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Traditional Catholic Faith => General Discussion => Topic started by: Incredulous on June 09, 2019, 08:34:44 PM

Title: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 09, 2019, 08:34:44 PM

Interestingly, the US media blamed the Pope's death on the Pope himself, for not taking care of his health?

But Eugene Cardinal Tisserant's diaries, said otherwise.  
After his death, the Vatican would come to claim his diaries and personal archives.

Note: Vitamin B "injections" were popular in the 1930s


(https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.rarenewspapers.com%2Febayimgs%2F1.95.2015%2Fimage081.jpg&f=1)

Death(http://data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIABAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAEALAAAAAABAAEAQAICTAEAOw%3D%3D) (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_Pius_XI?action=edit&section=10)
Pope Pius XI, who had been in declining health for some years, died on 10 February, 1939 (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/1939)

Rumours he was murdered
(http://data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIABAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAEALAAAAAABAAEAQAICTAEAOw%3D%3D) (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_Pius_XI?action=edit&section=11)
A prominent French cardinal, Eugene Cardinal Tisserant, made a sensational claim in his personal diary. Pius XI had been scheduled to deliver a blunt strongly worded address attacking fascism and anti-semitism on February 11 (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/February_11), 1939. According to Tisserant, twenty-four hours before delivering this address, the Pope was given an injection by Dr. Francesco Petacci, who worked as the medical practitioner for the Vatican, and whose daughter was the long-term mistress of the fascist dictator Benito Mussolini. As a result of the injection, the Pope supposedly died hours before delivering his historic attack on Mussolini and European fascism.
While it is known that Pius XI was planning to deliver a major attack on fascism in a speech to cardinals, and the text of the speech disappeared after his death, the claim that he was killed by Mussolini's mistress's father, to stop him attacking fascism in general and Mussolini in particular is not widely believed.

Whereabouts of the anti-fascist speech(http://data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIABAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAEALAAAAAABAAEAQAICTAEAOw%3D%3D) (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_Pius_XI?action=edit&section=12)

The whereabouts of his draft speech remains a mystery, though papal policy traditionally dictated that planned policies and proposed speeches not executed at the moment of a Pope's death lapse automatically. It is possible that the speech was misfiled within the vast Vatican Archives after his death, that it became lost among the move of all his private papers from the Papal Apartments, or that some curial official, as has been done in past papacies, simply incinerated all draft speeches, undelivered speeches and uncompleted documents of the late pontiff.

Such destruction had been carried out in the past for fear that a new Pope could be pressured into following the policies of his predecessor, were some of the late Pope's plans to be made public by late Pope's supporters if they thought that the new Pope "would not be true to the memory of the late Holy Father". Confusion over the private papers of dead Popes is a regular occurrence. The whereabouts of the wills of Pope Paul VI (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_Paul_VI) (1963–78 and Pope John Paul I (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_John_Paul_I) (1978, and the whereabouts of documents associated with Pope Pius XII (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_Pius_XII) and Pope John Paul II (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_John_Paul_II) (1978–2005) became a cause of controversy immediately after their death.

Link 1 (https://christianity.fandom.com/wiki/Pope_Pius_XI)

Link 2 (https://www.nytimes.com/1972/06/12/archives/cardinals-notes-cause-a-dispute-vatican-and-tisserants-heir-clash.html)

Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 09, 2019, 10:41:37 PM
I am not sure how this is relevant but wasn't it later discovered that Tisserant was FMason? I don't believe that Pius XI was murdered-- apparently it is God's will that that the speech be suppressed. :cheers:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 10, 2019, 08:16:41 AM


I'd like to learn more about Card. Tisserant's connections to freemasonry?  
Do you think he lied to himself in his diary to plant false information?

According to historical Catholic analysis, WWII started precisely on January 26th, 1938 over a year before Pope Pius XI died.

This is supported by Our Lady of Fatima's warning about the Red Light, like a knife over Europe. Red light world sightings (http://www.solarstorms.org/SS1938.html)

It's further supported by the January, 26, 1926 Stalinist police interrogation of a founder of the "Communist International", Christian G. Rakovsky, who laid bare the plot for Jewish banker world tyranny: Red Symphony (https://www.savethemales.ca/000275.html)

Considering the massive judeo-masonic plots underfoot, knocking-off the "Librarian Pope" was no big deal.

So Pius XI's death was God's Will and so was the aftermath.

The enemies of Christ needed full Vatican access and they had a man who'd help their own and start to let them in.

