Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Dimond brothers  (Read 13944 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Dimond brothers
« Reply #50 on: July 08, 2019, 08:22:43 AM »
Many of the Church Fathers say that the chastisement precedes the period of peace, then after the peace is over, the time of the anti-christ comes.  The chastisement is NOT during the anti-christ's time, this is for sure.  Our Lady of Fatima does not talk about the anti-christ, but she does talk about a chastisement in the form of revolutions, martydoms and social upheavals (culminating in the 3 days of darkness, which is prophesized elsewhere).  The 3 days of darkness is NOT connected to the time of the anti-christ in any prophecy that i've ever read, so this is another sign that the time of the chastisement precedes the anti-christ.
.
Some confusion arises when we hear of the "end times" and many people correlate this phrase to the time of the anti-christ only.  But many of the Church Fathers talk of these 3 time periods - the chastisement, the peace and the anti-christ - as the 'end times", because all together, they are connected.
.
One thing that the Church Fathers are unanimous on, is that the Great Apostasy is not happening now because before the anti-christ comes, there are 6-7 different things that must happen to the world before his arrival.  One being that the whole world will be Catholic, which has not happened yet in all of history.  The USA has never been a catholic country.  Same with China, Japan, Thailand, etc.  The period of peace will be the time when the whole world will follow Christ and his Church like never before.  This is why when the anti-christ comes and seduces the world, it is called the "Great Apostasy" because all those who follow him into error actively reject catholicism.
.
The Chastisement that we have seen since V2 and which may or may not culminate in persecutions, and possibly an outlawing of the mass for a time, is not the same as will happen under the anti-christ.  In our period, the trials we may face will be a precursor to those of the anti-christ, but not be as long or as encompassing.  In our period, Our Lady will triumph over satan's forces (i.e. Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ), while in the future, Christ will triumph over the anti-christ and satan himself.  In our period, Our Lady will save those countries and people who are catholic and then convert the world as a result of Her triumph.  In the future, Christ will save all countries and peoples and the world will end.  In our period, the mass may be outlawed in certain countries but not all (since it's not said everywhere).  In the future, the anti-christ will outlaw the mass for the entire world.
.
The best explanation for all of this is that the Chastisement is the end of the 5th age of the Church, with the 6th age being the period of peace and the Age of Mary, and this peace followed by the rise of the anti-christ in the 7th and final age of the Church.  This is Ven Holzhauzer's explanation and it agrees very well with many prophecies and with the volumes written by the Church Fathers.
If the whole world witnessed the Chastisement and converted to Catholicism, why would they ever apostasise? It's an issue that confuses me. Also, which Church Fathers spoke of the Great Chastisement and the Period of Peace? I was under the impression that we get most of what we know about those from the prophecies of Saints and Marian Apparitions. That's all I can find when I google, anyway. 

Offline Ladislaus

  • Supporter
Re: Dimond brothers
« Reply #51 on: July 08, 2019, 09:15:50 AM »
I have listened to and researched 90 percent of the Dimond's material and I can't find any heresy or error. Sure, they have a lot of opinions on prophecy, that are neither here nor there. Their opinions on prophecy are very interesting, but not infallible. I have read from those who try to "debunk" the Dimonds and their material is nonsense. I challenge someone to post something credible that refutes them point by point. These two totally shred all of their opponents. I am not a "devotee of the Dimonds", but i am a student of the Church for over 30 years. Theses two aren't going to win any popularity contests by their "bedside  manor", but hey, the truth hurts sometimes. On the subject of the faith they don't invent anything. They just bring up dogma and doctrine that has already been settled or proclaimed.

Well, the biggest issue I have with them is their elevation of the theological note regarding Baptism of Desire to heretical.  I too happen to agree with them in rejecting the speculative notion of BoD.  But one cannot ascribe the theological note of heresy to it ... since the Church has always allowed theologians to hold the opinion.  Now, certainly, 95% of all BoD "flavors" are in fact implicitly heretical ... rooted as they are in Pelagianism.  But the classic BoD of St. Thomas, St. Robert Bellarmine, and St. Alphonsus (all three of them declared Doctors despite holding to this "heresy"?) cannot be rejected as heretical.

This dogmatization of their rejection of BoD in turn leads to bitter zeal and a schismatic mentality.  When you exclude from the Church those whom the Church does not exclude, that is one of the primary definitions of schism.

