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Author Topic: Holy Mens Hair  (Read 2404 times)

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Offline EcceAgnusDei

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Holy Mens Hair
« on: August 30, 2010, 03:38:48 PM »
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  • This might be a stupid question but I've been wondering and I haven't been able to find an answer. If women are supposed to have long hair and men short, why are Jesus, Joseph, and other holy men portrayed as having long hair?


    Offline Emerentiana

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    Holy Mens Hair
    « Reply #1 on: August 30, 2010, 04:10:12 PM »
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  • The length of hair is customary .  Today, for men to wear long hair associates them with the rebellious element of society.  In Jesus day, I think all men wore long hair.  
    I havent heard that  for men to wear  long  hair  is sinful today.  Women today can wear their hair any length they want.  I have very short hair, and I know many trad women that wear it that way.


    Offline MyrnaM

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    « Reply #2 on: August 30, 2010, 04:46:59 PM »
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  • I was taught that the rich men, had short hair in the days of Jesus.  He was poor, and therefore His hair was allowed to grow because of means.

    A women, her hair is her crowing glory, which is why it is covered when in prayer, according to the Bible.  I can't imagine Our Lady with short hair, which is why mine is very long, even at my age of 70.  I am sure if it were sinful for women to have short hair, we would hear if from our priest.  I have never heard that.  It is just what you prefer and the custom.  My mom age 95 likes her hair short, but her mother died at age 98 with very long hair.  

    I don't think it is sinful either for a man to allow his hair to grow a longer length.  I have never heard it was.  

    Although I will say, my daughter-in-law, her son had very long hair, at the age of 5 because of her Indian heritage.  The Mount would not allow him to enter kindergarten till she cut it, and she did cut it so now he stays with me so he can go to the Mount.  His parents live in Reno NV.  the Mount is in Spokane Wa.   He is so cute with his short hair now.  
    Please pray for my soul.
    R.I.P. 8/17/22

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    Offline Dulcamara

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    Holy Mens Hair
    « Reply #3 on: August 30, 2010, 06:26:21 PM »
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  • I have never heard it is sinful to have short hair as a woman, but I would wholeheartedly agree that it's probably not exactly a good thing.

    In this day and age, femininity is attack from all angles. It's easy for a woman to work like a man, dress like a man, wear her hair like a man, talk like the worst of men... In short, it's easy for her to totally cast off everything that she had about herself to remind herself that she is, in fact, a WOMAN, and that she needs to have the dignity and virtue a woman ought to have, and that she ought to conduct herself as a woman should. Those external reminders, I think, are not only under-appreciated today, but scorned outright as "things of the past". Dresses?! Not for me! Cooking?! You've GOT to be kidding me! Raising kids?! No way!

    But look at the issue of Communion in the hand, standing. One of the biggest reasons (after that it's disrespectful to God directly to handle His sacred Body as if it were nothing but common bread) that it is wrong, is that we know external actions or signs or what have you, really and truly effect the way we believe, the way we think about things. His Excellency Bishop Fellay remarked in a talk once (in so many words), that we do not kneel to a piece of bread. We kneel to someONE... and someone who is definitely NOT equal to ourselves. But, he was saying (again in so many words), when people handle the Host as if it were nothing but bread, then it is no wonder why people end up not believing that it is anything else, and not acting as if it were anything else. And of course, to prove it, the percent of Catholics who still really, truly believe that the Host is the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ, our Lord and our God... is scandalously low. Even though it is a principal tenant of the Catholic Faith.

    I would theorize that what women have been doing... that is, how they have been living, dressing, acting, talking and so forth... can be no different. The psychology of it is exactly the same. If women cut their hair off like men, and dress in pants like men, and work like men, and try to take positions of authority like men, and talk like (again, the worst of) men, and act like men... In short, if they LIVE like men, they will indeed believe they are, and should be, no different. The problem is, this is FALSE. We ARE different. But if we remove every external reminder that could possibly help us to remember what we are and how we should behave and so on, then it is no wonder if we end up acting like men, and not only like men, but like the very worst of men, because there is something about our fallen human nature, that once a person throws off some initial restraint, they quite often end up by going totally overboard in that same direction. Thus, many women come to not only simply "choose not to" behave or dress or conduct themselves like women at all (let alone virtuous women), but they end up by having utter contempt for everything womanly to the extent of hating and scoffing at it, and finally, they not only try to become "men" (act just like men), but they very often end up being even worse (more shameless) than the men when they do. Kind of like when Moses was gone too long, the people with him didn't just turn around and leave and go back to where they came from, nor did they just appoint themselves another human leader, and have a drink on it. They threw off the authority of Moses, threw off the worship of the only true God, made themselves an idol, and did the Sodom and Gomorrah thing (got drunk and did probably every sinful thing they could do at the time).

