Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs  (Read 2615 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline InfiniteFaith

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1590
  • Reputation: +167/-2
  • Gender: Male
Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
« on: July 07, 2013, 08:45:02 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • So I started searching around on the internet just to see why people dislike Jєωs, and I ran across a number of things including this thread...

    http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110619075018AAluLJ1


    It seems that a lot of Jєωs think/feel that they are always the scapegoat/victim for our problems. This type of response is to be expected from them. I might add that it is possible that not all Jєωs are in on a One World Government, racial mixing, anti-Christian agenda. But there is good reason to believe that a good portion of them are. Regardless, I started thinking a little bit more into if there is a completely logical reason to dislike Jєωs or to simply just oppose them. Here is what I have come up with...

    Jєωs make up a very small percentage of the population in Europe and the United States. At the same time, this small group of people holds a lot of power and influence over a much larger portion of the population. Namely with the media and the Banking industry. If you don't believe me then start looking into who runs a lot of the media companies and banks. Anyways, I think a valid reason to hold some resentment towards them would be that they are such a small group of people with a lot of influence. Probably more than 90% of Americans are subjected to media/advertisement that can be traced to a Jєωιѕн owner, CEO, etc. A good comparison to this imbalanced power/influence might be a government. Imagine if each state, in the United States, had equal representation. That means that a state like rhode island would have just as much say in how our country is ran as a much larger state like Texas. What would happen is....a vast majority of the time 80% of the population would be dissatisfied with what is going on in our government since a vast majority of the population lives in just a handful of states. Things would simply be unfair. The same can be said about the power/influence of the Jєωs. Such a small portion of the population is Jєωιѕн yet nearly all of our people are influenced by them via the media. Its an imbalance of power that does not represent what the majority of the population sees fit. Much like how our forefathers saw a problem and resented the idea of equal representation from each state...many people today see a problem with the imbalance of power and influence held by the Jєωs. It is really that simple. Naturally this would cause resentment from the majority population. It is not so much that people dislike Jєωs for being Jєωιѕн, but it is more of an imbalance of power/influence issue. People, especially 50 years ago, did not sense that their viewpoints were holding precedence even though they represented the majority of the population. Quite frankly, that is how it should be. If your people represent the majority of the population then they should have a larger say in what goes on. But we shouldn't stop there. It really is not just the Jєωs who are responsible for all of this even though much of it can be traced to them. You also have to add the people who support them. Generally these people would be minorities, white women, liberals, etc. These other groups of people are probably not aware of what the Jєωs are up to behind it all. Rather they are joining with the Jєωs for other reasons, and it is making the Jєωs that much more powerful. With all of this being said, should we hate the Jєωs? No. Scripture tells us to love the enemy. But at the same time, that doesn't mean we should not take a stance against them. Plus the saints have warned against the Jєωs so we should not ever fully trust them.


    Offline Kreuzritter1945

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 75
    • Reputation: +152/-0
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #1 on: July 07, 2013, 09:08:10 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • This is why people don't like the Jєωs:



    Offline Capt McQuigg

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 4671
    • Reputation: +2624/-10
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #2 on: July 07, 2013, 09:16:22 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Do we really need to run through the long laundry list of why Jєωs are disliked by whoever happens to be near them and non-Jєωιѕн?  I say we don't need to rehash this argument.

    Infinite Faith, learn to read Hebrew.  Go to a Jєωιѕн bookstore and buy a bunch of Artscroll books, and read them.  Then, read all the Appel encyclicals in the history of the Catholic Church and see how absolutely spot on the Holy Church has been about them.

    But, I will compose  short list for you:

    1) Jєωs are inculturation and inculcated from day one to marry and live only among themselves and the are taught to speak with division of other people.

    2) Jєωs support abortion because the Jєωιѕн faith teaches that Non-Jєωs are spirituall valueless in the eyes of HaShem.

    3) Jєωs believe that non-Jєωs have only a role of servitude in their "World to Come" and that the only non-Jєωs who will warrant going there are non-Jєωs who served the Jєωs in this world and were also very righteous but ONLY their spirit will go and they will be servants there too. Read Ramchal's book "Derech HaShem" if you want more of this pap.

    4) Jєωs encourage destructive laws among the non-Jєωs because the Jєω has been taught from day one that non-Jєωs are animals and that the life of the non-Jєω is to be bent, sorrowful and shivering.