This has happened because the Dimonds are not particularly savy when it comes to applying "distinctions".  Yes, it is dogma that the Sacrament of Baptism is absolutely necessary for salvation.  But these Doctors assert that the Sacrament operates in BoD as the instrumental cause of justification via the desire for it ... even as can happen with the Sacrament of Confession, that the Sacrament is in fact received in voto.  I disagree for a vast array of reason that I won't digress into now ... but I cannot reject this distinction as heretical because the Church has not done so.  They continue to uphold the necessity of Baptism in asserting that it remains necessary ... even if it can be received in voto, but is not absolutely necessary in re.  At no point has the Church dogmatically rejected this distinction and explicilty taught that the Sacrment is necessary in re for salvation, and that the same logic as applies to Confession cannot be applied to Baptism.


Offline Pax Vobis

  • Supporter
Re: Dimond brothers
« Reply #52 on: July 08, 2019, 09:25:03 AM »
Quote
If the whole world witnessed the Chastisement and converted to Catholicism, why would they ever apostasise? It's an issue that confuses me.
Most of the world will die during the chastisement and those left will be catholics and those non-catholics who will mostly convert (the exception being some jews, since the jews will not convert en masse until after the death of the anti-christ).  Then the whole world will be catholic there will be peace.  However...just like we witnessed in our times the fall of catholics from the 40s/50s to the post-V2 time of the 70s, this shows us that it can only take 1 generation (or 30-40 years) for people to forget their faith.  The answer, simply, is that the generation born post-Chastisement will 1) not know enough about the evils of the pre-chastisement world and/or 2) will not appreciate the Faith/peace that they enjoy and thus 3) their Faith will not be as strong and they will be also be spiritually weakened by the "good life" of peace and worldly prosperity.  They will fall victim to the anti-christ's errors because human nature doesn't change and the triumph of Our Lady will not mean as much to them as it will to us.
.
Another aspect to all of this is that the transition period between the "period of peace" and the anti-christ will probably be 15-20 years or so.  The end of the period of peace is the death of the Great Monarch.  When he dies, then the Holy Roman Empire is divided up into 10 kingdoms and this is where Scripture says that the 10 kingdoms fight against each other and the anti-christ gains world fame by winning battles at a young age.  But he does not gain full world power until the age of 30, which mocks Christ's age at His time of public life.  So if the anti-christ is a military prodigy at, let's say, the age of 10-15, and he doesn't gain world power until 30, that means that we have 15-20 years of a transition period.
.
If the period of peace is short (as many prophecies say), let's assume that's 20-25 years.  Add 15-20 more years of transition between the peace and the full reign of the anti-christ and you have 35-45 years.  At the time of the reign of the anti-christ and the start of the 3.5 year persecution, anyone younger than 35-45 years old would have absolutely no memory of the passion of the Church or the start of the Great Monarch's reign or the Chastisement or life before that.  Anyone younger than 45-55 would've been 10 years old when the Great Monarch died and also have a vague and childish memory of the Church in Her glory.  So it's easy to see how this generation could be led astray by many of the same errors which existed in our times/pre-chastisement, because these people didn't see such errors affect their daily lives like we do today.  They grew up in peace; they grew up with the Faith and didn't have to work for it.
.
Just like we see the young generations of Tradition today, anyone younger than 40 does not remember V2.  They hardly remember the papacy of JPII (and if they do remember him, they don't remember his shockingly scandalous early days when he was hereticlly promoting the one-world religion and other crap).  They don't remember +ABL or when the sspx started in the 80s.  They don't know about the time period pre-indult, when modernist rome didn't allow any latin masses from 1970-1986.  They don't understand why older Trads are anti-indult, why older trads have a problem with the new ordinations, why older Trads have a problem with the FSSP.  Only those younger trads who study history, pray and listen to their elders have kept the Faith and stayed on the course of Tradition. 
.
Under 40 trads today don't see a problem with the indult, they don't see a problem with a "conservatively said" novus ordo mass, they don't see a problem with +Benedict's error of interpreting V2 "in light of tradition".  They are too young to remember the post-V2 war for the Faith.  They are too young to appreciate sacrifices made to keep Tradition alive.  They are too young to appreciate what they have been given.  ...So it will be at the time of the rise of the anti-christ.  Our times are a parallel, a precursor, an echo of the times to come.
.

Quote
Also, which Church Fathers spoke of the Great Chastisement and the Period of Peace? I was under the impression that we get most of what we know about those from the prophecies of Saints and Marian Apparitions. That's all I can find when I google, anyway. 
I don't know specifically but a book I read which summarized their writings, says that most of the Church Fathers talk about a period of peace before the reign of the anti-christ and this period will be when the Holy Roman Empire will return for the 3rd time in History (which ties into the Great Monarch prophecies). 

Offline Pax Vobis

  • Supporter
Re: Dimond brothers
« Reply #53 on: July 08, 2019, 10:52:04 AM »
Let's look at the ways that our times are a precursor to the time of the anti-christ.


1.  Peaceful times are disrupted by War which leads to harships and a loss of morality.
Our Times - WW1 and WW2 followed prosperous times, which led to the moral degeneracy of the 1960s.

Anti-Christ - The peace of the Great Monarch ends when he dies and his kingdom will be fought over by 10 kings.  Assuming this peace will lead to moral decay, as history proves.


2.  A loss of morality leads to a loss of Faith, which leads to trials of the Church.
Our Times - The moral degeneracy of the 60s, led to an acceptance of V2, and caused a crisis in the Church and an apostasy of many catholics, who accepted a new religion.

Anti-christ - The moral degeneracy after peaceful times leads to a loss of Faith and the Great Apostasy of the entirely 100% Catholic world (save for some jews), as foretold by Scripture.


3.  A False Church arises, a false period of peace begins, a persecution of the Church begins.
Our Times - V2 is a precursor, a "false prophet" of the true goal - a one-world religion.  I believe this is yet to come, even in our times, but I don't know how far God will allow it.  There may be a short "false peace" in the Middle East in Jerusalem.  There could be a masonic one-world religion setup in Jersulalem with a UN global govt setup too.  Many prophecies foretell of a terrible, but short persecution of Christians all over the world, before the Great Monarch comes.  The good news is that our times are conditional - such evils can be lessened by prayer and sacrifices.

Anti-christ - Scripture tells us to beware of False Prophets and False christs.  This is mainly a warning for the end times, before the anti-christ.  These false prophets will seduce the whole world to believing in error, to prepare them for the anti-christ reign, who will bring about an end to the wars after the Great Monarch and will usher in a "peace".  When the anti-christ is accepted by world leaders, then his reign begins, and the Church is persecuted on a global scale, as foretold by Scripture.


4.  During the Persecution, Saints will arise to guide the flock and to counteract the evils of the day, to give hope to the elect.
Our Times - During the V2 trials, we have been given many saintly clerics to guide us through these evils.  The Church of our day is "in eclipse" as Our Lady of LaSalette foretold, but She survives in small chapels around the world, where the mass is still said and the Faith preserved.

Anti-christ - During the persecutions, God will send the 2 Witnesses (Enoch and Elijah) to preach and world miracles, to give hope to the elect and to convert sinners.


5.  The Church Triumphs over Evil, the Persecution ends, and God is glorified again.
Our Times - Our Lady will be victorious over the devil's masonic henchmen.  She will destroy all heresies of our day and resurrect the Church.  When russia is consecrated, everyone will know that peace occurs because of Her power.  Her Immaculate Heart will triumph and She will be praised for her motherly intercession in saving the world.  Through Our Lady, The Angelic Pope and the Great Monarch will rule over the world Catholicism will flourish.

Anti-christ - Christ himself will be victorious over satan and his anti-christ puppet.  Christ will destroy the anti-christ publically and the Church will return from near death.  Christ and his Church will rule over all nations, having conquered the last and final heresy.


6.  The period of peace will bring many converts and all the earth will glorify God.
Our Times - the "age of Mary" will bring about the end of protestantism, muslimism and all other isms.  All men will convert to Catholicism, even many jews.  Yet, the jews, as a whole will still exist and be tolerated.

Anti-christ - the "kingship of Christ" after the death of the anti-christ will finally bring about the coversion of ALL jews to the Faith.  This is the culmination of God's promise in the Old Testament to not foresake his chosen people and to bring them back to Himself.  After a period of peace, when the entire world and ALL men are catholic, and when all peoples of the world worship Christ as King, then the world will end.

Re: Dimond brothers
« Reply #54 on: July 08, 2019, 01:01:02 PM »
Very informative posts, thank you. I'll be sure to read up more on it later.