(https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-JbE2FJtLMVI%2FUTrbyQY_7xI%2FAAAAAAAADUo%2FRNtXamMPr08%2Fs1600%2FpiusXII.jpg&f=1)

It's a very sad fact Roscoe.






Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Ladislaus on June 10, 2019, 08:34:09 AM
Tisserant was instrumental in forcing Siri to step down and installing Roncalli.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Ladislaus on June 10, 2019, 08:35:45 AM
I am not sure how this is relevant but wasn't it later discovered that Tisserant was FMason? I don't believe that Pius XI was murdered-- apparently it is God's will that that the speech be suppressed. :cheers:

Whether or not he was murdered, it was evidently God's will that the speech not be delivered.  Might we speculate that it was the "condemnation of" putative "anti-Semitism" that God did not want delivered to the world?
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 10, 2019, 08:47:03 AM
Tisserant was instrumental in forcing Siri to step down and installing Roncalli.

A huge contribution to the judeo-masonic plot against the Church.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 10, 2019, 11:27:38 AM

I'd like to learn more about Card. Tisserant's connections to freemasonry?  
Do you think he lied to himself in his diary to plant false information?

According to historical Catholic analysis, WWII started precisely on January 26th, 1938 over a year before Pope Pius XI died.

This is supported by Our Lady of Fatima's warning about the Red Light, like a knife over Europe. Red light world sightings (http://www.solarstorms.org/SS1938.html)

It's further supported by the January, 26, 1926 Stalinist police interrogation of a founder of the "Communist International", Christian G. Rakovsky, who laid bare the plot for Jewish banker world tyranny: Red Symphony (https://www.savethemales.ca/000275.html)

Considering the massive judeo-masonic plots underfoot, knocking-off the "Librarian Pope" was no big deal.

So Pius XI's death was God's Will and so was the aftermath.

The enemies of Christ needed full Vatican access and they had a man who'd help their own and start to let them in.

(https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-JbE2FJtLMVI%2FUTrbyQY_7xI%2FAAAAAAAADUo%2FRNtXamMPr08%2Fs1600%2FpiusXII.jpg&f=1)

It's a very sad fact Roscoe.
The sooner you figure out that Mrs martinez is full of crap, the better off you will be.. :fryingpan:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Quo vadis Domine on June 10, 2019, 05:31:33 PM
The sooner you figure out that Mrs martinez is full of crap, the better off you will be.. :fryingpan:
This awful woman, in her book; The Undermining of the Catholic Church, accused the Venerable Pope Pius IX of being a Freemason. 
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Quo vadis Domine on June 10, 2019, 05:38:27 PM
Tisserant was instrumental in forcing Siri to step down and installing Roncalli.
Tisserant also consecrated the evil Montini.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 10, 2019, 07:48:04 PM
This awful woman, in her book; The Undermining of the Catholic Church, accused the Venerable Pope Pius IX of being a Freemason.
She has also swallowed the Card Rampolla( ordained by Pius IX) Freemason OTO shinola,
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: monka966 on June 11, 2019, 06:23:21 AM
Slightly off topic here, but I read somewhere (it might have been on this forum) that Pope St. Pius X was also murdered? Any information on this topic would be much appreciated.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Quo vadis Domine on June 11, 2019, 06:28:13 AM
Slightly off topic here, but I read somewhere (it might have been on this forum) that Pope St. Pius X was also murdered? Any information on this topic would be much appreciated.
See post number 10 here: https://www.cathinfo.com/profile/?area=showposts;u=2408 (https://www.cathinfo.com/profile/?area=showposts;u=2408)
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 11, 2019, 11:21:56 AM
Slightly off topic here, but I read somewhere (it might have been on this forum) that Pope St. Pius X was also murdered? Any information on this topic would be much appreciated.
This is the first time I have heard that one. I seriously doubt it. & btw-- there is no truth to the allegation that Jesuits( :sleep:) murdered Clement XIII(or XIV) for that matter.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: songbird on June 11, 2019, 11:47:08 AM
I find the book, "The Plot against the Church", by Maurice Pinay would be of interest in this area.  The author points out all the hurt and pain, destruction of the church by the Jews, under cover, pretenders.  How the Church had Papal Bulls, sermons, lectures, Encyclicals, and Canon Laws made to Protect and defend Holy Mother Church.  

After awhile, the reader will wonder, when does the Church finally stop instructing about the dangers of the Jews?  For, it was, by Canon Law, if any protect the Jews, support the Jews, Catholic Clergy would be desposed and layman excommunicated.