    5) Jєωs believe that there are five levels to the soul, the bottom three are strictly related to the animal/biological function with the top two being higher order functions pertaining to man's relationship to higher ideals and HaShem.  In the book I mentioned above "Derech HaShem" no-Jєωs ONLY possess the bottom three.  So, if a Jєωιѕн person is fed this evil as mother's milk every day, then they will go through life constantly treating their on-Jєωιѕн neighbors and co-workers and just on-Jєωs in general with such contempt and disdain that they will, it is only natural, create a lot of problems and unnecessary stress.  

    6) Jєωs believe in their own superiority, which isn't all that bad if you leave it in the intellectual or theoretical realm, but they insist that on-Jєωs share this belief and look on With envy at the Jєωιѕн people.  We Catholics should rightly see Jєωs as condemned unless they truly repent.

    7) Jєωs overwhelmingly support communism, gαy marriage, pornography, wars of aggression, etc.

    8) Jєωs are deceitful and you will discover this when you buy and read the Stone edition of the Chumash. In it you will read discussions by the most revered rabbis in the history of Judaism debating each other about how it is okay to lie to non-Jєωs and how since non-Jєωs are so spiritually valueless that it is never appropriate to take them at their word because it is to be assumed that they are liars.

    9) Jєωs are hated because of how they treat non-Jєωs.  The rest is just the whole sociological shebang but 99 percent of the human race has not even heard of a Chumash much less become familiar with Jєωιѕн thinking.  

    So, the reason the Jєωs are so disliked is how they treat non-Jєωs.  They encourage destructive behavior and fight for destructive laws because they want to benefit their own people.

    Offline LaramieHirsch

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2718
    • Reputation: +956/-248
    • Gender: Male
      • h
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #3 on: July 07, 2013, 09:49:00 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Neat.  I wrote a bunch here, and now it's gone.

    Hi, Cathinfo.  




    Moving on.







    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline Eudes

    • Newbie
    • *
    • Posts: 106
    • Reputation: +55/-0
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #4 on: July 07, 2013, 09:56:38 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/embed/UGt7_0GEOvo[/youtube]
    "The most evident mark of God's anger, and the most terrible castigation He can inflict upon the world, is manifest when He permits His people to fall into the hands of a clergy who are more in name than in deed, priests who practice the cruelty of raveni


    Offline poche

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 16730
    • Reputation: +1218/-4688
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #5 on: July 07, 2013, 10:31:24 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Some people are unable to face their own problems so they feel that they have to find someone else to place the blame.

    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 8212
    • Reputation: +7173/-7
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #6 on: July 07, 2013, 10:49:11 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: poche
    Some people are unable to face their own problems so they feel that they have to find someone else to place the blame.


    No, St. John Chrysostom said that Jєωs are enemies of Our Lord and their souls are filled with devils.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.

    Offline InfiniteFaith

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1590
    • Reputation: +167/-2
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #7 on: July 07, 2013, 11:10:06 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Kreuzritter1945
    This is why people don't like the Jєωs:



    I watched about 45 min of the video so far...this is some very good stuff. Thanks for bringing that up. I can't help but think of this while watching the video...

    "In the year 1980 the wicked shall prevail." (St. Bridget of Sweden)


    Offline InfiniteFaith

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1590
    • Reputation: +167/-2
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #8 on: July 07, 2013, 11:13:52 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    Do we really need to run through the long laundry list of why Jєωs are disliked by whoever happens to be near them and non-Jєωιѕн?  I say we don't need to rehash this argument.

    Infinite Faith, learn to read Hebrew.  Go to a Jєωιѕн bookstore and buy a bunch of Artscroll books, and read them.  Then, read all the Appel encyclicals in the history of the Catholic Church and see how absolutely spot on the Holy Church has been about them.

    But, I will compose  short list for you:

    1) Jєωs are inculturation and inculcated from day one to marry and live only among themselves and the are taught to speak with division of other people.

    2) Jєωs support abortion because the Jєωιѕн faith teaches that Non-Jєωs are spirituall valueless in the eyes of HaShem.

    3) Jєωs believe that non-Jєωs have only a role of servitude in their "World to Come" and that the only non-Jєωs who will warrant going there are non-Jєωs who served the Jєωs in this world and were also very righteous but ONLY their spirit will go and they will be servants there too. Read Ramchal's book "Derech HaShem" if you want more of this pap.

    4) Jєωs encourage destructive laws among the non-Jєωs because the Jєω has been taught from day one that non-Jєωs are animals and that the life of the non-Jєω is to be bent, sorrowful and shivering.