    That being said, I myself have short hair. Two reasons I keep my hair short are that 1) I have virtually no energy, let alone energy to waste taking care of it, and 2) since I've dedicated myself to God for life, I not only do not have to worry about attracting a man, but I had better hope I do NOT attract one. If it wouldn't look like lunacy (or like I was a muslem), I'd probably wear a veil or a scarf. So I won't say that there is never, ever a good reason for a woman to excuse herself. But what I will say is, all women would do very well to stop looking to excuse themselves, and instead to do as much as they can in the other direction, even if it's hard, because we need as many reminders as we can get of what we ought to be, not only in terms of womanliness, but in terms of womanly VIRTUE, as well. But out of sight, out of mind...

    Once we realize that as we act, so we will believe (and the other way around, incidentally), we begin to realize that the more feminine things we women can cram into our lives, the better off we're likely to be. We need more desperately than ever to be reminded to behave ourselves as women should, and not as the world tempts us to... like immoral male slobs (not even like good men).

    Frankly, I think women need to be all-out "rehabilitated" from what the world has done to most of us, and it's not something you'll get done by living like a man 24/7. We are, when all is said and done, NATURALLY WOMEN. Therefore, anything we do, or any life we live that deprives us or takes out of us that which is natural to us... to our femininity... is in a sense UNNATURAL. In that sense, you could probably argue it is also bad, if not wrong. What we need, though, is to go the other direction, back toward femininity, not to keep excusing ourselves and looking for reasons not to do it.

    And if it weren't for my vow, I'd probably grow my hair down to my ankles just to spite the unholy movement (of women trying to be men).

    As for men with long hair... that's a bit of a bigger question. If it turns him into a feminized dope, standing at the mirror for an hour every morning with the comb and hair spray... then no, it's probably not a good thing. But then again, even men with short hair are in danger of that vice. BUT... if the men were all throwing off their manhood en masse, so that all of them almost universally were dressing like bar-maids and talking like them, and staying at home and cooking like women, and in short trying to BE women in everything they could think of... then I would say every bit as strongly that growing their hair like women would be just another bad move for them, in a long line of other bad moves against the God-given nature of what they really are.
    I renounce any and all of my former views against what the Church through Pope Leo XIII said, "This, then, is the teaching of the Catholic Church ...no one of the several forms of government is in itself condemned, inasmuch as none of them contains anythi

    Offline MyrnaM

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    « Reply #4 on: August 30, 2010, 09:58:42 PM »
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  • Speaking of hair, there is a young mother in our church who has the most beautiful very long hair, and  she always wears it down.  

    Now just a few days ago, she was diagnosed and  her treatment will no doubt cause the lose of all that beautiful hair.  I really feel bad for her, she needs prayers to overcome this illness.  My own daughter experienced this 2 years ago, but by the grace of God she is fine today, and her hair grew back really curly.  Prior to the chemo, her hair was as straight as a poker stick.  
    Please pray for my soul.
    R.I.P. 8/17/22

    My new blog @ https://myforever.blog/blog/


    Offline henry

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    Holy Mens Hair
    « Reply #5 on: August 31, 2010, 04:23:59 AM »
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  • Quote from: MyrnaM

    A women, her hair is her crowing glory


    Why is this?

    Offline MyrnaM

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    « Reply #6 on: August 31, 2010, 11:33:59 AM »
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  • I believe because God created women beautiful, and her hair is a symbol of grace and beauty.  No matter how old a women is she hates to see her hair falling out.  