It was answered on page 433.  Pius X had Cardinal Gasparri, edit the Codex, so that there would be no more punishment for Jew or those supporting Jews. Under Pius XI, there were Jew friendly association of clergy whose heretical theses were only the prelude for that of present day priests and church dignitaries in the service the Synagogue of Satan.

This really excited me, in the sense that I want truth!  I want to know how it is, we say little or nothing about our major enemy on this earth, Jews.  How they managed to infiltrate and make their goals.

To me, it is a sin not to mention who are enemy is.  We need to instruct and educate our generations to this.  
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: songbird on June 11, 2019, 11:49:28 AM
Pius X , had a committee set up for the       edit codex change, but Pope X did not work out the codex himself.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 11, 2019, 01:11:27 PM
Pius X , had a committee set up for the edit codex change, but Pope X did not work out the codex himself.

Well, I agree with your view, that Catholics must be armed with instruction on the Church's enemies.

I had heard Card. Rampolla actually destroyed many Church documents on the jews. That would help explain the loss of knowledge.

Not that I trust jew-Wiki, but a quick search shows he lived for 10 years after the Conclave and
was a Vatican Archivist/Librarian, giving him access to such documents.  
Later years
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/d/d8/Rampolla_1913.jpg/170px-Rampolla_1913.jpg) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Rampolla_1913.jpg)
Cardinal Rampolla at age 70 shortly before his death

Pius X chose Rafael Merry del Val (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rafael_Merry_del_Val) to succeed Rampolla as Secretary of State. Rampolla remained Arch-Priest of Saint Peter's[7] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariano_Rampolla#cite_note-De_Waal_30-11) Between 1908 and his death in 1913, Rampolla served as Secretary (then the head) of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congregation_for_the_Doctrine_of_the_Faith). In 1912, Pope Pius X appointed Rampolla Archivist and Librarian of the Holy Roman Church (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vatican_Secret_Archives) as well, a position he held until his death. He continued to be viewed as a likely successor to Pope Pius X in case of the pontiff's death.

Rampolla died suddenly in Rome on 16 December 1913 at age seventy, some months before the pope died in August 1914.[9] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariano_Rampolla#cite_note-14) He was buried in the Campo Verano (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campo_Verano) Cemetery near the Basilica of San Lorenzo fuori le Mura (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Lorenzo_fuori_le_Mura). His friend and closest collaborator, Giacomo della Chiesa, the future Pope Benedict XV (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XV), presided over his funeral ceremonies. On 19 June 1929, twelve days after the Italian Parliament ratified the Lateran Treaty (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lateran_Treaty), the body.

This requires more research... and I'm sure Roscoe will want to volunteer to do it :jester:

Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: King Wenceslas on June 11, 2019, 02:05:41 PM
From what I have heard that every pope from Pius XI to JPI was murdered. JPII was the first one not murdered.

Generally the doctors send them off with a shot of some kind. All for his health of course. "Here this won't hurt at all." The P2 lodge is very powerful inside the Vatican state.

Rampolla was said to have brought the lodge into the Vatican.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 11, 2019, 02:51:17 PM
i hope no one is dumb enough to believe the Card Rampolla OTO libel... :pray:

Incredulous- where exactly  did you "hear' that Rampolla 'destroyed many Church documents on Joos?

King W-- where exactly did you learn that " Rampolla was said to have brought the lodge into the Vatican?
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 12, 2019, 01:42:04 PM
i hope no one is dumb enough to believe the Card Rampolla OTO libel... :pray:

Incredulous- where exactly  did you "hear' that Rampolla 'destroyed many Church documents on Joos?

King W-- where exactly did you learn that " Rampolla was said to have brought the lodge into the Vatican?

Roscoe,

"How do we know?  Where did we hear?  How did we learn?"


Here is the "game plan" for judeo-masonic infiltration.


(https://duckduckgo.com/i/ff7c64d1.jpg)
The Permanent Instruction of the Alta Vendita is a document, originally published in Italian in 1859,
produced by the highest lodge of the Italian Carbonari and written by "Piccolo Tigre".
According to George F. Dillon, it was the pseudonym of a Jewish Freemason


Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 12, 2019, 11:12:35 PM

Roscoe,

Here's a link on Padre Pio, with some pretty hairy information on Card. Rampolla.