    5) Jєωs believe that there are five levels to the soul, the bottom three are strictly related to the animal/biological function with the top two being higher order functions pertaining to man's relationship to higher ideals and HaShem.  In the book I mentioned above "Derech HaShem" no-Jєωs ONLY possess the bottom three.  So, if a Jєωιѕн person is fed this evil as mother's milk every day, then they will go through life constantly treating their on-Jєωιѕн neighbors and co-workers and just on-Jєωs in general with such contempt and disdain that they will, it is only natural, create a lot of problems and unnecessary stress.  

    6) Jєωs believe in their own superiority, which isn't all that bad if you leave it in the intellectual or theoretical realm, but they insist that on-Jєωs share this belief and look on With envy at the Jєωιѕн people.  We Catholics should rightly see Jєωs as condemned unless they truly repent.

    7) Jєωs overwhelmingly support communism, gαy marriage, pornography, wars of aggression, etc.

    8) Jєωs are deceitful and you will discover this when you buy and read the Stone edition of the Chumash. In it you will read discussions by the most revered rabbis in the history of Judaism debating each other about how it is okay to lie to non-Jєωs and how since non-Jєωs are so spiritually valueless that it is never appropriate to take them at their word because it is to be assumed that they are liars.

    9) Jєωs are hated because of how they treat non-Jєωs.  The rest is just the whole sociological shebang but 99 percent of the human race has not even heard of a Chumash much less become familiar with Jєωιѕн thinking.  

    So, the reason the Jєωs are so disliked is how they treat non-Jєωs.  They encourage destructive behavior and fight for destructive laws because they want to benefit their own people.


    agreed.

    Offline Anthony Benedict

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 533
    • Reputation: +510/-4
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #9 on: July 08, 2013, 01:06:58 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Well, Pope Pius XII (and a whole bunch of Catholic nuns, priests and laity)saved a few - like about 800,000 according to even the socialist Golda Meier, who saw to it that there were planted that many cedar trees as a tribute to him, on Israeli soil.

    So - at least according to one preconciliar pope of unquestionable sanctity and propriety - they weren't ALL "bad".

    I've worked with Jєωιѕн professionals since the 1970s, mostly attorneys. I can truthfully state that NOT ONCE did I meet one who wasn't honest, or did not earn his keep, nor even acted in an inflammatory manner.

    I cannot say that about some, but not all, of the Jєωιѕн professionals on Wall St. and in other parts of the financial jungles in NYC, Washington or New Orleans with whom I did battle, however. There were a couple of real doozies. But then, finance is still the Wild, Wild West and will ever remain so.

    Anyway, a Catholic is called by the Church to do whatever he can to help others, including Jєωs just as much as fallen-away Catholics ( the single largest "denomination" in the USA, btw ), to find and to stay on the road to salvation paved by Christ and His Church.

    First, by example. And, as in everything else and at every momd ent, there is but one example - Christ Himself. On that score, I have a "perfect record" - I have failed - perfectly! - every time!

    But how many Jєωs and fallen-away Catholics would have converted but were chased away by Catholics behaving VERY badly?

    I remain convinced that if only ten percent of baptized Catholics managed to do only 10% of what they ought, even if only 10% of the time, that God would be so bowled over that He would re-order the weather so that everyone on earth would have San Diego's weather and put a stop to all volcanic, seismic and incendiary events - just like that!

    Second, by prayer and penance. ( Needn't say anything about that! )

    So, are there some Jєωs ( like some "catholics", e.g. Martin Luther & Adolf Hitler spring to mind ) who are just plain rotten to the core? Sure. It's true of every race on earth.

    Does every Jєω spend an appreciable amount of his time worrying about how best to overturn the Catholic religion? If so, what percentage of Jєωs are like that? Is it a majority? A minority? Is it even a realistic "threat" to the existence of the Church - and compared to what, Islam?

    Is it not true that the majority of people of Je Lwish ancestry "identify" with their heritage only along the loosest lines of familial descent and are no more or less interested in anything seriously religious than a majority of non-aligned and non-believing seculars or heretical cult members (e.g. UUs, CoEs or "Christian Scientists")? In fact, because of intermarriage, is it not the case that Jєωιѕн leaders are concerned that, in not too many decades, the race will simply all but disappear altogether?

    Anyway, a few thoughts. And, before anyone raises the question, I first read St. John Chrysostum's sermons more than 20 years ago. He's right today as he was then. But one has to read EVERYTHING he wrote: He was no less zealous for the conversion of the Jєωs than any other Saint MUST BE.

