Author Topic: Micheal Voris  (Read 3188 times)

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Offline jmid

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Micheal Voris
« on: December 10, 2012, 11:44:45 AM »
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  • http://www.blogtalkradio.com/churchmilitanttv/2012/12/06/open-mic-night-with-michael-voris
    Michael Voris has a weekly Internet Radio show; this past week he was taking callers to hear what their opinions were on “What is the biggest problem in the Church”  It was frustrating that not one person pointed to Rome as the culprit. I wasn’t really surprised though, it seems that people in the NO or even Trads have a hard time admitting that the Pope himself is responsible for the horrible crisis facing Mother Church. What accounts for this? Is it psychological? Like an abusive parent, where the children refuse to believe Daddy is a drunken loser and keep yearning for his love?
    Just as the Faith of the Apostles was shaken by the crucifixion, asking “How can this be.” I ask myself the same question , Our Lord tells us “The Gates Of Hell Shall not Prevail” but yet they have prevailed!!!  How can this be?? The Church in every way possible has been overrun. Masons and Homosexuals are now in charge on every level, there is no unity of faith anymore, the church is no longer Holy, she has become a whore, selling herself to the highest bidder. There is no equal in the whole of History of The Church, to the crises we are now facing. We have become like the some poor pathetic beggars asking for some miracle to save us. The Church has been crucified, and yet many people still refuse to believe it, even though the stench is overwhelming. Either the resurrection of The Church needs to happen soon, or we may need to ask ourselves the final question, which is too horrible to even consider.
    Veni, veni Emmanuel;
    Captivum solve Israel,

    Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #1 on: December 10, 2012, 11:49:58 AM »
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  • Excellent post, thank you.  
    Checking out the link now.


    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #2 on: December 10, 2012, 12:18:07 PM »
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  • Quote from: jmid
     
    Just as the Faith of the Apostles was shaken by the crucifixion, asking “How can this be.” I ask myself the same question , Our Lord tells us “The Gates Of Hell Shall not Prevail” but yet they have prevailed!!!  How can this be??


    Then Christ was either in error, or He lied.

    So, God therefore doesn't get it right all the time.  And therefore, it is okay not to believe what He promises to us.  He could even be lying to us about all His promises.

    So, why bother continuing to do anything He wants?  Heaven is a promise from an inconsistent God.  


    ...by your logic.
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline Anthony Benedict

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #3 on: December 10, 2012, 12:29:39 PM »
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  • Jmid, here's one man's "man in the street" sound byte:

    They LIKE the whole Nervous Ordeal regime.  It's painless, it's easy, it's quick as a wink and it FREES them from the "guilt trip" poor ol' granny and grampa were always going on about.

    And, if you join the NO regime in the next five minutes they'll also send along this extra special bonus, free of charge!

    .... You DON'T HAVE TO THINK! NO STUDY!  NO REFLECTION!

    That's right, folks! Never again will you have to think objectively, supernaturally... or even naturally.  You'll be free to cruise down that river with tangerine trees and marmalade skies to your heart's content!  Fr. Flapdoodle and Bp. Bubbles will do ALL the heavy lifting for you!  Amazing? Sure!  But they're happy to do it FOR you! Just relax your mind and float downstream....

    Who cares if you haven't heard from the pulpit a discouraging word since the Nixon Administration or been to Confession since Jimmy Carter? Hey, we're past all THAT, now, right?

    Lenin, Stalin, Kruschchev, Brezhnev, Andropov - the lot!, are either screaming in paroxysms of fiery agony right now as the other demons torment them with mockery over how they should have thought of this scam themselves, or....

    they're hoisting a few volcanic draughts to each other, toasting their success!

    ( And, there may may more than a bit to substantiate the latter... )

    Dos vidanya, Tovarisch!

    Offline Marlelar

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #4 on: December 10, 2012, 01:25:36 PM »
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  • Quote from: jmid
    Our Lord tells us “The Gates Of Hell Shall not Prevail” but yet they have prevailed!!!  How can this be?? The Church in every way possible has been overrun. Masons and Homosexuals are now in charge on every level, there is no unity of faith anymore, the church is no longer Holy, she has become a whore, selling herself to the highest bidder. There is no equal in the whole of History of The Church, to the crises we are now facing.


