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Author Topic: Question for Geocentrists  (Read 6127 times)

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Offline cassini

Re: Question for Geocentrists
« Reply #45 on: August 08, 2019, 05:21:21 AM »
Quote from: apollo on August 07, 2019, 05:46:38 PM
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Here is the video which debunks the Tycho Brahe model of Geocentrism.
IT ALSO DEBUNKS the model of ROBERT SUNGENIS.
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Yes, I know it's the most stupid video that you will ever see, so you don't
have to say that.  Just skip that statement and proceed with your scientific
explanation about how the video is wrong.

Just in case any others watch this video and think it proves anything, I watched it and heard the 'MASS of stars' used to prove something. Masss of course is Neweton's theory, yes theory, not law. I continued to hear about  'the Laws of physics.' Now whose 'laws' did it follow? Newton's, la Sage's, Descartes's or Einstein's? Anyone who uses theories to prove or disprove anything is 'B....X.'

Finally, and I know I am saying this too often, nobody claims to prove geocentrism or heliocentrism, for the order of the universe cannot be proved by man. We take God's word that what we see every day, every year is a fact.

Let me end with St Augustine on Genesis and his geocentrism:

‘It not infrequently happens that something about the Earth, about the sky, about other elements of this world, about the motion and rotation or even the magnitude and distances of the stars, about definite eclipses of the sun and moon. . . . and of other such things, may be known with the greatest certainty by reasoning or by experience, even by one who is not a Christian. It is too disgraceful and ruinous, and greatly to be avoided, that he should hear a Christian speaking so idiotically on these matters,[heliocentrism]  and as if in accord with Christian writings, that he might say that he could scarcely keep from laughing when he saw how totally in error they are” (St. Augustine, The Literal Interpretation of Genesis 1:19–20, Ch. 19).
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Offline apollo

Re: Question for Geocentrists
« Reply #46 on: August 08, 2019, 08:48:11 AM »
Quote from: Ladislaus on August 07, 2019, 06:12:55 PM
:facepalm:
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That pretty much sums up your arguments against Heliocentrism.
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I keep hoping that you will find one argument, but you never do.
99% of your responses are calling me names, acting shocked,
judging my internal spiritual state, etc.
.
The other 1% are LIES about the Catholic Faith and the Bible.
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You seem to think that because you have 17,000 replies at CathInfo
that makes you the god of CathInfo.
.
:facepalm: :facepalm:
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Offline apollo

Re: Question for Geocentrists
« Reply #47 on: August 08, 2019, 09:17:24 AM »
Quote from: cassini on August 08, 2019, 05:21:21 AM
Just in case any others watch this video and think it proves anything, I watched it [and I cannot understnad it] and heard the 'MASS of stars' used to prove something. Mass of course is Neweton's theory, yes theory, not law [because
it completely blows away Geocentrism]. I continued to hear about  'the Laws of physics.' Now whose 'laws' did it follow? Newton's, la Sage's, Descartes's or Einstein's? Anyone who uses theories [i.e. math that I cannot understand] to prove or disprove anything is 'B....X. [Beyond my intellectual level]'

Finally, and I know I am saying this too often, nobody [i.e. none of the Geocentrists] claims to prove geocentrism or heliocentrism [because they cannot do math], for the order of the universe cannot be proved by man [who believe in
Geocentrism]. We take God's word that what we see every day, every year is a fact [i.e. the rotation of the Earth].
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That's what I thought.  You did not understand the video.
.
You cannot understand the mathematics of astronomy,
so you call them theories. 
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Then you say it's all theory, Geocentrism and Heliocentrism.
Nobody can prove anything. 
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You mean Cassini cannot prove anything. 
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Therefore we have to rely on the Church Fathers whose
judgments about astronomy were unanimous, blah, blah, blah.
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And Pope Pius VII was a heretic, says Dr Cassini (doctor of the
Church, higher than the Pope).
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Dr Cassini says 2+2 = 4 is a theory and cannot be proven,
especially cannot be proven by Cassini. 
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I'm still waiting for you to find something wrong with the video,
something scientifically wrong or even mathematically wrong.
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Of course, since Dr Cassini cannot do mathematics, then nobody
can do it and it's all theory.
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But the Church Fathers define Church doctrines by their VOTE.
Maybe they should have voted on cell phones and made that a
Church doctrine.
.
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Offline apollo

Re: Question for Geocentrists
« Reply #48 on: August 08, 2019, 11:43:17 AM »
Quote from: cassini on August 08, 2019, 05:21:21 AM
Let me end with St Augustine on Genesis and his geocentrism:

