Author Topic: Marital Act During Pregnancy (Read 17886 times)

nctradcath · « **Reply #30 on:** July 19, 2016, 05:14:36 PM »

Is eating an ice cream cone for desert gluttony? I eat ice cream purely for pleasure as in I can eat 100 other things for nutrition.

St Ignatius · « **Reply #31 on:** July 19, 2016, 05:35:47 PM »

Quote from: Geremia

Pleasure in the marital act is not to be shunned; nor should it be sought. It's analogous to food: eating for pleasure is gluttony.

It's called appetite. One is for the survival of the body, and the later is for the survival of the human race.

This is the way it was presented to me on a Marriage retreat years ago.

Geremia · « **Reply #32 on:** July 20, 2016, 02:38:50 PM »

Quote from: St Ignatius

It's called appetite. One is for the survival of the body, and the later is for the survival of the human race.

This is the way it was presented to me on a Marriage retreat years ago.

Appetites are good as long as they are subjected to and ordered by reason.

Geremia · « **Reply #33 on:** July 20, 2016, 02:42:31 PM »

Quote from: nctradcath

Is eating an ice cream cone for desert gluttony?

Ice cream has nutritional value, but if you eat it solely for pleasure, then, yes, eating ice cream would be gluttony.

Summa Theologica II-II q. 148 a. 1 ("Whether gluttony is a sin?):

Quote from: corpus

Gluttony denotes, not any desire of eating and drinking, but an inordinate desire. Now desire is said to be inordinate through leaving the order of reason, wherein the good of moral virtue consists: and a thing is said to be a sin through being contrary to virtue. Wherefore it is evident that gluttony is a sin.

Also:

Quote from: ad 2

the vice of gluttony does not regard the substance of food, but in the desire thereof not being regulated by reason. Wherefore if a man exceed in quantity of food, not from desire of food, but through deeming it necessary to him, this pertains, not to gluttony, but to some kind of inexperience. It is a case of gluttony only when a man knowingly exceeds the measure in eating, from a desire for the pleasures of the palate.

nctradcath · « **Reply #34 on:** July 20, 2016, 02:48:25 PM »

Could you argue that ice cream should not be sold because eating it would probably be gluttonous in 99 percent of cases. Thier really is no other point to it than pleasure.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #35 on:** July 20, 2016, 02:55:41 PM »

It's all about order.

Ice Cream Tastes Good

Good Taste Makes Me Happy and Satisfies Me

Being Happy and Satisfied Lifts My Spirits

Lifted Spirits Can Bring Me Closer to God

Geremia · « **Reply #36 on:** July 20, 2016, 03:16:26 PM »

Quote from: nctradcath

Could you argue that ice cream should not be sold because eating it would probably be gluttonous in 99 percent of cases. Thier really is no other point to it than pleasure.

Ice cream in itself is always good; every creature is good (Gen. 1:31, pace the Manicheans and Albigensians). As St. Thomas wrote, "the vice of gluttony does not regard the substance of food, but in the desire thereof not being regulated by reason."

nctradcath · « **Reply #37 on:** July 21, 2016, 08:07:59 AM »

Have you honestly eaten ice cream for any other reason than the pleasure it gave you?

nctradcath · « **Reply #38 on:** July 21, 2016, 08:09:06 AM »

We can use the example of candy. The sole purpose of candy is to give pleasure to the palate as it had no nutritional value.

Geremia · « **Reply #39 on:** July 21, 2016, 12:07:43 PM »

Quote from: nctradcath

The sole purpose of candy is to give pleasure to the palate as it had no nutritional value.

Chewing gum has very little, if any, nutritional value, much less than candy. At least candy has calories (which is important for those trying to gain weight).

Geremia · « **Reply #40 on:** July 21, 2016, 12:08:59 PM »

Quote from: nctradcath

Have you honestly eaten ice cream for any other reason than the pleasure it gave you?

Yes, to gain weight or to finish it off before it gets old, so it doesn't go to waste.

mw2016 · « **Reply #41 on:** July 21, 2016, 12:43:46 PM »

This is for the overly scrupulous fool on this thread:

Ladislaus · « **Reply #42 on:** July 21, 2016, 03:18:11 PM »

Quote from: Ladislaus

It's all about order.

Ice Cream Tastes Good

Good Taste Makes Me Happy and Satisfies Me

Being Happy and Satisfied Lifts My Spirits

Lifted Spirits Can Bring Me Closer to God

Based on this, I eat ice cream for my spiritual well being.

So, for instance, if we are rejoicing on a Holy Day (say, Christmas), we actually should NOT be fasting. And the pleasure of a nice dessert helps lift our spirits. Joy is a gift from God to lift us up towards Him. It can give us renewed energy to seek Him more. God doesn't will that the pursuit of Him be always filled with vinegar and gall.

Zeitun · « **Reply #43 on:** July 22, 2016, 06:07:17 AM »

Quote from: Amakusa

Theologians and moralists teach that sɛҳuąƖity during pregnancy or after menopause is a venial sin.

Maybe so but modern women go into menopause earlier (some in their 30's). Does this mean that the wife's menopause at age 38 binds the husband as well? Oh boy....that's ball of wax.

Pax Vobis · « **Reply #44 on:** July 22, 2016, 08:34:48 AM »

If a couple found out they were sterile, then relations would be a venial sin every time, since conception can't take place, right? Of course not.

There are various theological viewpoints, but what matters is the final decision of the Church. There were theologians who thought Our Lady wasn't immaculately conceived but they were wrong.