Author Topic: Militia Immaculate Apostolate of SSPX (Read 3453 times)

Incredulous · « **Reply #15 on:** October 17, 2017, 11:27:21 PM »

Quote from: Recusant Sede on October 17, 2017, 05:51:52 PM

Frankly, the whole thing just doesn’t sit right with me. I would like to know why the SSPX is pushing a "NO saint" so fervently? To be clear, Fr. Kolbe may have been a good man and may very well be in heaven, but he did not die a martyr for the Faith. Also, I'm fairly confident that one is NOT allowed to give ones life in exchange for another. One can certainly lose his life defending someone who is being attacked and thus commit a meritorious act, but, I'm pretty sure what Fr. Kolbe did is not approved Catholic teaching.

A Consiliar canonization doesn't make a fraud a saint nor detract from the fruits of the obvious Saints.

Father Kolbe was a martyr for the Catholic Faith... singing hymns for Our Lady and praying until his execution.

newChurch canonized him for the wrong reason, for dying for another human.

He was a martyr in that he persevered, served and was executed in the act of being a priest for the Faith.

One of the few photo of him smiling, while playing simultaneous
games of chess and beating all his seminarian opponents.

Nadir · « **Reply #16 on:** October 17, 2017, 11:55:41 PM »

Quote from: Neil Obstat on October 16, 2017, 11:10:52 PM

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Who told you it was a prayer composed or altered by Bp. Fellay?
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I would like to hear an answer to Neil's question, please Incredulous, or rather to the implied question, did +Fellay compose or change the prayers.
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Being canonised by the new church doesn't mean he wasn't a saint, and maybe also a martyr, though I think the latter is more questionable.
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Some masons have converted, so I think it is wise to pray for their conversion and for sinners generally.
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I find the apostolate of St Maxmillian very interesting and some of my searches on his work have been pretty unproductive.

Marlelar · « **Reply #17 on:** October 18, 2017, 12:51:50 AM »

From their website: link

The Militia of the Immaculata (MI) is a worldwide evangelization movement founded by St. Maximilian Kolbe in 1917 that encourages total consecration to the Blessed Virgin Mary as a means of spiritual renewal for individuals and society. The MI movement is open to all Catholics over 7 years old. It employs prayer as the main tool in the spiritual battle with evil. Members of the MI also immerse themselves in apostolic initiatives throughout society, either individually or in groups, to deepen and spread the knowledge of the Gospel and our Catholic Faith.

The MI may or may not have been transformed by the NO, but my guess is that it has.

Our chapel in Phoenix promotes the MI, but since the SSPX recognized as valid the man sitting on the chair of Peter I don't suppose they have a problem with the saints they designate.

Fr. Kolbe was a very holy man, and probably is a saint, but since the NO also canonizes the likes of JP2, I no longer trust their judgement.

Nadir · « **Reply #18 on:** October 18, 2017, 04:17:36 AM »

Quote

"Mary conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee,
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And for all who do not have recourse to thee, especially for Masons, and all those who are commended to Thee."

I don't find fault with adding to the prayer, but with the words themselves which are very vague, wishy-washy and misleading.

Masons not only neglect / refuse to have recourse to Our Blessed Mother, they actively despise Her and Her Son's Church and seek to destroy it.

So if we pray for masons we should pray for their repentance and conversion, as we do for the Jєωs.

"all those who are commended to thee" almost sounds like a note of commendation.

So who did invent / compose this prayer?

TKGS · « **Reply #19 on:** October 18, 2017, 05:59:17 AM »

Quote from: Incredulous on October 17, 2017, 11:27:21 PM

Father Kolbe was a martyr for the Catholic Faith... singing hymns for Our Lady and praying until his execution.

newChurch canonized him for the wrong reason, for dying for another human.

Father Kolbe was a holy man, but he was not a martyr for the Catholic faith. He willingly took the place of another man to be killed. There is a significant difference here. The term, martyr, should not be used for people who are killed for reasons unrelated to the Catholic faith.