    I do not believe that the gates of Hell have prevailed, I think it is only the "institution of the Vatican" that has been overwhelmed, the true Church, those who live by and pass on the actual of the deposit of faith, is still as strong as ever. It's just that the true faith is not widely followed anymore and and it is harder to pass on to a stiff necked people.

    The Church overcame Arianism, which was probably worse than what we are going through now, so do not lose heart, Christ will triumph as he promised; he is neither a deceiver nor a liar.

    Marsha


    Offline Alex117

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #5 on: December 10, 2012, 01:53:17 PM »
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  • Michael Voris. Bah humbug.

    Mr. Voris was very inspirational to me when I was a NO Catholic, but I've become disillusioned with him after I started going to traditional Latin Masses. It's like his theology is right, his zeal is right, and theeeeeeen he says something stupid like, "Vatican II wasn't the problem - the people's interpretation of Vatican II was the problem!"

    And then it's like aw man, you were so close! So close! Just take that one last step into being a traditionalist! Come on! You can do it!

    He seems like the kind of guy I was a year ago - an ardent lover of tradition, and yet I never said how I really felt about the NO and I didn't go to the TLM because, well, I wanted to be "obedient". I bet Michael Voris attends Mass performed by the FSSP, and he'd probably make a great member over at Fish Eaters. I just hope that one day he throws his lot in with the Society, and starts putting his zeal into tackling the root of our current crisis, and not just its symptoms.

    Offline jmid

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #6 on: December 10, 2012, 02:37:31 PM »
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  • LARAMIE – Exactly, that’s the unthinkable, that is why the resurrection must happen soon.
    Marlelar said-“I do not believe that the gates of Hell have prevailed, I think it is only the "institution of the Vatican" that has been overwhelmed, the true Church, those who live by and pass on the actual of the deposit of faith, is still as strong as ever. The Church overcame Arianism, which was probably worse than what we are going through now, so do not lose heart, Christ will triumph as he promised; he is neither a deceiver nor a liar. “
    How can you only the Vatican? Just about every NO parish preaches heresey, or has a Homosexual priest running the show. I can’t think of one, solid, orthodox Bishop in the whole USA !!! (Outside of the few Trad Bishops, who of course are not tolerated in the NO) No offense , but you must live in a cave in the middle of nowheresville to think the” faith is as strong as ever” !! The large majority of Catholics don’t even believe in the most basic tenets of The Faith. Divorce, promiscuity, and paganism is the norm now.
    As far as The Arian Crisis, I believe it is much worse now, for just a few the following reasons.(I could write a few thousand page book listing the examples)
    1.   We have had 5 successive Popes with heretical modernist tendencies.( They all actually took an oath to avoid Modernism !!)
    2.   Although I believe there was a Pope who burned incense to The Roman Gods, never before in history have we had two successive Popes, along with just about every Bishop in the world, encourage and actually engage in worship to false gods!!
    3.   Never before in history have we had to witness the weekly blasphemies at NO masses around the world. (Women on the altar, communion in the hand, heresy promoted  from the pulpit……the list is endless!!)
    4.   The constant promotion and elevation of Homosexuals, Modernists ,Masons to the highest offices of The Church.
    5.   Divorces officially granted by The Church, to couples that have been married in The Church for many years with children.

    Offline jmid

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #7 on: December 10, 2012, 02:45:09 PM »
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  • Exactly Alex,

    But I am sure most of us were at where is at right now. He just hasn't had that "moment" yet we he finally has to admit that yeaaa Rome is full of crap.


    Offline Dellery

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #8 on: December 10, 2012, 03:03:14 PM »
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  •  Some executive from Real Catholic TV accused trads of being Protestant over on Fisheaters, Jitprig posting as Jackson K. Eskew provoked the response. It's almost as if he knew Voris and co. were browsing there.

    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #9 on: December 10, 2012, 03:09:05 PM »
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  • Quote from: Dellery
    Some executive from Real Catholic TV accused trads of being Protestant over on Fisheaters, Jitprig posting as Jackson K. Eskew provoked the response. It's almost as if he knew Voris and co. were browsing there.


    Links?
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline Dellery

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #10 on: December 10, 2012, 03:15:48 PM »
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  • Quote
    I believe I have raised the rhetorical question whether it is always good, or charitable, to tell a truth that may cause more harm than good?  Not that we should learn truth and wisdom from commercials on TV, but is one really commanded to tell one's wife that this dress makes her look fat just because it's the truth?