    That gift, the grace of conversion, for the race Our Lord Himself chose to lead out of Egypt and into which to be born incarnate can still be won.

    By example.

    By prayer and penance.

    Everything else is pretty much just politics.

    Offline InfiniteFaith

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1590
    • Reputation: +167/-2
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #10 on: July 08, 2013, 01:16:40 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Anthony Benedict
    Well, Pope Pius XII (and a whole bunch of Catholic nuns, priests and laity)saved a few - like about 800,000 according to even the socialist Golda Meier, who saw to it that there were planted that many cedar trees as a tribute to him, on Israeli soil.

    So - at least according to one preconciliar pope of unquestionable sanctity and propriety - they weren't ALL "bad".

    I've worked with Jєωιѕн professionals since the 1970s, mostly attorneys. I can truthfully state that NOT ONCE did I meet one who wasn't honest, or did not earn his keep, nor even acted in an inflammatory manner.

    I cannot say that about some, but not all, of the Jєωιѕн professionals on Wall St. and in other parts of the financial jungles in NYC, Washington or New Orleans with whom I did battle, however. There were a couple of real doozies. But then, finance is still the Wild, Wild West and will ever remain so.

    Anyway, a Catholic is called by the Church to do whatever he can to help others, including Jєωs just as much as fallen-away Catholics ( the single largest "denomination" in the USA, btw ), to find and to stay on the road to salvation paved by Christ and His Church.

    First, by example. And, as in everything else and at every momd ent, there is but one example - Christ Himself. On that score, I have a "perfect record" - I have failed - perfectly! - every time!

    But how many Jєωs and fallen-away Catholics would have converted but were chased away by Catholics behaving VERY badly?

    I remain convinced that if only ten percent of baptized Catholics managed to do only 10% of what they ought, even if only 10% of the time, that God would be so bowled over that He would re-order the weather so that everyone on earth would have San Diego's weather and put a stop to all volcanic, seismic and incendiary events - just like that!

    Second, by prayer and penance. ( Needn't say anything about that! )

    So, are there some Jєωs ( like some "catholics", e.g. Martin Luther & Adolf Hitler spring to mind ) who are just plain rotten to the core? Sure. It's true of every race on earth.

    Does every Jєω spend an appreciable amount of his time worrying about how best to overturn the Catholic religion? If so, what percentage of Jєωs are like that? Is it a majority? A minority? Is it even a realistic "threat" to the existence of the Church - and compared to what, Islam?

    Is it not true that the majority of people of Je Lwish ancestry "identify" with their heritage only along the loosest lines of familial descent and are no more or less interested in anything seriously religious than a majority of non-aligned and non-believing seculars or heretical cult members (e.g. UUs, CoEs or "Christian Scientists")? In fact, because of intermarriage, is it not the case that Jєωιѕн leaders are concerned that, in not too many decades, the race will simply all but disappear altogether?

    Anyway, a few thoughts. And, before anyone raises the question, I first read St. John Chrysostum's sermons more than 20 years ago. He's right today as he was then. But one has to read EVERYTHING he wrote: He was no less zealous for the conversion of the Jєωs than any other Saint MUST BE.

    That gift, the grace of conversion, for the race Our Lord Himself chose to lead out of Egypt and into which to be born incarnate can still be won.

    By example.

    By prayer and penance.

    Everything else is pretty much just politics.


    I would be willing to bet that 80% of Jєωs (minimum estimate) are wicked. They would not see themselves as wicked of course. They just wouldn't know what they are doing. If one is not Baptized in the Trinity then you might as well consider them a pawn of the devil. The Jєωs being satan's favorite pawns. You might consider implicit desire for Baptism at that point but one would still be at high risk for serving Satan unknowingly.


    Offline Telesphorus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 12713
    • Reputation: +22/-13
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #11 on: July 08, 2013, 03:18:16 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • So-called Catholics betray their own people, kicking them to the curb (like Bishop Williamson) to please Jєωs, then blame the people who they mistreat for being mental cases seeking a scapegoat.  They are truly cowardly and shameless but most of all brainwashed.

    You can't believe in the Social Reign of Christ the King without believing in resistance to Jєωιѕн media domination and political influence.

    Clearly liberal ʝʊdɛօphile Catholics do not care about the Gospel or the fact that Jєωs seek the ruin of Christian society.  What they care about is their social position and their idiotic belief in their moral superiority (PC preening) and both of those typically depend on collaborating to some degree in the betrayal of their own people.