Incredulous · « **Reply #20 on:** October 18, 2017, 08:54:15 AM »

Quote from: Nadir on October 17, 2017, 11:55:41 PM

I would like to hear an answer to Neil's question, please Incredulous, or rather to the implied question, did +Fellay compose or change the prayers.
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Being canonised by the new church doesn't mean he wasn't a saint, and maybe also a martyr, though I think the latter is more questionable.
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Some masons have converted, so I think it is wise to pray for their conversion and for sinners generally.
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I find the apostolate of St Maxmillian very interesting and some of my searches on his work have been pretty unproductive.

Because of the Marian aspect of his apostolate, he was readily absorbed by the Consiliar church.

But as I mentioned, the humanistic cause they associated with his death was incorrect. This is JPII's twisted theology.

Novus ordo members are much devoted to him and the Knights of the Immaculata:

Militia of the Immaculata
There's a good book on him, from his fratres, and lay friends who knew him, that is more accurate in his history... I think.

Incredulous · « **Reply #21 on:** October 18, 2017, 09:32:44 AM »

Quote from: Nadir on October 17, 2017, 11:55:41 PM

I would like to hear an answer to Neil's question, please Incredulous, or rather to the implied question, did +Fellay compose or change the prayers.
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Being canonised by the new church doesn't mean he wasn't a saint, and maybe also a martyr, though I think the latter is more questionable.
.
Some masons have converted, so I think it is wise to pray for their conversion and for sinners generally.
.
I find the apostolate of St Maxmillian very interesting and some of my searches on his work have been pretty unproductive.

I'm sorry, but the topic was presented to us that the SSPX had created a new Miraculous Medal prayer.

Is this true? If they did, I submit Msgr. Fellay knew about it... and approved of it.

I've heard Bp. Fellay's sermons on Mother Mary's endorsements of the SSPX, coming from children who had visited Rue du Bac chapel, where the Miraclulous Medal apparitions occurred.

Now consider that the Virgin herself drafted the original prayer, for which the new medal was to be struck:

Testimony from St. Catherine Laboure:

"As I was busy contemplating Her, the Blessed Virgin fixed Her eyes upon me, and a voice said in the depths of my heart: ' This globe which you see represents the whole world, especially France, and each person in particular.'

"There now formed around the Blessed Virgin a frame rather oval in shape on which were written in letters of gold these words: ' O Mary conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to Thee.' Then a voice said to me: ' Have a medal struck upon this model. All those who wear it, when it is blessed, will receive great graces especially if they wear it round the neck. Those who repeat this prayer with devotion will be in a special manner under the protection of the Mother of God. Graces will be abundantly bestowed upon those who have confidence.'

"At the same instant, the oval frame seemed to turn around. Then I saw on the back of it the letter 'M', surmounted by a cross, with a crossbar beneath it, and under the monogram of the name of Mary, the Holy Hearts of Jesus and of His Mother; the first surrounded by a crown of thorns and the second transpierced by a sword. I was anxious to know what words must be placed on the reverse side of the medal and after many prayers, one day in meditation I seemed to hear a voice which said to me: ' The 'M' with the Cross and the two Hearts tell enough.' "

"All who wear this medal will receive great graces . . ."

The Miraculous Medal

The Mother of God instructed Catherine that she was to go to her spiritual director, Father Aladel, about the apparitions. At first he did not believe Catherine, but, after two years, approached the Bishop of Paris with the story of the events that had taken place at Rue du Bac. Our Blessed Mother had chosen well Her time for the apparitions as the Bishop at that period was an ardent devotee of the Immaculate Conception. He said that the Medal was in complete conformity with the Church's doctrine on the role of Our Lady and had no objections to having the medals struck at once. The Bishop even asked to be sent some of the first.

Immediately upon receiving them, he put one in his pocket and went to visit Monseigneur de Pradt, former chaplain to Napoleon and unlawful Archbishop of Mechlin who had accepted his office from the hands of the Emperor and now lay dying, defiant and unreconciled to the Church. The sick man refused to abjure his errors and the Bishop of Paris withdrew in defeat. He had not left the house when the dying man suddenly called him back, made his peace with the Church and gently passed away in the arms of the Archbishop, who was filled with a holy joy.

The original order of 20,000 medals proved to be but a small start. The new medals began to pour from the presses in streams inundating France and the rest of the world beyond. By the time of St. Catherine's death in 1876, over a billion medals had been distributed in many lands. This sacramental from Heaven was at first called simply the Medal of the Immaculate Conception, but began to be known as the Miraculous Medal due to the unprecedented number of miracles, conversions, cures, and acts of protection attributed to Our Lady's intercession for those who wore it.

