyboard. Doing what he does takes real courage and I think that more than compensates for his unfortunate adherence to the metrosɛҳuąƖ conventions of his trade.

    His job, properly understood, is not to defend traddies but to defend the Faith. He can be faulted for attacking trads but no more than any other member of the circular firing squad we all inhabit.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #28 on: April 24, 2015, 03:19:26 PM »
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  • Quote from: Columba
    Quote from: Charlemagne
    Quote from: Columba
    Why is everyone being so hard are poor Michael Voris? Someone even implied he is effeminate which is ridiculous.


    That would be me, and I didn't imply it, I stated it. Any man who wears pink and looks as though he uses a blow-comb and mousse every morning certainly comes across as effeminate...at least to me.

    He comes from a commercial broadcasting background. That is why he knows the broadcasting business so well. He doesn't seem any more gussied up than the typical news guy--probably wears make-up as well. I don't do that but then I am only typing from behind and anonymous keyboard. Doing what he does takes real courage and I think that more than compensates for his unfortunate adherence to the metrosɛҳuąƖ conventions of his trade.

    His job, properly understood, is not to defend traddies but to defend the Faith. He can be faulted for attacking trads but no more than any other member of the circular firing squad we all inhabit.


    Women have no gαy-dar whatsoever; they're clueless.

    Offline Columba

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    SSPX are Vision chasers according to Voris.
    « Reply #29 on: April 24, 2015, 03:28:41 PM »
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  • Quote from: wallflower
    Haha, soft, medium and hard R&R. Never thought of it that way. Sigh. I know we need vocabulary and labels to express ideas and keep them clear, but it sure is getting more and more complicated. God help us.

    You really have to keep a scorecard. Those looking into Tradition often become bewildered by the inside-baseball discussions.