Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: My confusion and despair...  (Read 909 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline gobosox91

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 89
  • Reputation: +11/-0
  • Gender: Male
My confusion and despair...
« on: April 19, 2012, 09:53:21 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • This is a more concise and singular version of my confusion. To make it easier for everybody and so I don't come off as a troll.


    My goal, here, is to find truth. My biggest concern is if I get into Heaven. May God the Father guide you and me….
    One of my first questions is regarding Mary. How do we know that it was Mary in Revelation 12? Many have suggested that it was not Mary and it was Israel or the Church. One objection I heard was that John did not assert she was Mary, as he would have done if he were truly in contact with her, since he took care of her. However, he speaks of a child who will rule with an iron rod: obviously Jesus. Yet he does not assert his name, but he implies it. What reasons do we have to assert that it is Mary? If it is not Mary, does it diminish her role? Is “Our Lady of Guadalupe” merely just a deception from the enemy?
    Second: who is the whore of Babylon? Third: who is the beast? Is it both the Church and the papacy?
    Fourth: if you sell your soul to the devil and you get what you want, can you come back to God? And if you do repent, is it a sin to use what you were given? I feel I have given in to that and had that come true. It has become scary. I want to call the devil my… L word. Jesus is the Lord.
    Fifth: I keep reading everything involving Christianity and it seems Catholicism makes the most sense, but I’m skeptical of joining it. I’ve been raised Catholic, but the claims of Fundies bug me. What do I do?
    Sixth: Idolatry. If the Jєωs believed in the Ten Commandments in Jesus' days as Protestants do today, then why do we make statues? Or such? Ik of the Bronze Serpent, the Ark, and Solomon's Temple, but why do we rearrange it?
    Seventh: How do we TEST Marian apparitions to see if they are from Mary? I believe Lourdes is true because Bernadette tested her and she didn't say anything suspicious, other than I am the Immaculate Conception, which is believable if she is the new Ark or Eve.



    Best,
    KDG


    Offline Hobbledehoy

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3746
    • Reputation: +4806/-6
    • Gender: Male
    My confusion and despair...
    « Reply #1 on: April 19, 2012, 10:19:34 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • First of all, please be assured of my prayers. And I beseech you to give yourself over to earnest and persevering prayer and acts of penance, imploring Our Lord to give you the light necessary for you to walk the path of His commandments, that is, to be a devout child of Holy Mother Church.

    Secondly, the paucity of time and the limitations of present circuмstances cannot permit me to address all of your queries. I will, however, direct you to a tome, regarding your question about the Apocalypse of St. John, chapter xii.



    There is a great book which you ought to read, written by Rev. Fr. Thomas Livius, C.Ss.R., (please click on the title to link you to the PDF file) Mary in the Epistles, or, The Implicit Teaching of the Apostles Concerning the Blessed Virgin Contained in Their Writings, Illustrated from the Fathers and Other Authors with Introductory Chapters (London: Burns & Oates, Ltd., 1891).

    In that book, Rev. Fr. Livius explains the vision recorded by St. John in the twelth chapter of his Apocalypse:[/size]






















    Please ignore all that I have written regarding sedevacantism.


    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 8212
    • Reputation: +7173/-7
    • Gender: Male
    My confusion and despair...
    « Reply #2 on: April 19, 2012, 10:29:06 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: gobosox91
    One of my first questions is regarding Mary. How do we know that it was Mary in Revelation 12? Many have suggested that it was not Mary and it was Israel or the Church. One objection I heard was that John did not assert she was Mary, as he would have done if he were truly in contact with her, since he took care of her. However, he speaks of a child who will rule with an iron rod: obviously Jesus. Yet he does not assert his name, but he implies it. What reasons do we have to assert that it is Mary? If it is not Mary, does it diminish her role? Is “Our Lady of Guadalupe” merely just a deception from the enemy?


    Guadalupe is a true Apparition, as are the Apparitions of Lourdes, Lasallete, Akita, Mt. Carmel, and Fatima (forgive me if I'm forgetting any). There are some fake apparitions, such as those of Bayside and Medjugorie, but the ones I mentioned are real.

    Quote
    Second: who is the whore of Babylon?


    The Vatican II church, which is not the Catholic Church.

    Quote
    Third: who is the beast? Is it both the Church and the papacy?


    No, the beast is the devil. But if you mean the beast of the Apocalypse, that would be the microchip, the 666, which will be from the devil.

    Quote
    Fourth: if you sell your soul to the devil and you get what you want, can you come back to God? And if you do repent, is it a sin to use what you were given? I feel I have given in to that and had that come true. It has become scary. I want to call the devil my… L word. Jesus is the Lord.


    You can come back to God if you sincerely repent, but I don't know what you mean in those last few sentences. Can you elaborate there, please?

    Quote
    Fifth: I keep reading everything involving Christianity and it seems Catholicism makes the most sense, but I’m skeptical of joining it. I’ve been raised Catholic, but the claims of Fundies bug me. What do I do?


    That is why it is important for a Catholic to know his or her Faith, so that they can refute the arguments of Protestants. If you have any further questions regarding these arguments against the Faith, please do not hesitate to ask us.

    Quote
    Sixth: Idolatry. If the Jєωs believed in the Ten Commandments in Jesus' days as Protestants do today, then why do we make statues? Or such? Ik of the Bronze Serpent, the Ark, and Solomon's Temple, but why do we rearrange it?


    We make statues to remind us of Saints, and of God in general.

    Quote
    Seventh: How do we TEST Marian apparitions to see if they are from Mary? I believe Lourdes is true because Bernadette tested her and she didn't say anything suspicious, other than I am the Immaculate Conception, which is believable if she is the new Ark or Eve.


    If it's like Medjugorie where the message is basically the same thing every day, or if it's something heretical, it's fake.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.

    Offline Vladimir

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1707
    • Reputation: +496/-1
    • Gender: Male
    My confusion and despair...
    « Reply #3 on: April 20, 2012, 08:30:07 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Fr. Kramer's "Book of Destiny" explains the Apocalypse in detail.

    The woman in labour represents the Church in his opinion - I think, not totally sure on that one.



    Offline Nishant

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2126
    • Reputation: +0/-6
    • Gender: Male
    My confusion and despair...
    « Reply #4 on: April 20, 2012, 10:27:49 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Excellent post by Hobbledehoy, as usual.

    As the cited passage says, one can view the Blessed Virgin as a type of the Church so that the two interpretations are harmonized. The Blessed Virgin in her very person already is and always was purer than what the whole Church will be on the last day, the Bride without spot or wrinkle (Eph 5:27). Moreover, Apocalyptic literature often has multiple interpretations. St.John himself offers two interpretations for one of the images in his vision.
    "Never will anyone who says his Rosary every day become a formal heretic ... This is a statement I would sign in my blood." St. Montfort, Secret of the Rosary. I support the FSSP, the SSPX and other priests who work for the restoration of doctrinal orthodoxy and liturgical orthopraxis in the Church. I accept Vatican II if interpreted in the light of Tradition and canonisations as an infallible declaration that a person is in Heaven. Sedevacantism is schismatic and Ecclesiavacantism is heretical.


    Offline Graham

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1768
    • Reputation: +1886/-16
    • Gender: Male
    My confusion and despair...
    « Reply #5 on: April 20, 2012, 11:04:33 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: gobosox91
    This is a more concise and singular version of my confusion. To make it easier for everybody and so I don't come off as a troll.


    Don't worry, I don’t think anyone thought you were a troll, just that there was a better way of doing things. Thanks for putting everything in one thread. When more questions occur to you, I think you should update this thread with them.

    I’m going to try to answer some of your questions. Hopefully my responses are of help and don't just raise further questions.

    Quote
    Fourth: if you sell your soul to the devil and you get what you want, can you come back to God?


    Yes, you can, and we have it from scripture that he and his hosts will rejoice more at your return than if you’d never strayed.

    Quote
    And if you do repent, is it a sin to use what you were given?


    I’m not sure, but I think that one’s compunction would not allow one to use resources acquired through sin, except for purely charitable purposes.

    Quote
    Fifth: I keep reading everything involving Christianity and it seems Catholicism makes the most sense, but I’m skeptical of joining it. I’ve been raised Catholic, but the claims of Fundies bug me. What do I do?