So, if Msgr. Fellay is promoting the new masonic version, he should stop.

It is so reminiscent of newChurch tactics, not unlike JPII who morphed the Rosary.

The Cathinfo forum is based on the premise of the liberalization of the SSPX. We have many proofs of this.

The poster's accusation of the SSPX morphing a traditional Catholic prayer, is right in line with their liberal MO.

Finally, it is somewhat incorrect to just say the "masons", because the whole freemasonic movement is a creation of the Jєωs.
Their dress, decorations and symbology are all inspired by the тαℓмυd.

Better to refer to them as ʝʊdɛօ-masons. This is more accurate.

Neil Obstat · « **Reply #22 on:** October 18, 2017, 01:10:44 PM »

Quote from: TKGS on October 17, 2017, 04:54:21 PM

I usually stay out of the SSPX topics, but I am wondering... Who is it who does not have recourse to the Blessed Virgin? Doesn't everyone on earth have a chance to repent and call upon her for mercy?

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Like everything else, there are two kinds of being in regards to having recourse to Our Lady. One can have recourse in act, or recourse in potency.
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Everyone has recourse in potency, that is, everyone has the possibility of seeking the aid of Our Lady. Nothing can take that away, so everyone has it.
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But in regards to those who actually USE this power, or those who in fact seek auxiliary graces Our Lady offers to everyone, these are the souls who have recourse in act. Whenever you make a prayer to God through the Blessed Virgin Mary, you avail yourself of this power.
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There are unfortunate souls who by an act of their will, choose not to use this power at their disposal, and because of their own choice they do not have recourse in act to the Blessed Virgin. They still have recourse in potency because nothing can change that (nothing in this life, that is -- but it changes at death because no souls in hell can receive her graces anymore).
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Having recourse in potency can be compared to having a fire hose charged with water and the ability to turn it on to extinguish a fire, but by choosing not to turn it on, you allow the fire to continue its destruction unabated. Or imagine jumping out of an airplane in flight, at 20,000 feet elevation, wearing a parachute. You therefore have the potency (the potential ability) of protecting your life by properly using the parachute that's strapped on your back. But if you choose to not pull the rip cord and instead fall to your death, you have not had recourse in act to your parachute, but you did have recourse in potency up until the point where pulling the rip cord would do no good, like at 300 feet off the ground.
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This Militia Immaculatae uses a prayer that hopes to provide a special grace for those who have for whatever reason chosen not to avail themselves of their recourse to the Immaculate Mother of God.
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We have many examples in our age of such graces working in erstwhile unwilling souls. A prominent example is the conversion of Alfonse Ratisbonne, who was a prominent Jєω from an influential family. He had nothing but contempt for the Catholic Faith and made rude insults at anyone who showed devotion to Our Lady. But in a minute of time the Blessed Virgin converted him, without his consent, when all he had done was to agree to wear a Miraculous Medal provided to him by his friend. We have another prominent example at the Miracle of the Sun at Fatima, 1917, when hundreds or perhaps thousands of unbelievers had come for the sole purpose of mocking everyone else and jeering at their ignorance or superstition. They had utterly no intention of being converted or to see or experience anything of a supernatural order. They only wanted to enjoy themselves at the expense of others. But they came away from that event changed people -- that is, at least for the time being. How many of them changed their ways and became faithful Catholics, only God knows.
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Neil Obstat · « **Reply #23 on:** October 18, 2017, 01:22:41 PM »

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A priest once told me that Blessed Maximilian Kolbe offered Mass while he was in prison, but he had to first obtain the host and the wine, which were very hard to come by. And he did not have his Mass prayers written out, so he had to make do with what he could remember by heart.
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There were times when he waited for days until he finally obtained a single crumb of bread and a mere drop of wine, and he used that for offering Mass.
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Marlelar · « **Reply #24 on:** October 18, 2017, 04:53:47 PM »

Quote from: Neil Obstat on October 18, 2017, 01:22:41 PM

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A priest once told me that Blessed Maximilian Kolbe offered Mass while he was in prison, but he had to first obtain the host and the wine, which were very hard to come by. And he did not have his Mass prayers written out, so he had to make do with what he could remember by heart.
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There were times when he waited for days until he finally obtained a single crumb of bread and a mere drop of wine, and he used that for offering Mass.
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Would that be valid?

