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Author Topic: IsSacrament of Confession  (Read 2463 times)

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Online Ladislaus

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Re: IsSacrament of Confession
« Reply #15 on: October 04, 2019, 04:24:53 AM »
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  • If I take Maria Regina’s advice regarding the possibility of priests from the 1920s onward being imposters, the last validly 100% sure, validly baptized person in my family was my grandmother, born and baptized 1916.  There is no reasonable means of discovering if the priests who baptized my parents were priests, no way of finding if the priest who baptized me was a priest, no way of investigating the background of every single priest from whom my grandparents, parents, myself were true priests, how many Sacraments were invalid, or if anyone after my grandmother was or is truly Catholic.  

    This makes a great case for staying “home alone.”  In fact, all but one person in my extended family stays home alone.  He goes to the novus ordo when his health allows, once every few months, but getting less frequent.  One of the home alone members reads the traditional missal and tries to listen to a sermon from the Sunday following on line.  The remaining members, many, many, scattered to the winds stay home, go out, go shopping, play sports, work, do whatever they want because they were doubtfully baptized but never religious.  The vast majority weren’t baptized and belong to the most common American creed known as, “no religion.”

    Please don't give in to negative doubt.  Unless there's a specific reason to doubt a specific priest, they are presumed valid, and theologians all agree that God "will take care of it" in His Providence.  This is NOT a reason for home-alone-ism.

    Offline claudel

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    Re: Is Sacrament of Confession
    « Reply #16 on: October 15, 2019, 02:12:37 PM »
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  • The Novus Ordo is a "new rite of the Mass". It is not the Sacrament of Penance.

    I would be astonished that you were given a down thumb for this simple statement of fact were it not for another fact: a sizable number of CI denizens evidently think that truth can in some way be brushed aside by a mere expression of dislike!


    Offline claudel

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    Re: Is Sacrament of Confession
    « Reply #17 on: October 15, 2019, 02:39:40 PM »
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  • Please don't give in to negative doubt.  Unless there's a specific reason to doubt a specific priest, they are presumed valid, and theologians all agree that God "will take care of it" in His Providence.  This is NOT a reason for home-alone-ism.

    Seconded in toto.

    In addition, even within the context of Maria Regina's highly questionable conclusions, Seraphina's initial premise is defective. Every Catholic ought to know that though a priest may be the ordinary minister of the sacrament of Baptism, any person who has reached the age of reason can be a licit minister of the sacrament. He or she need only speak the appropriate formula while performing the required action for presumptive validity to be present.

    Offline Motorede

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    Re: IsSacrament of Confession
    « Reply #18 on: October 15, 2019, 03:26:57 PM »
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  • If the priest is valid, the Novus Ordo form of Confession is undoubtedly valid ... if the priest sticks to it.

    If he says, "I absolve you in the name of the Father and (of the) Son and (of the) Holy Spirit." then the Sacrament is validly performed.
    And were the priest to say: "I forgive you your sins in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost"? Opinion? I would guess valid.

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: IsSacrament of Confession
    « Reply #19 on: October 15, 2019, 03:35:54 PM »
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  • And were the priest to say: "I forgive you your sins in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost"? Opinion? I would guess valid.

    I can't recall whether theologians said this was valid or doubtful.  My guess also is that this would be valid.  But perhaps someone else recalls otherwise.


    Offline forlorn

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    Re: IsSacrament of Confession
    « Reply #20 on: October 15, 2019, 05:01:17 PM »
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  • What about new Last Rites?