Catholic Info
Traditional Catholic Faith => General Discussion => Topic started by: jman123 on November 22, 2013, 06:17:38 PM
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Is this something that, under the right conditions, lead to the Reign of Christ the King?
http://rt.com/politics/russian-orthodox-constitution-religion-150/
Center left MP Yelena Mizulina, known for her pro-life stance and conflicts with leaders of the LGBT community, has suggested amending the constitution emphasizing the exclusive role of the Russian Orthodox Church.
Mizulina said at the Friday session of the parliamentary group for the protection of Christian values, that the Russian constitution should include a preamble saying that “Orthodox Christianity is the basis of national and cultural originality of Russia”.
The move gained support from other participants in the session who represented the majority caucus of United Russia and the Communist Party caucus.
Currently the Constitution describes Russia as a secular state and protects freedom of conscience. Four religions – Christianity, Islam, Judaism and Buddhism are sometimes called ‘traditional’ in the mass media and politicians’ statements, but there is no legal basis for that.
In 2012 nationalist lawmaker Sergey Baburin also suggested mentioning Christianity in Russia’s constitution. Baburin said the country could follow Georgia’s example and underline the Church’s role in the nation’s history while still protecting the equality and freedom of all beliefs. Back then, the move failed to gain sufficient support.
According to a poll conducted by the Levada research center in late October this year, over 70 percent of Russian Federation citizens consider themselves Orthodox Christians. 44 percent of respondents hold the Russian Orthodox faith as the official religion of the country. 56 percent agreed that the Russian Orthodox Church played a major role in Russian history.
Yelena Mizulina represents the moderate leftist party Fair Russia and chairs the Lower House’s Committee for Family Women and Children. Earlier this year the committee developed a concept of the national family policy that stressed the role of a traditional 'nuclear family' and suggested strengthening it by supporting traditional religions.
The concept caused heated discussions and some celebrities and gαy rights activists started posting obscenities about Mizulina on their social network pages and various blogs. In July this year Russia’s Investigative Committee – a federal agency for investigating high-profile crimes – reported that they started a criminal inquiry “into insulting a representative of a state authority” but did not mention the names of any suspects.
In November speech, Mizulina lashed out at surrogacy saying that the practice, along with abortion, would eventually lead to humanity’s extinction. Earlier this year she also suggested making ‘morning after’ pills a prescription drug.
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Russia needs to declare Catholicism as its state religion, not Orthodoxy.
The right condition is that Russia becomes Roman Catholic, not Orthodox.
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What if all of these Christian actions in favor of Orthodoxy that are happening in Russia are actually mere distractions as to NOT evangelize and convert Russia to the only True Catholic Faith and thus, further delay the wishes of Our Lady?
:furtive:
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I can't understand Russophila/Putin admiration amongst certain trads. Have you read about the wars between Catholic Poland and Orthodox Russia throughout the centuries? The wars between the Teutonic Knights and Orthodox Russia? Are you going to ignore their heresies and the bƖσσdshɛd? They almost joined in union with The Commonwealth (Poland/Lithuania) twice. Novgorod was stopped from joining because of Ivan the Terrible's invasion and Russia didn't want to join The Commonwealth in 1612 because of their extreme hate for Catholicism.
Being fond of Russian Orthodoxy is like being fond of protestantism. Don't let their liturgical vestments and basso profondo deceive you.
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What C and S said.
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The draw to Russia and RO (we just had a member leave for RO, btw, which we believe was a mistake), is that Russia is the only superpower with a leader who worships +Jesus (as best as I can tell, the Trinitarian God) FAR MORE APTLY than the current conciliar mess we have in Rome. When compared with the conciliar church, the Russian Orthodox simply win out. I'm sorry; they just do. The conciliar romans are gαy, they rape children, they hate God (beach ball offerings!), they love Islam, they APOLOGIZE for Our Church' ancient and beautiful history, and quite frankly they aren't much more than yet another protestant sect themselves anymore. It's an ugly, hard-to-swallow truth, but that's what the RCC currently IS.
I'm more apt to stick myself in the 19th C, or the Church Universal, and be happy with Catholicism as known through the ages. HOWEVER, THAT CHURCH is no longer part of the visible facades of the Church on earth. That doesn't make me a Russian Orthodox, but it makes me feel a far more kindred spirit towards the Russian Orthodox than to towards the RCC (Roman Child Conquerors).
I've missed theocracies, and would love to see them come back in fashion. We've had some (Islam cult) theocracies, but we really haven't had any sort of "Christ-based" theocracy for a LONG time. That's pretty hard to root against.
The thought of FRANK, beach ball offerer and clown-nose pompous "entertainer", trying to consecrate even a SHOE is laughable; PM Putin might be amused by any such gesture, but something tells me Our Lady of Fatima is handling this for herself since SHE was completely disobeyed in the most offensive ways by the last 8 guys (including Frank) who were supposedly vicar of her most Holy Son.