    So what IS the "truth" about Assisi?  At its most objective and stripped of all editorializing, at Assisi the Pope invited religious leaders from around the world to come together and pray for peace.  Since this an objectively true statement, it goes far to explain why the secular media ignored it almost completely, and why it would be considered a "page 5" news item even in the Catholic press.  It's pretty boring, isn't it?

    What makes it interesting to the Protestant Traditionalists in this forum is that, at Assisi, the Pope MIGHT give the impression that he considers all religions to be of equal value.  Of course, this impression would be FALSE because the Pope, if asked, would say that all religions are NOT of equal value (as he articulated in Dominus Iesus).  Since the Pope does not teach that all religions are of equal value, then any impression that he is so teaching is just plain FALSE.

    Okay.  Now it can be asked "if you consider this story rather boring and that false impressions about the Assisi event are easily refuted, then why didn't you run a story on it?"  How about "Because the positive content of this story is about as interesting as any of several papal visits to various sites in Italy and because there is the potential for misunderstanding (as demonstrated by those who find fault with almost anything the Pope does, who create problems that they can look faithful and pious in the solving) that would make the net value of this story to be negative rather than positive."  How's that?

    People here in this Forum have reacted to Assisi as an event well beyond its actual importance.  Sure, it was important to the Pope to do this, just as it seems to be important to have the Pope add prestige by his presence at  countless events.  This story was and is almost NOTHING almost EVERYWHERE.  Only the Protestant Traditionalists are reacting to this story as if it were comparable to selling indulgences to build St. Peter's basilica!

    It's really astonishing how many "out of context" platitudes can be marched out to attack both prudence and common sense.  Can anyone take seriously that St. Thomas Aquinas would be thinking about an event like Assisi when he said "If people are scandalized at the Truth, it is better to allow the birth of scandal, than to abandon the Truth."  Is the Assisi event even a "Truth"?  Or is the Assisi event a scandal primarily because it serves the agenda of those who purport to defend the Faith and want to reinforce their reasons for not being in communion with the Church?  If it weren't for the existence of people who have already rejected the authority of the Pope and seek to justify their rejection by accumulating examples of papal malfeasance, ineptitude and perceived heterodoxy, the Assisi event wouldn't even appear on most radars.  The Assisi event is not "Truth."  It was an event that can be described objectively as "world religious leaders come together to pray for peace."  For reasons that I do not judge honorable, the Assisi event has been made into an occasion of scandal when the entire event could have taken place and passed into history with nary a whimper.

    We judged the Assisi event as not newsworthy.  I don't think we even covered it as a news item, which could have been done objectively but for the poisonous context which had already been created for its reception.  If everyone had let this event pass without notice, it wouldn't have been noticed and couldn't have caused any scandal.  But because of the hyperventilating of Protestant Traditionalists, the story became toxic and couldn't even be covered fairly and objectively.

    The more important issue, to me, has become how blindingly obvious it is that the voices in this Forum whose raison d'etre seems to be attacking "The Pope and his Church" behind a pretense of loving and defending the Truth have spectacular parallels with early Protestantism!  Luther et al attacked "The Pope and his Church" for teaching error, thus forfeiting any authoritative legitimacy in Rome.  They had their pet issues which they defended by appeal to an authority other than "The Pope and his Church," namely Scripture.  The Protestant Traditionalists use Tradition and the Magisterium (the historical record) against "The Pope and his Church."  Unlike Luther et al, because of advances in modern technology, today's Protestant Traditionalists have their own "house organs" (book publishers and magazines), conferences that cater to their issues featuring speakers who who absolutely MUST reinforce the virtue of bashing "The Pope and his Church," and even validly ordained clergy to celebrate liturgies that are disconnected from the authority of the Roman Catholic Church.  Most likely, as with early Protestantism, these separatist tendencies will continue until the definition of a truly separate and new Christian denomination will be more obvious.  Right now, the Protestant Traditionalists don't perceive themselves so much as "outside the Church" as "we are the real Catholic Church" and what everyone else thought was the Catholic Church has become a "false" ("Conciliar") church."  The parallels are striking and, to me, tragic.

    So, no, we didn't cover the Assisi event.  Perhaps we could have if the well hadn't been so thoroughly poisoned in advance.  But since the well was poisoned, it was prudent to ignore the story for the good of souls.  Yes, the story was "true," but it isn't always virtuous to tell the truth.  It's never a virtue to lie.  But you shouldn't always tell the truth.  Sometimes silence is the more virtuous course.