    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 8212
    • Reputation: +7173/-7
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #12 on: July 08, 2013, 11:15:54 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: ServusSpiritusSancti
    Quote from: poche
    Some people are unable to face their own problems so they feel that they have to find someone else to place the blame.


    No, St. John Chrysostom said that Jєωs are enemies of Our Lord and their souls are filled with devils.


    Guess a Judaizer thumbed this down.

    Maybe it was Krah?  :jester:
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.

    Offline ggreg

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3001
    • Reputation: +184/-179
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #13 on: July 08, 2013, 11:35:18 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I like most of the Jєωs I've ever known and certainly, if I disliked them, it was not for their Jєωιѕнness.

    Been to Israel several times and was always treated with great kindness.  I particularly like that they tell you what they think and don't display any false politeness; as is typical with English people.  I find them an intelligent bunch with plenty of ideas and opinions and stimulating to talk to.  Much more lively than your typical Englishman.

    There is a secular US Jєω, particularly based in New York and other large US cities, some of whom are very obsessed with money, power and influence and utterly self-absorbed but this is not true of most of the Jєωs I know.  I've observed half a dozen of these types over 12 years and I've never seen any of them rise to success.  To be successful you have to get clever and capable people on-side to assist you.  That means either genuinely liking the people you work with or being REALLY good at faking it.

    I would agree, however, that many Jєωs define themselves by their Jєωιѕнness and tend to marry and make close friendships within their race/religion.  But then that is true of some Catholics.  Jєωs in particular tend to put a greater proportion of their energy and time into trying to be successful.  I've not seen a great ability for them to say, enough is enough and take time out or decide their business or career is successful enough and thus spend time on family or charitable projects.  Being workaholics is very common.

    Who knows, perhaps I am treated warmly by them because I make it clear that I like them and don't fear them or distrust them.  That is true of many other races of people.

    I also particularly like Iranians, Georgians, Croats and Colombians.  I would single those races out as being particularly friendly, charitable, helpful and welcoming.

    Offline Anthony Benedict

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 533
    • Reputation: +510/-4
    • Gender: Male
    Pondering about why people dislike the Jєωs
    « Reply #14 on: July 08, 2013, 12:10:10 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Telesphorus
    So-called Catholics betray their own people, kicking them to the curb (like Bishop Williamson) to please Jєωs, then blame the people who they mistreat for being mental cases seeking a scapegoat.  They are truly cowardly and shameless but most of all brainwashed.

    You can't believe in the Social Reign of Christ the King without believing in resistance to Jєωιѕн media domination and political influence.

    Clearly liberal ʝʊdɛօphile Catholics do not care about the Gospel or the fact that Jєωs seek the ruin of Christian society.  What they care about is their social position and their idiotic belief in their moral superiority (PC preening) and both of those typically depend on collaborating to some degree in the betrayal of their own people.


    A. Tele,  I think you will agree that St. Thomas' admonition to "seldom deny, rarely affirm and always distinguish" has its place even in this case.

    B. A baptized Catholic - liberally duped or otherwise - is a baptized Catholic. You and I would both agree he is in grave error, but the ineradicable character of the Sacrament is as much part of his soul as it is yours or mine. So, if I may suggest - instead of "so-called", would you agree it is more precise to simply call them liberals?

    C. I totally agree with your position on Jєωιѕн influence in media and politics.

    D. Since I was asking members to consider whether ALL Jєωs were intent on bringing down the Church  ( a fairly unsustainable thesis ), would it not, again, be more precise to define those Jєωs who are about that business - ADL types, for example - as "Jєωs organized and hostile to the Church" ( a more quantifiable group ) rather than stating, rather over-broadly: "... the fact that Jєωs seek the ruin...etc." ?

    Thus, would you agree that you and I are both concerned with the welfare of the Church and cognizant of certain elements with Judaism (тαℓмυdism in the majority of adherents' cases ) which would be pleased to undermine Catholic doctrine?

    If so, would you further agree that such is not the position of ALL Jєωs as a people and that, despite that, as Catholics we are obligated to pray and do penance for their conversion and to be mindful of setting a solid example of Christ-like humility and charity before ALL men, even Jєωs, communists, muslims, etc.?

    I know, because I've failed many, many times, how hard it is to do. But I think ggreg's comments indicate an attitude conducive to both defending the Faith and extending, if only by good example, an invitation to non-believers, even enemies, to look further into the matter.