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God used the Roman Empire (idol worshippers) as the civil government under which He spread the faith. We never know what God's plans are, we can never know what He is up to. That Russia declares Orthodoxy the state religion is a step, in the right direction. That is all it is. God is in control.
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Imperium Romanum Sacrum
Later
Imperium Romanum Sacrum Nationis Germanicæ
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That's nice. Will Catholicism still remain the only religion officially banned by the Russian government? Just asking.
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What C and S said.
Yeah. Me, too.
Wouldn't a Greek Catholic Ukraine be the more likely candidate for a much sought-after by American Trad Catholic Restoration from-the-East? There's a real sense of revival in Ukr. whereas in Russia they sure do like to talk an awful lot about it. More and more the schismatic bishops in Ukr. are warming the the RCC. Heck, St. Josaphat's feast is celebrated in some Orthodox regions! More hope of Union there than in Russia, though I don't think Russia is totally hopeless.
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God used the Roman Empire (idol worshippers) as the civil government under which He spread the faith. We never know what God's plans are, we can never know what He is up to. That Russia declares Orthodoxy the state religion is a step, in the right direction. That is all it is. God is in control.
I get what you're saying, but wasn't Orthodoxy [patent pending] declared the state religion by the Soviets? I don't think Catholics in the region experienced much of a revival back then.
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The ROC was ridiculed by the Soviets; the buildings the revolutionaries took became government buildings and raped of anything God-related; Lenin was an avowed atheist, and the sick propaganda called all miracles "tricks" of the priests to keep the tzars in power.
And then things got ugly.
That's why it was so shocking to see Putin in front of a finally-restored ROC church, and promising to beautify more churches, and let the ROC take care of their own affairs. Putin and Kirill (? head honcho for ROC) is appealing to Russians to grab their religion back. Putin said something like, the USSR was doomed because they turned on God.
The West sees this and imagines Crusaders (I've heard that term bandied about) pouring out of Russia and crusading the world, and of course the West denies God openly; but IN THIS CASE (where Soviet Russians had proudly denied God for a century), to see the state and church leaders APPEAL to Russians that their forebears were Christian and far more blessed than the Bolsheviks had them believe, well, that's a HUGE positive.
Also, RCC and other Catholics have a presence in Russia; they're not banned. But Putin has made a point of limiting ѕуηαgσgυєs and mosques, saying that they "proselytize" too much. Putin has NOT made that claim against Christians (including, ...Baptists. I wouldn't mind a little tamping down of the charismatic-types, but it's not my business.)
I just saw this picture from today on twitter. I guess it proves, "nobody's perfect."
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BZ79af7CAAAt2Zn.jpg)
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A sermon by Metropolitan Andrey Sheptytsky (1865-1944) - a candidate for sainthood in the Catholic Church - was added to Russia's Federal List of Extremist Materials on 4 October (No. 2087). Its distribution is consequently banned across Russia and possession of it renders the possessor liable to criminal prosecution.
Republished in 1990 in the Polish city of Lublin, the banned edition of Sheptytsky's "The True Faith" ["Pravdiva Vira"] was among 16 Ukrainian-language texts ruled "extremist" by Moscow's Meshchansky District Court on 14 March 2013. The other 15 texts – which were not written by Sheptytsky - appear to be secular Ukrainian nationalist works, with titles such as "The Ukrainian National Idea" and "Ukrainian Liberation Concept".
From 1901 until his death, Sheptytsky headed the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church, which resembles the Orthodox Church but recognises the Pope. The Metropolitan is particularly revered by Greek Catholics around the world. For example, the Ottawa, Canada-based Metropolitan Andrey Sheptytsky Institute of Eastern Christian Studies was named in his honour. Its website notes his attempts to improve Catholic-Orthodox relations among many other examples of "heroic virtue". Sheptytsky was in October honoured by the Anti-Defamation League for protecting Jєωs from the h0Ɩ0cαųst, by supplying false identification papers and shelter from the nαzιs, at a time when such acts were punishable by death.
The now banned edition of "The True Faith", which Forum 18 has seen, is a sermon Sheptytsky gave in 1900 to Greek Catholics in Bukovina Region, now partly in western Ukraine. Unlike the titles of the other 15 Ukrainian texts simultaneously ruled "extremist", however, the sermon's focus is on faith rather than nation. Insisting that "Christ's Church has to be a transnational institution," for example, Sheptytsky warns that anyone who wishes to turn it "into a number of purely national institutions is forgetting about the Church's divine foundation and not understanding it in a Christian way".
For the most part, the Metropolitan urges his audience to uphold the Catholic faith: "We Ukrainians are filled with love for the Catholic Church, we always saw her as our own mother." He argues that the Catholic Church is the true Church due to its papacy, claiming that this is inherited from St Peter: "Christ gave supreme authority to Peter and all his heirs (..) In other words, the Pope of Rome is recognised as the visible head of the Church."