    I don't think it is vanity, but a symbol of what she is, God put it into each women to be graceful and ladylike.  Today however so many women want to be like men, and so many men want to be like women.  Usually nothing to do with hair, but their attitude.
    Please pray for my soul.
    R.I.P. 8/17/22

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    Offline Belloc

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    Holy Mens Hair
    « Reply #7 on: August 31, 2010, 12:01:28 PM »
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  • Quote from: henry
    Quote from: MyrnaM

    A women, her hair is her crowing glory


    Why is this?


    the Bible says so
    Proud "European American" and prouder, still, Catholic


    Offline MyrnaM

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    « Reply #8 on: August 31, 2010, 03:39:13 PM »
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  • Yes, Belloc, but does the Bible say why it is her crowning glory?  Now I am curious too!
    Please pray for my soul.
    R.I.P. 8/17/22

    My new blog @ https://myforever.blog/blog/

    Offline spouse of Jesus

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    Holy Mens Hair
    « Reply #9 on: September 01, 2010, 03:59:04 AM »
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  •   The answer here:
    Did Jesus have long hair?

    Aren't all images of Jesus false? In 1 Corinthians 11:14 Paul tells us long hair is unnatural and degrading for a man. All the pictures of Jesus show him with long hair, so they must be false images.

     The pictures we have of Christ do not derive from any physical description we have of him in the Bible, because there is none. The basic image comes from a long artistic and iconographic tradition. Nothing in that facial image contradicts the Bible.

    Part of the problem here is how long is long? We know from archeological materials, such as Middle Eastern carvings and Egyptian tomb paintings, that Jєωs wore what we would consider today as long hair and beards. Hair reached down to the shoulders on men. Women wore hair down to the waist.

    Paul was telling Corinthian men that wearing hair down to the waist as women did would be effeminate and unnatural. You assume the length and cut of a Jєωιѕн man's hair in the first century was as it is for most men today, but that's a misconception which results in your misinterpretation of Paul's epistle.

    I am not sure about the websites though. But newadvent.org has this question answered in 'this rock' and 'quick questions' the same way/

    http://www.holyspiritinteractive.net/questions/didjesushavelonghair.asp

    Offline EcceAgnusDei

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    Holy Mens Hair
    « Reply #10 on: September 01, 2010, 10:31:32 AM »
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  • Quote from: spouse of Jesus
     The answer here:
    Did Jesus have long hair?

    Aren't all images of Jesus false? In 1 Corinthians 11:14 Paul tells us long hair is unnatural and degrading for a man. All the pictures of Jesus show him with long hair, so they must be false images.

     The pictures we have of Christ do not derive from any physical description we have of him in the Bible, because there is none. The basic image comes from a long artistic and iconographic tradition. Nothing in that facial image contradicts the Bible.

    Part of the problem here is how long is long? We know from archeological materials, such as Middle Eastern carvings and Egyptian tomb paintings, that Jєωs wore what we would consider today as long hair and beards. Hair reached down to the shoulders on men. Women wore hair down to the waist.

    Paul was telling Corinthian men that wearing hair down to the waist as women did would be effeminate and unnatural. You assume the length and cut of a Jєωιѕн man's hair in the first century was as it is for most men today, but that's a misconception which results in your misinterpretation of Paul's epistle.

    I am not sure about the websites though. But newadvent.org has this question answered in 'this rock' and 'quick questions' the same way/

    http://www.holyspiritinteractive.net/questions/didjesushavelonghair.asp


    Thanks for finding that! I knew there was something in the Bible that said men shouldn't have long hair but I couldn't remember where.


    Offline Cheryl

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    Holy Mens Hair
    « Reply #11 on: September 01, 2010, 12:32:18 PM »
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  • Quote from: EcceAgnusDei
    Quote from: spouse of Jesus
     The answer here:
    Did Jesus have long hair?

    Aren't all images of Jesus false? In 1 Corinthians 11:14 Paul tells us long hair is unnatural and degrading for a man. All the pictures of Jesus show him with long hair, so they must be false images.

     The pictures we have of Christ do not derive from any physical description we have of him in the Bible, because there is none. The basic image comes from a long artistic and iconographic tradition. Nothing in that facial image contradicts the Bible.

    Part of the problem here is how long is long? We know from archeological materials, such as Middle Eastern carvings and Egyptian tomb paintings, that Jєωs wore what we would consider today as long hair and beards. Hair reached down to the shoulders on men. Women wore hair down to the waist.

    Paul was telling Corinthian men that wearing hair down to the waist as women did would be effeminate and unnatural. You assume the length and cut of a Jєωιѕн man's hair in the first century was as it is for most men today, but that's a misconception which results in your misinterpretation of Paul's epistle.