Incredulous · « **Reply #25 on:** October 18, 2017, 10:01:48 PM »

Quote from: Neil Obstat on October 18, 2017, 01:10:44 PM

We have many examples in our age of such graces working in erstwhile unwilling souls. A prominent example is the conversion of Alfonse Ratisbonne, who was a prominent Jєω from an influential family. He had nothing but contempt for the Catholic Faith and made rude insults at anyone who showed devotion to Our Lady. But in a minute of time the Blessed Virgin converted him, without his consent, when all he had done was to agree to wear a Miraculous Medal provided to him by his friend. We have another prominent example at the Miracle of the Sun at Fatima, 1917, when hundreds or perhaps thousands of unbelievers had come for the sole purpose of mocking everyone else and jeering at their ignorance or superstition. They had utterly no intention of being converted or to see or experience anything of a supernatural order. They only wanted to enjoy themselves at the expense of others. But they came away from that event changed people -- that is, at least for the time being. How many of them changed their ways and became faithful Catholics, only God knows.
.

Ratisbonne, took some steps towards his conversion:
He wore the Miraculous Medal, wrote the Memorare prayer out himself and recited the prayer.

Nadir · « **Reply #26 on:** October 18, 2017, 10:17:51 PM »

Quote from: Marlelar on October 18, 2017, 04:53:47 PM

Would that be valid?

I don't think there's reason to doubt it. If Jesus is present in a crumb that drops from a broken host, then He is present in a crumb that is consecrated by His priest in a prison cell.

Jovita · « **Reply #27 on:** October 23, 2017, 09:43:30 AM »

Quote from: Recusant Sede on October 17, 2017, 05:51:52 PM

Frankly, the whole thing just doesn’t sit right with me. I would like to know why the SSPX is pushing a "NO saint" so fervently? To be clear, Fr. Kolbe may have been a good man and may very well be in heaven, but he did not die a martyr for the Faith. Also, I'm fairly confident that one is NOT allowed to give ones life in exchange for another. One can certainly lose his life defending someone who is being attacked and thus commit a meritorious act, but, I'm pretty sure what Fr. Kolbe did is not approved Catholic teaching.

and yet Christ gave His life for us...

John 15:13Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
13 Greater love than this no man hath, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

Marlelar · « **Reply #28 on:** October 23, 2017, 10:06:09 AM »

Quote from: Recusant Sede on October 17, 2017, 05:51:52 PM

Frankly, the whole thing just doesn’t sit right with me. I would like to know why the SSPX is pushing a "NO saint" so fervently? To be clear, Fr. Kolbe may have been a good man and may very well be in heaven, but he did not die a martyr for the Faith. Also, I'm fairly confident that one is NOT allowed to give ones life in exchange for another. One can certainly lose his life defending someone who is being attacked and thus commit a meritorious act, but, I'm pretty sure what Fr. Kolbe did is not approved Catholic teaching.

I don't think that acts of heroism are forbidden by the church. What Fr. Kolbe did is the same as what any parent or grandparent would do for his child or grandchild, but it did not make him a martyr.

Jovita · « **Reply #29 on:** October 23, 2017, 12:23:34 PM »

If your objection to his sainthood is based on his not being a 'proper' martyr, this was not the sole reason for his beautification. There were/are miracles attributed to him. If your objection is becuase Pope Paul VI and John Paul II had a hand in it...

There are many, many, saints the church does not recognize. Laity chooses to pray for someone who has died after a saintly life. Many times their prayers are answered, miraculously.

You cant just trash someones name because you do not believe they lived up to your standards. You should study the lives of the saints, and venerables, and servants of God.

Author Topic: Militia Immaculate Apostolate of SSPX (Read 3453 times)

Incredulous

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Nadir

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Marlelar

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Nadir

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TKGS

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Incredulous

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Incredulous

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Neil Obstat

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Neil Obstat

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Marlelar

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Incredulous

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Nadir

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Jovita

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Marlelar

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Jovita

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