Padre Pio's missing body (http://padrepioandchiesaviva.com/uploads/Segreto_TV_dossier_bassa_en.pdf)
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 13, 2019, 11:40:58 AM
I trust Pope St Pius X, Pope Leo XIII, Card Merry Del Val, Card De Lai etc( all of whom you apparently think are idiots or worse)  for the truth b4 I trust You, Vennari or ANYONE ELSE. :cheers:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Alexandria on June 13, 2019, 12:07:09 PM
This is very intriguing. 

And I find it very plausible that Pius XI could have been murdered so as not to deliver that speech.

Incredulous, who keeps down-voting you and why?
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 13, 2019, 02:45:50 PM
It should also be noted that there is no mention of Card Rampolla in Alta Vendita. And if there was i wouldn't believe it... :sleep:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Pax Vobis on June 13, 2019, 05:02:43 PM
Cardinal Rampolla was vetoed as pope by Emperor Franz Joseph.  Red flag no 1.
Cardinal Rampolla was removed from the Curia during St Pius X's pontificate.  Red flag no 2.
Cardinal Rampolla was thought to be a freemason or have strong connections, if he wasn't specifically a member.  Red flag no 3. 
.
See this thread:
https://www.cathinfo.com/the-library/cardinal-rampolla-was-a-freemason-by-the-abbe-francesco-ricossa/ (https://www.cathinfo.com/the-library/cardinal-rampolla-was-a-freemason-by-the-abbe-francesco-ricossa/)
.
Cardinal Gasparri was a disciple of Rampolla.  Red flag no 1.
Cardinal Gasparri made false accuasations against St Pius X regarding the "Sodalitum Pianum" (organization used to identify modernists).  Red flag no 2.
I'm sure there's more, but I don't care enough to research.
.
The bottomline is that St Pius X did as much as any man, any SINGLE man, could do to stop modernism/communism.  But often he acted alone.  As he famously said:
"De gentibus non est vir mecum"  -Among all men that surround me there is no one with me.
.
Let's not imagine that the decade before Fatima in the early 1900s was some mecca of sanctity in rome.  Only a few years earlier, Pope Pius IX was imprisoned and almost killed in the Vatican.  And St Pius X warned that as soon as he died, if there was not vigilance, that modernism would return stronger than ever.  This happened shortly after he died, as he predicted.  Italy has been run by freemasons for over a 150 years.  The Vatican is not immune from such evil influences.  It's a miracle that St Pius X got elected to begin with.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 13, 2019, 05:45:21 PM
Sorry but it is Franz- Joseph( no friend of martyred Franz- Ferdinand) that is FMason-- not Rampolla

Rampolla was not removed from Curia by Pius X-- not true

Pius IX would have ex-communicated F-Joseph but for political reasons similar to why Pius XII didn't ex-communicate  Hitler( who claimed to be Catholic)

:cheers:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Pax Vobis on June 13, 2019, 11:42:12 PM
Quote
Sorry but it is Franz- Joseph( no friend of martyred Franz- Ferdinand) that is FMason-- not Rampolla
Ok, let me get this straight...You say that Emperor Franz Joseph was a freemason and that a freemason stopped Rampolla from being pope so that the future St Pius X would become pope, who was one of freemason's worst enemies?  A freemason helped a rabid anti-freemason cardinal become pope?  That makes absolutely no sense, either historically or rationally.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 13, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
Sorry but it is Franz- Joseph( no friend of martyred Franz- Ferdinand) that is FMason-- not Rampolla

Rampolla was not removed from Curia by Pius X-- not true

Pius IX would have ex-communicated F-Joseph but for political reasons similar to why Pius XII didn't ex-communicate  Hitler( who claimed to be Catholic)

:cheers:


I think the "beer-cheers" emoji means we've overwhelmed him and he wants a truce :cowboy:

Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 14, 2019, 12:06:39 AM
I vote that that the Maria Juanita emoticon be restored to the Forum along w/ the Wine :cheers:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: rum on June 16, 2019, 04:06:42 AM
I've read that Pope Pius X counted Jews as some of his best friends. The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry.

The mistress of Mussolini Incredulous references is not Margherita Sarfatti, another of Mussolini's mistresses.

Quote
Margherita Sarfatti was born Margherita Grassini, in Venice, the daughter of Amedeo Grassini and Emma Levi. Amedeo was a wealthy Jewish lawyer and businessman. He was a fiscal attorney for the Venetian government and a close friend of Giuseppe Melchiorre Sarto, later Pope Pius X. He would later be made a Knight of the Order of the Crown of Italy.[2]
--https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margherita_Sarfatti

I prefer that a canonized pope had had zero Jewish friends.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Quo vadis Domine on June 16, 2019, 04:43:25 AM
I've read that Pope Pius X counted Jews as some of his best friends. The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry.