Sheptytsky nowhere criticises other religious communities, however, let alone expresses hatred or advocate violence. He refers to non-Catholic beliefs only when considering if non-Catholics might obtain salvation. Here, he suggests people unfamiliar with the Catholic faith and "who live in another faith, observing all its prescriptions, purely and sincerely convinced that this other faith is true, may also be saved by the love of Jesus Christ." While Sheptytsky adds that an atheist "who knows the true faith but does not hold to it will not be saved," he does not call for any action against atheists.
The freedom to make claims about the relative merits of religious or non-religious views is a central part of freedom of religion or belief. Confusion between claiming the superiority of particular views and claiming the superiority of particular people is made in every attempt to ban religious "extremist" literature in Russia with which Forum 18 is familiar (see Forum 18's "extremism" Russia religious freedom survey http://www.forum18.org/archive.php?article_id=1724).
Ten-minute hearing
It remains unclear why "The True Faith" was ruled "extremist". Records on the website of Meshchansky District Court show that Judge Maria Kudryavtseva heard 18 civil cases in succession on the afternoon of 14 March 2013, devoting just 10 minutes to each one. She found in the state's favour in all but one case, where the plaintiff did not turn up. All were filed "in the interests of an undetermined group of people" by Meshchansky Interdistrict Public Prosecutor on 9 January. Written rulings were produced between 14 and 22 March, but are not available on the website.
The records do not reveal the nature or content of the cases, and it is unclear why there are 17 rulings when the Federal List has only 16 matching titles.
The 14 March rulings all determine printed materials "extremist", a spokesperson at Meshchansky District Court confirmed to Forum 18 on 20 November. She declined to comment further, however, remarking only that, "The text of those rulings – of that category of case – may not be published."
Reached on 22 November, a spokesperson for Meshchansky Interdistrict Public Prosecutor asked, "And what do you want from us?" when Forum 18 began by noting that the Prosecutor was plaintiff in cases determining printed materials "extremist" at Meshchansky District Court on 14 March. When Forum 18 went on to ask why the Ukrainian text "The True Faith" was ruled "extremist", however, she maintained that she could not hear what was being said and put the phone down. Subsequent calls went unanswered.
Protestant "extremism"?
In the asbestos-mining town of Asbest (Sverdlovsk Region), Pentecostal pensioner Petr Tkalich is under investigation for "incitement of hatred [nenavist] or enmity [vrazhda], as well as the humiliation of human dignity" (Criminal Code, Article 282, Part 1), he told Forum 18 on 27 August. Tkalich is a member of Rock of Salvation Pentecostal Church, whose parent congregation came under pressure from the Asbest authorities in the early 2000s (see F18News 2 August 2004 http://www.forum18.org/archive.php?article_id=383).
Tkalich told Forum 18 that the investigation is due to "Boiling Pot", a two-part article criticising the Russian Orthodox Church (Moscow Patriarchate) that he wrote on his blog in 2006. The investigation was opened in late July 2013, Tkalich recalled, after his home was searched and computer equipment seized by law enforcement agents on 21 May. An "expert" analysis of the article as found on this equipment continues, he added, and will possibly not be completed until 2014.
"Expert analyses" commissioned by the prosecution in such cases often contain numerous flaws (see eg. F18News 28 February 2013 http://www.forum18.org/archive.php?article_id=1808).
http://www.forum18.org/archive.php?article_id=1899
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That's nice. Will Catholicism still remain the only religion officially banned by the Russian government? Just asking.
How is Catholicism "banned" in Russia? Proof, please.
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I just saw this picture from today on twitter. I guess it proves, "nobody's perfect."
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BZ79af7CAAAt2Zn.jpg)
But what prompted Putin to share with Pope Francis a public reverence for the Blessed Virgin? Shrewdness, earnestness? Either way, I think the significance has been lost on most people.
I wonder sometimes if men like Kirill are aware of Catholic tradition.
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Russia needs to declare Catholicism as its state religion, not Orthodoxy.
The right condition is that Russia becomes Roman Catholic, not Orthodox.
I know -- how about Russia becomes officially Orthodox and then the Patriarch and all his bishops consecrate Rome to the Immaculate Heart of Mary???
Sound like a plan?
Then, when the Vatican gets the grace of CONVERSION, then guess what........???!!!
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That's nice. Will Catholicism still remain the only religion officially banned by the Russian government? Just asking.
How is Catholicism "banned" in Russia? Proof, please.
As of a few years ago, there was a new law in Russia that requires all religious groups to get a LICENSE from the government, or else they would be breaking the law by practicing without a license. The one that the Catholic priests could get said that it expires in 3 months. So it effectively became impossible for any Catholic priest to establish a parish or a chapel or a regular Mass anywhere in Russia, because one of the criteria they use to renew a license is to make sure that no real progress has been made in evangelizing the people or in practicing the Faith. Consequently, any real efforts to build up a chapel with regular attendees and the sacraments and Mass every day or every so often, would be seen as unacceptable progress being made and grounds to DENY the renewal of the license every 3 months.
I don't have any references, this is just what I read, about 4 or 5 years ago somewhere.
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