    Not all the voices in this Forum are Protestant.  But the loudest ones are.

    Terry Carroll
    Executive Producer
    RealCatholicTV.com


    http://catholicforum.fisheaters.com/index.php?action=profile;u=1142220;sa=showPosts


    Offline jmid

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #11 on: December 10, 2012, 03:41:17 PM »
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  • Wow, that is very disturbing !! If the Bishop of New York held the same exact event in NYC they would have been all over it, but because it was The Pope who did this, they are afraid to touch it. That is the typical Neo-Catholic thinking that I was talking about in my first post. There is something psychological that just makes these people disconnect with reality. The evil one scored a huge victory when he finally got The Papacy in his grasp. If you point out the obvious, well then you are a Protestant, if you just go along, you lose the Faith.
    I read on Angelqueen a post fron the Voris camp, the same type of diatribe calling the SSPX schismatic, blah,blah,blah...but you gotta think that sooner or later logic has to catch with these people.
    What drives me nuts is these people will go to Trad Chapels!! It just doesn't make sense? If they really bought into this schismatic, protestant name calling stuff , then why not just stay at some "conservative NO"??

    With all that being said....I still like the guy!!! Maybe I'm losing it  :tinfoil:

    Offline ggreg

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #12 on: December 10, 2012, 03:47:02 PM »
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  • Quote from: Dellery
    Some executive from Real Catholic TV accused trads of being Protestant over on Fisheaters, Jitprig posting as Jackson K. Eskew provoked the response. It's almost as if he knew Voris and co. were browsing there.


    Fisheaters is to the right of Real Catholic TV (on average).

    RCTV won't cover Assisi, Fatima's Third Secret or ever suggest the buck stops at the top in relation to many of the Church's problems.

    In that sense RCTC is pretty impotent.  Bishop so and so did this, how terrible!"  [ The only person who can do anything about it, is completely inert but we won't bring that up].  Next week, rinse repeat.  "Oh dear!  Write letters and complain to the chancery".

    Eventually people will either lose heart or look deeper at the problem.  

    If that was their game then it would be succeeding.  I suspect however they are mentally stuck at reaching the conclusions that common sense will take you to.

    I'd like to see what their long term subscrition renewals look like.  I bet people subscribe for a year, maybe two and then move on.

    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #13 on: December 10, 2012, 04:07:34 PM »
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  • Wow!  I had no idea those folks paid attention to the Fisheaters.  I wonder if any of them read my posts.
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Micheal Voris
    « Reply #14 on: December 10, 2012, 05:59:49 PM »
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  • Quote from: ggreg
    Quote from: Dellery
    Some executive from Real Catholic TV accused trads of being Protestant over on Fisheaters, Jitprig posting as Jackson K. Eskew provoked the response. It's almost as if he knew Voris and co. were browsing there.


    Fisheaters is to the right of Real Catholic TV (on average).

    RCTV won't cover Assisi, Fatima's Third Secret or ever suggest the buck stops at the top in relation to many of the Church's problems.

    In that sense RCTC is pretty impotent.  Bishop so and so did this, how terrible!"  [ The only person who can do anything about it, is completely inert but we won't bring that up].  Next week, rinse repeat.  "Oh dear!  Write letters and complain to the chancery".

    Eventually people will either lose heart or look deeper at the problem.  

    If that was their game then it would be succeeding.  I suspect however they are mentally stuck at reaching the conclusions that common sense will take you to.

    I'd like to see what their long term subscrition renewals look like.  I bet people subscribe for a year, maybe two and then move on.


    Perhaps true but I know there are members who are practically life
    members, not because they're in need of it, but because they think that
    RCTV is doing an important work of spiritual mercy:  instructing the ignorant.


    You've go to keep in mind where the standard deviation is on the
    bell curve KWIM?  And the skew factor --- or the "eeeeww factor."


    Maybe you don't need it, but there are a lot of others out there that do,
    and if Voris is putting out a product that cracks that nut, then there is
    some hope for the future.  What would there be without him?

    EWTN?  TAN Books?  The Remnant?  

    Might as well be Circle Media or The Tidings. ...........  Or DICI ... HAHAHAHA

    woops..   that's not funny...............


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