    I am not sure about the websites though. But newadvent.org has this question answered in 'this rock' and 'quick questions' the same way/

    http://www.holyspiritinteractive.net/questions/didjesushavelonghair.asp


    Thanks for finding that! I knew there was something in the Bible that said men shouldn't have long hair but I couldn't remember where.


    I'm no Biblical scholar, but the answer as to whether Jesus had long hair would have to be found in the Old Testament since it would be Jєωιѕн law our Blessed Lord would have followed.

    So far I've only found this from the Old Testament:  Nor shall you cut your hair roundwise:  nor shave your beard. (Leviticus 19:27).

    Because thou shalt conceive and bear a son, and no razor shall touch his head: for he shall be a Nazarite of God, from his infancy, and from his mother's womb, and he shall begin to deliver Israel from the hands of the Philistines. (Judges 13:5).

    I just thought I'd throw this idea out there for further consideration.   One other avenue for consideration would be to research the question of hair length of Orthodox Jєωιѕн males.

    Offline Emerentiana

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    « Reply #12 on: September 01, 2010, 01:01:42 PM »
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  • Quote from: Cheryl
    Quote from: EcceAgnusDei
    Quote from: spouse of Jesus
     The answer here:
    Did Jesus have long hair?

    Aren't all images of Jesus false? In 1 Corinthians 11:14 Paul tells us long hair is unnatural and degrading for a man. All the pictures of Jesus show him with long hair, so they must be false images.

     The pictures we have of Christ do not derive from any physical description we have of him in the Bible, because there is none. The basic image comes from a long artistic and iconographic tradition. Nothing in that facial image contradicts the Bible.

    Part of the problem here is how long is long? We know from archeological materials, such as Middle Eastern carvings and Egyptian tomb paintings, that Jєωs wore what we would consider today as long hair and beards. Hair reached down to the shoulders on men. Women wore hair down to the waist.

    Paul was telling Corinthian men that wearing hair down to the waist as women did would be effeminate and unnatural. You assume the length and cut of a Jєωιѕн man's hair in the first century was as it is for most men today, but that's a misconception which results in your misinterpretation of Paul's epistle.

    I am not sure about the websites though. But newadvent.org has this question answered in 'this rock' and 'quick questions' the same way/

    http://www.holyspiritinteractive.net/questions/didjesushavelonghair.asp


    Thanks for finding that! I knew there was something in the Bible that said men shouldn't have long hair but I couldn't remember where.


    I'm no Biblical scholar, but the answer as to whether Jesus had long hair would have to be found in the Old Testament since it would be Jєωιѕн law our Blessed Lord would have followed.

    So far I've only found this from the Old Testament:  Nor shall you cut your hair roundwise:  nor shave your beard. (Leviticus 19:27).

    Because thou shalt conceive and bear a son, and no razor shall touch his head: for he shall be a Nazarite of God, from his infancy, and from his mother's womb, and he shall begin to deliver Israel from the hands of the Philistines. (Judges 13:5).

    I just thought I'd throw this idea out there for further consideration.   One other avenue for consideration would be to research the question of hair length of Orthodox Jєωιѕн males.


    Shouldnt we be looking for Catholic teaching and customs on the length of hair  in females and males?  We are not bound by Jєωιѕн teaching or customs.

    Offline MyrnaM

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    « Reply #13 on: September 01, 2010, 01:27:21 PM »
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  • Personally I like men with short hair, however what about the image of Jesus and the shroud.  
    Please pray for my soul.
    R.I.P. 8/17/22

    My new blog @ https://myforever.blog/blog/

    Offline Cheryl

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    « Reply #14 on: September 01, 2010, 01:51:19 PM »
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  • [/quote]

    Shouldnt we be looking for Catholic teaching and customs on the length of hair  in females and males?  We are not bound by Jєωιѕн teaching or customs.[/quote]

    I'm not talking about now, St. Paul covered that.  I'm talking about Jєωs who lived 2,000 years ago.  An Orthodox Jєωιѕн male of today would follow the same laws as Jesus did when he walked this earth.  I see a lot of Orthodox Jєωs while I'm out and about and the men have long hair, as well as a ringlet of long hair next to each ear.  They also have thick and bushy beards.  

    Myrna, good thought about Jesus and the shroud, I didn't think of that.