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Author Topic: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints  (Read 4005 times)

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Offline poche

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Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2017, 04:37:38 AM »
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  • Isn't St Teresa Benedicta considered to be a martyr?
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    But if she was "put to death because of who her ancestors were" then that would negate her martyr status.  
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    You can't have it both ways. She died for the faith or she died "because of who her ancestors were".
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    Nobody denies that she died in a cσncєnтrαтισn cαмρ, what is questioned here is that she "died in the gas chambers".   It's the gas chambers which are disputed.
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    Short excerpt from a long article: http://www.ihr.org/leaflets/auschwitz.shtml
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    Survivor Testimony
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    Former inmates have confirmed that they saw no evidence of extermination at Auschwitz.
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    An Austrian woman, Maria Vanherwaarden, testified about her camp experiences in a Toronto District Court in March 1988. [16] She was interned in Auschwitz-Birkenau in 1942 for having sɛҳuąƖ relations with a Polish forced laborer. On the train journey to the camp, a Gypsy woman told her and the others that they would all be gassed at Auschwitz. Upon arrival, Maria and the other women were ordered to undress and go into a large concrete room without windows to take a shower. The terrified women were sure that they were about to die. But then, instead of gas, water came out of the shower heads.
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    Auschwitz was no vacation resort, Maria confirmed. She witnessed the deaths of many fellow inmates by disease, particularly typhus. She saw some take their own lives. But she saw no evidence at all of mass killings, gassings, or of any extermination program.
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    A Jєωιѕн woman named Marika Frank arrived at Auschwitz-Birkenau from Hungary in July 1944, when 25,000 Jєωs were supposedly gassed and cremated daily. She likewise testified after the war that she heard and saw nothing of gas chambers
    during the time she was interned there. She heard the gassing stories only later. [17]
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    Inmates Released
    More than 200,000 prisoners were transferred from Auschwitz to other camps, and about 8,000 were in the camp when it was liberated by Soviet forces. In addition, about 1,500 prisoners who had served their sentences were released, and returned to their home countries. [18] If Auschwitz had actually been a top secret extermination center, it is difficult to believe that the German authorities would have released inmates who "knew" what was happening there.
    I did not say that she was a martyr for the Faith. She and her sister were victim souls for the conversion of her people. By all objective standards her and her sister's death was unjust.   


    Offline kiwiboy

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #16 on: September 19, 2017, 04:58:25 AM »
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  • oh boy, this whole promotion of Edith stein looks very suspicious.
    Eclipses neither prove nor disprove the flat earth.

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    Offline OHCA

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #17 on: September 19, 2017, 07:33:19 AM »
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  • She and her sister were victim souls for the conversion of her people. 
    How so?

    Offline DZ PLEASE

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #18 on: September 19, 2017, 08:18:18 AM »
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  • Quote
    ~
    ... if she was "... put to death because of who her ancestors were... ", then that would negate her martyr status.  
    .
    You can't have it both ways; she died for the faith, or she died "because of who her ancestors were".
    Causation, Scholasts' Analysis of (via newadvent.org)
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #19 on: September 19, 2017, 09:01:56 AM »
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  • Now, are there any Jєωιѕн convert who became Catholic saints, apart from St Teresa Benedicta?

    Francis Libermann has not been canonized but was declared venerable.
    Quote
    Francis Mary Paul Libermann (French: François-Marie-Paul Libermann; born Jacob Libermann; 14 April 1802 – 2 February 1852) was a 19th-century French Jєωιѕн convert to Catholicism who was a member of the Spiritan order. He is best known for founding the Congregation of the Immaculate Heart of Mary which later merged with the Congregation of the Holy Ghost. He is often referred to as "The Second Founder of the Holy Ghost Fathers". He was declared venerable in the Roman Catholic Church on 1 June 1876, by Pope Pius IX.
    See more here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Libermann

    I don't expect to see the canonization process of Francis Libermann completed in the current "climate" in Rome.  It is offensive to Jєωs to act like the conversion of Jєωs to Catholicism is a good thing which is just what such a canonization would imply.  So the lack of canonization  is probably more due to Vatican politics than a reflection on the holiness of Fr. Libermann.

    (By the way, there is an SSPX connection. Archbishop Lefebvre was Superior General of the Holy Ghost Fathers for some years before he resigned over changes to the order in response to Vatican II.)