‘It not infrequently happens that something about the Earth, about the sky, about other elements of this world, about the motion and rotation or even the magnitude and distances of the stars, about definite eclipses of the sun and moon. . . . and of other such things, may be known with the greatest certainty by reasoning or by experience, even by one who is not a Christian. It is too disgraceful and ruinous, and greatly to be avoided, that he should hear a Christian speaking so idiotically on these matters,[heliocentrism]  and as if in accord with Christian writings, that he might say that he could scarcely keep from laughing when he saw how totally in error they are”
(St. Augustine, The Literal Interpretation of Genesis 1:19–20, Ch. 19).
.
Here is the actual quote from St Augustine. 
.
"It not infrequently happens that something about the earth, about the sky, about other elements of this world, about the motion and rotation or even the magnitude and distances of the stars, about definite eclipses of the sun and moon, about the passage of years and seasons, about the nature of animals, of fruits, of stones, and of other such things, may be known with the greatest certainty by reasoning or by experience, even by one who is not a Christian.
.
It is too disgraceful and ruinous, though, and greatly to be avoided, that he [the non-Christian] should hear a Christian speaking so idiotically on these matters, and as if in accord with Christian writings, that he might say that he could scarcely keep from laughing when he saw how totally in error they are.
.
In view of this and in keeping it in mind constantly while dealing with the book of Genesis, I have, insofar as I was able, explained in detail and set forth for consideration the meanings of obscure passages, taking care not to affirm rashly some one meaning to the prejudice of another and perhaps better explanation.[2]"
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Cassini, you lied again.  You called it Augustine's Geocentrism and inserted the word [Heliocentrism] into the quote.
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The quote could apply equally to Geocentrism or Heliocentrism.
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Here is another quote from Pope Leo XIII ...
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"The unshrinking defence of the Holy Scripture, however, does not require that we should equally uphold all the opinions which each of the Fathers or the more recent interpreters have put forth in explaining it; for it may be that, in commenting on passages where physical matters occur, they have sometimes expressed the ideas of their own times, and thus made statements which in these days have been abandoned as incorrect"
(Pope Leo XIII, Providentissimus Deus §19)
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Here is another quote from Robert Sungenis ...
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"It is the divine origin of a particular doctrine that makes the doctrine a requirement of belief for salvation, not the majority or common opinion of the Fathers ..."
(Bob Sungenis, The Epistles of Romans and James, p. 440).
.

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Offline cassini

Re: Question for Geocentrists
« Reply #49 on: August 08, 2019, 01:12:57 PM »
Nonbelievers:
'This because their intellects have never been presented with truth itself as a concept, something the mind can apprehend. Their field of vision has been so narrowed to just the sensible here-and-now world that if they can’t touch it, see it, taste it or hear it, they don’t believe.' ---Voris.

“And in all seduction of iniquity to them that perish; because they receive not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. Therefore God shall send them the operation of error, to believe lying: That all may be judged who have not believed the truth, but have consented to iniquity.” --- (2 Thes 10)

‘But all men are vain, in whom there is not the knowledge of God: and who by these good things that are seen, could not understand him that is, neither by attending to the works have acknowledged who was the workman: But have imagined either the fire, or the wind, or the swift air, or the circle of the stars, or the great water, or the sun and moon, to be the gods that rule the world. With whose beauty, if they, being delighted, took them to be gods: let them know how much the Lord of them is more beautiful than they: for the first author of beauty made all those things. Or if they admired their power and their effects, let them understand by them, that he that made them, is mightier than they: For by the greatness of the beauty, and of the creature, the creator of them may be seen, so as to be known thereby.’ (Wisdom 13)

'But the fool on the hill
 Sees the sun going down
 And the eyes in his head
 See the world spinning 'round.’
---Beatles song.

‘Put on the armour of God that you may be able to stand up to the wiles of the devil. For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood, but against the Principalities and Powers, against the spiritual forces of wickedness on high.’ --- St Paul (Eph, ch.6, 10-12.)

‘For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against the ungodliness and wickedness of those men who in wickedness hold back the truth of God, seeing that what may be known about God is manifest to them. For God has manifested it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen – His everlasting power also and divinity - being understood through the things that are made. And so they are without excuse, seeing that, although they knew God they did not glorify Him as God or give him thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless minds have been darkened. For while professing to be wise, they have become fools, and they have changed the glory of the incorruptible God for an image made like to corruptible man and to birds and four-footed beasts and creeping things.’ --- St Paul’s Letter to the Romans, (Ch.1:18-23)
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