    You should receive catachesis at the foot of a traditional priest, and pester him with your questions!

    Since you have trouble coming to grips with Catholic veneration for Mary, for the Saints, and for the sacrament of confession, you should spend time meditating on them and perhaps seeking their company. You should feel your way forward inch by inch, testing whether the hold is solid before you place your full weight on it. I don’t mean you should think about things, I mean you should pray and meditate on them to determine their reality and their true force. As for confession, you could spend some time imagining, in emotional and sensory detail, what it might be like to make a confession, render satisfaction, and be absolved of your sins. Go to mass early and watch people in line for confession; and see for yourself the disencuмbered and transformed soul as it emerges from the dark recess of the confessional.

    Speaking as a convert myself, I am always slightly boggled by the protestant mistrust of Mary, the Saints, and confession. They are such wonderful, beautiful, obvious truths that, if one’s heart is open, one practically has only to hear of them to believe in them.

    Quote
    Sixth: Idolatry. If the Jєωs believed in the Ten Commandments in Jesus' days as Protestants do today, then why do we make statues? Or such? Ik of the Bronze Serpent, the Ark, and Solomon's Temple, but why do we rearrange it?


    The pagans used to imbue their statues with the actual presence of different gods, demons, and ancestors in rites we know of as ‘thaumaturgy’. These thaumaturgical statues formed, for example, the ritual keystone of the ancient Egyptian and Sumerian religions, among others, and were worshipped in fact as gods.

    Now, there are undeniably some similarities between the ancient practice of thaumaturgy and – most notably – the consecration and adoration of the host, in which a material support is infused with the real presence, not just of some demon or ancestor, but of the very Lord. The all-important differences lie, of course, in just that – that rather than bowing to murky beings low in the spiritual hierarchy, or perhaps even of the hierarchy of evil, beings conjured perhaps through black magic, in the Eucharist we worship the one true God, in a ritual devised and empowered personally by Christ.

    Pious Catholic belief holds that the concrete depiction of the spiritual being, whether saint or angel, somehow contains that being’s localized presence to a certain degree. But this is not idolatry in the pagan sense, since the being is not worshipped but appealed to for intercession. The ancient pagans, for example, went so far as to make animal and vegetable sacrifices to their thaumaturgical statues, which should highlight for you the distance between their doctrines and ours.

    Offline Clelia

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 231
    • Reputation: +167/-0
    • Gender: Male
    My confusion and despair...
    « Reply #6 on: April 20, 2012, 06:47:09 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • My Dear gobosox91,

    This is an illustration that certainly supports God's mercy!

    Warning: not for children or the faint of heart.

    It is also a lengthy post, but worthwhile for those who have doubts about just how farGod's Mercy extends:

    Sister Magdalena of the Cross -The nun who made a pact with the devil

    God Bless!   :pray:
    Leaving the Boyz Club of little popes. SWAK.

    Offline Caraffa

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 989
    • Reputation: +558/-47
    • Gender: Male
    My confusion and despair...
    « Reply #7 on: April 24, 2012, 07:19:21 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: gobosox91
    How do we know that it was Mary in Revelation 12? Many have suggested that it was not Mary and it was Israel or the Church. One objection I heard was that John did not assert she was Mary, as he would have done if he were truly in contact with her, since he took care of her. However, he speaks of a child who will rule with an iron rod: obviously Jesus. Yet he does not assert his name, but he implies it.


    I think the woman in Revelation 12 represents both the Church and the Blessed Virgin Mary.

    St. Quodvultdeus, Bishop of Carthage, Sermo III de Symbolo (Third Homily On the Symbol):

    "In the Apocalypse of the apostle John it is written that the dragon stood in full view of the woman about to give birth, in order that when she gave birth, he would eat the child born [of her]. We all know that the Dragon is the devil and that the woman signifies Mary, who, remaining intact, brought forth our chaste head. She who also showed forth in herself a figure of holy Church, so that as she in bringing forth a Son remained a virgin, so the Church also should during all times be bringing forth his members, and yet not lose her virgin estate."

    St. Quodvultdeus was a friend and and a disciple of St. Augustine and this sermon was once attributed to St. Augustine.


    Pray for me, always.