The mistress of Mussolini Incredulous references is not Margherita Sarfatti, another of Mussolini's mistresses.
--https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margherita_Sarfatti

I prefer that a canonized pope had had zero Jewish friends.
Just because Wikipedia published it doesn’t make it true. The reference is to an article in the Jewish Woman’s Archive which, in turn, doesn’t seem to have a reference. I doubt they were that “close”, but I’m sure he tried to convert him.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: rum on June 16, 2019, 06:44:20 AM
Just because Wikipedia published it doesn’t make it true. The reference is to an article in the Jewish Woman’s Archive which, in turn, doesn’t seem to have a reference. I doubt they were that “close”, but I’m sure he tried to convert him.

Here's another reference, from Sarfatti's book My Fault: Mussolini As I Knew Him
https://tinyurl.com/y4kqsokf

Pope Pius X befriended Grassini because he was anti-socialist. One of my pet peeves with the modern church is the emphasis on battling branches of the Jewish root and not the Jewish root. Keep people talking about all these Jew-created isms. So you have the spectacle of Catholics forming alliances with Jews to battle lesser enemies instead of setting an example and being anti-Jewish. The modern church should have focused solely on the Jews and ignored all these diversions created by Jews to keep gentiles off their scent. All these garbage ideologies have their root in the Jews.

(https://i.imgur.com/A1YVDOn.png)
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 16, 2019, 04:45:48 PM
I've read that Pope Pius X counted Jews as some of his best friends. The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry.

The mistress of Mussolini Incredulous references is not Margherita Sarfatti, another of Mussolini's mistresses.
--https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margherita_Sarfatti

I prefer that a canonized pope had had zero Jewish friends.
This is inaccurate. As opposed to the regal Pope Leo, it was quite easy to get an audience w the genial Pius X-- who would see just about anyone. In spite of this he initially refused to see Herzl( whose son later converted to RCatholic). The Pope only relented when Herzl persisted. Pope then had to tell him  that no help would be coming to Zionista's from Rome. :popcorn:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 16, 2019, 06:37:26 PM
I've read that Pope Pius X counted Jews as some of his best friends. The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry.

The mistress of Mussolini Incredulous references is not Margherita Sarfatti, another of Mussolini's mistresses.
--https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margherita_Sarfatti

I prefer that a canonized pope had had zero Jewish friends.

We should never forget, that we are constantly bombarded by lies.
Saints who have jew-buddies, like JPII are highly questionable saints?

Catholics discount or are ignorant that print media reeks of jewish ghost-writers who are impersonators, otherwise called "ringers".  

They are big in Catholic media too. 
Roy Schoeman the marrano, is an example of an bold ringer, writing untruths about Catholic tradition (e.g., Our Lady of LaSalette).

Jew ghost-writing is a huge industry critical for creating and sustaining myths.

BTW, St. Pope Pius X very diplomatically, shut-down Herzl, the "father of zionism".



Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: poche on June 16, 2019, 11:28:23 PM
Tisserant was instrumental in forcing Siri to step down and installing Roncalli.
Siri was never Pope.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Incredulous on June 16, 2019, 11:40:12 PM
Siri was never Pope.
           (https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fthepopeinred.com%2Fcardinal-siri-dove.jpg&f=1)



Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: poche on June 17, 2019, 12:44:41 AM
I've read that Pope Pius X counted Jews as some of his best friends. The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry.

The mistress of Mussolini Incredulous references is not Margherita Sarfatti, another of Mussolini's mistresses.
--https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margherita_Sarfatti

I prefer that a canonized pope had had zero Jewish friends.
We take our friends as we find them. Where I live there are very few Catholics. In the case of Pope St Pius' friendship with various Jews, this gave him the opportunity for them to learn about the Catholic Faith from a very good teacher. Jesus said, "Go out to all the world and preach the Gospel." It is to us to bring the Catholic Faith to where we find ourselves.    
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: poche on June 17, 2019, 01:37:45 AM
This is inaccurate. As opposed to the regal Pope Leo, it was quite easy to get an audience w the genial Pius X-- who would see just about anyone. In spite of this he initially refused to see Herzl( whose son later converted to RCatholic). The Pope only relented when Herzl persisted. Pope then had to tell him  that no help would be coming to Zionista's from Rome. :popcorn:
That is part of how true ecumenism should be. Be congenial. Be friendly. But at key moments we have to say "no."
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Quo vadis Domine on June 17, 2019, 02:43:18 AM
That is part of how true ecumenism should be. Be congenial. Be friendly. But at key moments we have to say "no."
So you disagree with how the VII “popes” handled ecumenism?
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: rum on June 17, 2019, 05:09:14 AM
This is inaccurate. As opposed to the regal Pope Leo, it was quite easy to get an audience w the genial Pius X-- who would see just about anyone. In spite of this he initially refused to see Herzl( whose son later converted to RCatholic). The Pope only relented when Herzl persisted. Pope then had to tell him  that no help would be coming to Zionista's from Rome. :popcorn:
What's inaccurate in my post? You missed this part?

"The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry."

Hans Herzl's conversion doesn't sound very powerful. He committed suicide and requested to be buried in a Jewish cemetery, and also attended a synagogue before his death:

https://www.jta.org/1930/09/18/archive/hans-herzl-son-of-theodor-herzl-commits-suicide-after-funeral-of-sister-paulina

It's true that Pope Pius X was firm toward Jewry on some points, but he appears to have eschewed the view of many popes and saints that Catholics should have no relationship with them other than for the purpose of trying to convert them. If a Jew shows no sign of not wanting to destroy his inner Jew then he's dangerous company.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: songbird on June 17, 2019, 05:12:22 PM
Read, "The Plot Against the Church" and you will get the correct knowledge of just how the Jews truly are.  Pretenders.  The Fifth column.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 17, 2019, 08:07:02 PM
What's inaccurate in my post? You missed this part?

"The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry."

Hans Herzl's conversion doesn't sound very powerful. He committed suicide and requested to be buried in a Jewish cemetery, and also attended a synagogue before his death:

https://www.jta.org/1930/09/18/archive/hans-herzl-son-of-theodor-herzl-commits-suicide-after-funeral-of-sister-paulina

It's true that Pope Pius X was firm toward Jewry on some points, but he appears to have eschewed the view of many popes and saints that Catholics should have no relationship with them other than for the purpose of trying to convert them. If a Jew shows no sign of not wanting to destroy his inner Jew then he's dangerous company.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I do not share your view of Pius X which appears to moi as an accusation against a canonised saint. :confused:
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: poche on June 17, 2019, 10:49:58 PM
What's inaccurate in my post? You missed this part?

"The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry."

Hans Herzl's conversion doesn't sound very powerful. He committed suicide and requested to be buried in a Jewish cemetery, and also attended a synagogue before his death:

https://www.jta.org/1930/09/18/archive/hans-herzl-son-of-theodor-herzl-commits-suicide-after-funeral-of-sister-paulina

It's true that Pope Pius X was firm toward Jewry on some points, but he appears to have eschewed the view of many popes and saints that Catholics should have no relationship with them other than for the purpose of trying to convert them. If a Jew shows no sign of not wanting to destroy his inner Jew then he's dangerous company.
He is the supreme pontiff. He is the leader in evangelization. He does what is best in the arena of evangelization.  if you don't communicate with them then they cannot learn about Christ. They will never learn that Jesus loves them. They will never know the wonder and the beauty of the Holy Virgin.  
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: Alcuin on June 18, 2019, 06:18:59 PM
Whether or not he was murdered, it was evidently God's will that the speech not be delivered.  Might we speculate that it was the "condemnation of" putative "anti-Semitism" that God did not want delivered to the world?
The speech would have placed the Vatican on the side of the Judeo-Masonic Allies.
Title: Re: Pope Pius XI murdered ?
Post by: roscoe on June 19, 2019, 11:58:36 PM
What's inaccurate in my post? You missed this part?

"The Herzl meeting is often used as evidence of Pope Pius X's very Catholic attitude toward Jewry."

Hans Herzl's conversion doesn't sound very powerful. He committed suicide and requested to be buried in a Jewish cemetery, and also attended a synagogue before his death:

https://www.jta.org/1930/09/18/archive/hans-herzl-son-of-theodor-herzl-commits-suicide-after-funeral-of-sister-paulina

It's true that Pope Pius X was firm toward Jewry on some points, but he appears to have eschewed the view of many popes and saints that Catholics should have no relationship with them other than for the purpose of trying to convert them. If a Jew shows no sign of not wanting to destroy his inner Jew then he's dangerous company.
Thanks for info but what evidence do you have that St Pius X is responsible for Hans being a marrano?