    Offline poche

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #20 on: September 19, 2017, 10:35:25 PM »
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  • How so?
    Sr. Benedicta of the Cross and her sister were at the convent in occupied Holland when the order came for her and her sister's arrest. When the police came to the convent Sr. Benedicta, said to her sister, "Come sister, let us die for our people" Those were the last words heard in the convent by St. Benedicta of the Cross.   

    Offline OHCA

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #21 on: September 20, 2017, 01:05:21 AM »
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  • Sr. Benedicta of the Cross and her sister were at the convent in occupied Holland when the order came for her and her sister's arrest. When the police came to the convent Sr. Benedicta, said to her sister, "Come sister, let us die for our people" Those were the last words heard in the convent by St. Benedicta of the Cross.  
    The fairytale is cute.  But I don't see how it makes them  "victim souls for the conversion of [their] people."

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #22 on: September 20, 2017, 04:44:47 AM »
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  • I did not say that she was a martyr for the Faith. She and her sister were victim souls for the conversion of her people. By all objective standards her and her sister's death was unjust.  
    No but the Vatican did.
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    I am sure she was very concerned for the conversion of her family. But to call her "victim soul" is pushing it a bit. Now doubt they were victims of injustice. Nobody is disputing that. 
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    As Jaynek pointed out it's not likely that Francis Liberman will be canonised in the current "climate" in Rome, and that is because he does not serve the purposes of the Jєωs. Not that Sr Teresa is any way to blame for that.
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
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    Offline poche

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #23 on: September 20, 2017, 04:45:55 AM »
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  • oh boy, this whole promotion of Edith stein looks very suspicious.
    The question was, "Who were the Jєωιѕн converts who became saints?" Why is that suspicious?

    Offline poche

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #24 on: September 20, 2017, 04:47:44 AM »
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  • The fairytale is cute.  But I don't see how it makes them "victim souls for the conversion of [their] people."
    When she offered her unjust imprisonment and death for the conversion of her people.
    Don't you think it is good to pray for the conversion of the Jєωs?

    Offline JPaul

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #25 on: September 20, 2017, 07:42:02 AM »
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  • When she offered her unjust imprisonment and death for the conversion of her people.
    Don't you think it is good to pray for the conversion of the Jєωs?
    Tell that to the conciliarists around you who refuse to pray for the conversion of the Jєωs, tell it to Francis who prays in their own blasphemous ceremonies with them instead.


    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #26 on: September 20, 2017, 08:11:52 AM »
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  • Tell that to the conciliarists around you who refuse to pray for the conversion of the Jєωs, tell it to Francis who prays in their own blasphemous ceremonies with them instead.
    Well said.  This is a huge problem.  

    When I was very new to traditional Catholicism, just starting to explore it by reading Angelqueen forum, I came to realize how important it was to pray for the conversion of Jєωs and how this teaching had been obscured in recent times.  
    I went to my closest SSPX chapel for the first time to ask for a Mass to be said for the conversion of Jєωs because I did not trust anyone else to do it.  I had a good talk with the priest there and that is how I first heard about Francis Libermann.

    Offline OHCA

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #27 on: September 20, 2017, 08:53:00 AM »
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  • The question was, "Who were the Jєωιѕн converts who became saints?" Why is that suspicious?
    Because she was "canonized" by new church, and, no less than, by one who would ultimately become a doubtful sAint himself. Her very public beatification occurred complete with an (((NWO))) themed hogwash narrative about an improbable method alleged regarding her death.

    Offline DZ PLEASE

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    • "Lord, have mercy."
    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #28 on: September 20, 2017, 09:43:25 AM »
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  • When I was very new to traditional Catholicism, just starting to explore it by reading Angelqueen forum, I came to realize how important it was to pray for the conversion of Jєωs and how this teaching had been obscured...
    "Obscure", Definition of:

    "Contradict", Definition of:

    "Oppose", Definition of:

    s.a. "Heteropraxy", "Gradualism" and "Hegelian Dialectics"
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Jєωιѕн converts who became Catholic saints
    « Reply #29 on: September 20, 2017, 10:06:51 AM »
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  • And let's not forget these holy Jєωs...



    St. Pope JPII (Mother "Katz" was a polish Jєωess convert)


    Holy pope Giovanni Montini


    Wearing the rabbinic ephod
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi