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Author Topic: natural marriage  (Read 818 times)

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Offline jman123

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natural marriage
« on: March 02, 2012, 06:06:34 PM »
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  • Why are natural marriages between non baptized people recognized by the Church and their children as legitimate?

    How can they be married without the sacrament?


    Offline Telesphorus

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #1 on: March 02, 2012, 06:16:33 PM »
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  • Quote from: jman123
    Why are natural marriages between non baptized people recognized by the Church and their children as legitimate?

    How can they be married without the sacrament?


    The better question is this:

    How can all procreation among non-Christians be regarded as the product of fornication, when we see among the pagans, Jєωs and Muslims that they have marriages and families?



    Offline Sigismund

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #2 on: March 02, 2012, 08:08:11 PM »
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  • The question contains the answer.  They are natural marriages, but not sacraments.
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir

    Offline InfiniteFaith

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #3 on: March 05, 2012, 01:23:57 AM »
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  • I have heard that you don't need a priest to get married, but marriage is something that takes place when a man and a woman give consent to come together for the rest of their lives. I learned this from a website that supports Vatican II however.

    Offline alaric

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #4 on: March 05, 2012, 12:25:14 PM »
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  • Listen, the way things are going, you're going to see them have a hard enough time declaring a marriage as just between a man and a woman.


    Offline alaric

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #5 on: March 05, 2012, 12:39:14 PM »
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  • Quote from: InfiniteFaith
    I have heard that you don't need a priest to get married, but marriage is something that takes place when a man and a woman give consent to come together for the rest of their lives. I learned this from a website that supports Vatican II however.
    Come together huh?

    Maybe that website owner is a big Beatles fan.



    But he certainly is no Catholic authority on the issue.


    Offline Canute

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #6 on: March 05, 2012, 01:05:37 PM »
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  • God instituted marriage first as a natural contract. Our Lord raised this to the level of a sacrament when contracted between two baptized people, but left the natural contract as it was between the unbaptized.

    Offline Stubborn

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #7 on: March 05, 2012, 04:36:01 PM »
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  • Quote from: jman123
    Why are natural marriages between non baptized people recognized by the Church and their children as legitimate?

    How can they be married without the sacrament?


    I've never heard of a natural marriage - what is it? Wiki seems to be calling a mixed marriage "natural".

    Remember that the Church recognizes all marriages as valid - at least insofar as the parties were able to marry ie no prior marriages, legal age etc. The primary (not only) reason the Church initially presumes that all marriages are valid is because She is the only defender of the Sacrament.

     As such, She, initially at least, presumes validity of all marriages for the sake of the Sacrament, for the good of the family unit, for society in general etc. whether the marriage is sacramental or not.

    Matrimony consists of, 1) the contract between a man and woman called simply, The Marriage Contract. This contract is the thing that is binding till the death of one of the spouses and yes, it happens when the man and woman make their vows to God. This contract, sacramental or not, is what binds. Many people want to believe if a marriage is not sacramental then it is not binding - look what that belief has progressed into - homo marriage..........what's next we can only wonder.

    And 2) The Sacrament, wherein the priest blesses the union entered into by both parties to sanctify the marriage, with which comes special graces to help each other put up with each other's weaknesses,  in sickness an health, better for worse etc. till one of the spouses die.

    Least ways, that's how it was pre-V2.



    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse


    Offline Stubborn

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    natural marriage
    « Reply #8 on: March 05, 2012, 04:46:17 PM »
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  • Shoot, too late to edit!

    Anyway, far as the legitimacy of children of unbaptized parents go, the Church maintains the legitimacy for the good of the family unit and society.

    Even if one of the spouses is baptized, She still maintains legitimacy for the same reasons.  

    Maybe try looking for "The Pauline Privilege" for a fuller explanation.

    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse