The Church you see operating, is not the Church that Christ founded.  What you see is Communism.  The marxist took it over a good 60 years ago.  They should be chummy, because they are all working together for the State.  And chances are they are paid by the state. They are all the same.

In real communist countries the Church is not allowed to operate freely. In most countries when the communists took over the persecution of the Catholic Church began. Properties were expropriated, convents and monasteries were disbanded, Catholic schools were closed. Many bishops and priests died in prison. For example, in 1944 at the end of World War II Stalin ordered the forced incorpotation of the eastern rite Catholic Church with the Orthodox. All the bishops were arrested. Only one survived to be released. That was Cardinal Slipji who was exiled to Rome in a gesture of diplomatic goodwill to the Vatican. In China, the Catholic church has no legal existance. What does exist is the Patriotic Association which is under the control of the Communist Party. Bishops and priests who operate in communion wlth the Pope are subject to arrest and many years in prison.

Let's take a real example: Nicaragua. Although nothing like China is going on there, the government's slogan is "Christian, Socialist, Solidary". The illegal president is actually Novus Ordo, Daniel Ortega i mean.

People who know have told me most of the "Hierarchy" there are bought and totally corrupt. The ex "Cardinal" from there, Obando Bravo, has publicly given "Communion" at least once to Ortega.

The "big guys" from the Novus Ordo hierarchy there don't say a peep against Ortega or against the "first lady", who's an actual sorceress. She's actually held sorcerer conventions or covens there, several times, on October 31st, inviting sorcerers from other countries and all. But the Novus Ordo leaders there all just play nicey nice and pose for pictures and socialise with them etc. They actually support them.

So supposing a real Catholic Hierarchy were in that country, instead of the sham Novus Ordo one, how would they be supposed to act?

Let's take a real example: Nicaragua. Although nothing like China is going on there, the government's slogan is "Christian, Socialist, Solidary". The illegal president is actually Novus Ordo, Daniel Ortega i mean.

People who know have told me most of the "Hierarchy" there are bought and totally corrupt. The ex "Cardinal" from there, Obando Bravo, has publicly given "Communion" at least once to Ortega.

The "big guys" from the Novus Ordo hierarchy there don't say a peep against Ortega or against the "first lady", who's an actual sorceress. She's actually held sorcerer conventions or covens there, several times, on October 31st, inviting sorcerers from other countries and all. But the Novus Ordo leaders there all just play nicey nice and pose for pictures and socialise with them etc. They actually support them.

So supposing a real Catholic Hierarchy were in that country, instead of the sham Novus Ordo one, how would they be supposed to act?

One interesting fact about Nicaragua;
Before the general elections on November 5, 2006, the National Assembly passed a bill further restricting abortion in Nicaragua.[78] As a result, Nicaragua is one of five countries in the world where abortion is illegal with no exceptions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicaragua#Post-war_.281990-present.29

there was an incident prior to this when there was news report of a "therapeutic abortion" The Church issued a news bulletin reminding the public that all parties involved in the procedure i.e. doctors nurses, etc... were automatically excommunicated.

Quote from: poche

Quote from: Disputaciones

Let's take a real example: Nicaragua. Although nothing like China is going on there, the government's slogan is "Christian, Socialist, Solidary". The illegal president is actually Novus Ordo, Daniel Ortega i mean.

People who know have told me most of the "Hierarchy" there are bought and totally corrupt. The ex "Cardinal" from there, Obando Bravo, has publicly given "Communion" at least once to Ortega.

The "big guys" from the Novus Ordo hierarchy there don't say a peep against Ortega or against the "first lady", who's an actual sorceress. She's actually held sorcerer conventions or covens there, several times, on October 31st, inviting sorcerers from other countries and all. But the Novus Ordo leaders there all just play nicey nice and pose for pictures and socialise with them etc. They actually support them.

So supposing a real Catholic Hierarchy were in that country, instead of the sham Novus Ordo one, how would they be supposed to act?

That would fit right in with what goes on in the United States. We don't know all the details of what all they have done. Daniel Ortega won the last election. The Catholic Church isn't supposed to intervene in the political affairs of countries. We have people in our country who are in similar marital irregularities and who have inadvertitantly been given communion. Nicaragua is no different. If I were in charge over there, I might start by inviting Ortega and consort to make their situation correct by getting married in the Church.

Ortega "changed" the constitution to get himself "re-elected" last time around. Not only that, but the Sandinistas raided the urns and the posts were the votes were held/counted and threw them away, stole them, burned them etc. They were voting again and doing all sorts of illegal things. He hardly "won" the election, it was a blatant fraud. I believe this happened both times he "won". There was also a "pact" many years ago where the % needed to win was lowered to make it easier to get elected, without which he wouldn't have won the first time around.

I didn't even know he's not even married lol, so that makes it even worse.

I'm not saying the Church should be meddling with the politics, I'm just asking what, if anything, they should do in such situations. If they shouldn't strongly condemn/oppose the government, shouldn't they at least not publicly support them and be doing what they're doing in Nicaragua and other countries?

The United States hasn't always been so much better. Lyndon Johnson won his first election by haveing the last 200 or so people who voted majically vote in alphabetical order. Eugene Taldmadge won the governorship with several hundred people rising from their graves to cast their votes. I have heard that is other places the lights would go out as the people were counting their ballots.

Nicaragua is not really a communist country in the truest sense of the word. It is a republic in which the Communist party is one of many parties. The way in which the Sandinistas won is that the other parties failed to achieve the legitimate aspirations of the people for a time. However, the time will come when the Sandinistas will lose the election and they will cede power to whoever is the next winner. I say tht because they have done that before. If you are interested in what happens in a real communist country let's take a look at what happened in Hungary and with Cardinal Mindszenty;

On 15 September 1945, he was appointed Primate of Hungary and Archbishop of Esztergom (the seat of the head of the Catholic Church in Hungary). On 21 February 1946, Archbishop Mindszenty was elevated to Cardinal-Priest of Santo Stefano Rotondo by Pope Pius XII, who told him, "Among these thirty-two you will be the first to suffer the martyrdom symbolized by this red color."[7]

To the ruling Hungarian Socialist Workers' Party, Mindszenty was regarded as the archetypal figure of "clerical reaction". He continued to use the traditional title of prince-primate (hercegprímás) even after the use of noble and royal titles were entirely outlawed by the 1946 parliament. The Party accused him of having "aristocratic attitudes" and attacked his demands for compensation following the State seizure of Church-owned farmlands during the Party's campaign to abolish private farm ownership.[8] Since the main source of income for the Church was their agricultural lands, arbitrary and uncompensated confiscations by the communist government left many Church-run institutions destitute.[9]

Cardinal Mindszenty believed and preached that "The Church asks for no secular protection; it seeks shelter under the protection of God alone".[10] For this reason, he fought fiercely against Party attempts to seize parochial schools and force them to teach Marxist-Leninism.

In 1948, religious orders were banned by the government. Soon after, in an interview with American Marxist reporter George Seldes, Hungarian Premier Matyas Rakosi accused both the Cardinal and the Roman Catholic Church of being "a reactionary force in our country, supporting the monarchy and later the Fascist dictatorship of Admiral Horthy" and of also being, "the largest landowner in Hungary." This, according to Rakosi, was the only reason for Cardinal Mindszenty's opposition to the Party's policy of land confiscation.[11]

On 26 December 1948, Cardinal Mindszenty was arrested and accused of treason, conspiracy, and other offences against the new People's Republic of Hungary. Shortly before his arrest, he wrote a note to the effect that he had not been involved in any conspiracy, and any confession he might make would be the result of duress. While he was imprisoned by the communist government, Mindszenty was repeatedly hit with rubber truncheons and subjected to other forms of torture until he agreed to "confess".[9][12]

Among other things, Cardinal Mindszenty "admitted" that he had orchestrated the theft of the Crown of Saint Stephen for the sole purpose of crowning Crown Prince Otto von Hapsburg as King of Hungary. He "confessed" that he had schemed to overthrow the Party and reestablish Capitalism, that he had planned a Third World War, and that, once this war had been won by the Americans, that he himself would have assumed supreme political power.[13]

Almost alone among the Western news media, Marxist reporter George Seldes took the allegations of the Hungarian State at face value and urged his readers to do the same. Dismissing all evidence to the contrary, Seldes would spend the remainder of his long life accusing Cardinal Mindszenty of being a nαzι collaborator, a h0Ɩ0cαųst perpetrator, and a virulent αnтι-ѕємιтє.[14]

In his 1987 memoirs, Seldes wrote, "In 1948 the entire American section of the resident foreign press corps in Hungary implored me to report the facts about Cardinal Mindszenty's collaboration with the nαzιs, his part in the deportation of the Jєωιѕн population to Hitler's death camps, and also to expose the scores of fraudulent news items coming from outside Hungary, from Vienna, London, Prague, and Rome especially, alleging drugging and torturing of the Cardinal."[15]

On 3 February 1949, Cardinal Mindzenty's show trial began. Showing visible signs of having been tortured, the Cardinal walked into the court and "confessed" to all charges. As he followed the trial, a weeping Pope Pius XII told Sister Pascalina Lehnert, "My words have come true and all I can do is pray; I cannot help him any other way."[16]

On 8 February, Cardinal Mindszenty was sentenced to life imprisonment for treason and espionage. The government released a book Docuмents on the Mindszenty Case containing his confession.

On 12 February 1949, Pope Pius XII announced the excommunication of all persons involved in the trial and conviction of Mindszenty.

On 20 February 1949, the Pope addressed a series of questions to "an enormous crowd which had gathered in St. Peter's Square" to protest the Cardinal's show trial and conviction. He asked, "Do you want a Church that remains silent when She should speak; that diminishes the law of God where she is called to proclaim it loudly, wanting to accommodate it to the will of man? Do you want a Church that departs from the unshakable foundations upon which Christ founded Her, taking the easy way of adapting Herself to the opinion of the day; a Church that is a prey to current trends; a Church that does not condemn the suppression of conscience and does not stand up for the just liberty of the people; a Church that locks Herself up within the four walls of Her temple in unseemly sycophancy, forgetting the divine mission received from Christ: 'Go out the crossroads and preach the people'? Beloved sons and daughters! Spiritual heirs of numberless confessors and martyrs! Is this the Church you venerate and love? Would you recognize in such a Church the features of your Mother? Would you be able to imagine a Successor of St. Peter submitting to such demands?"[16]

According to Sister Pascalina, who witnessed the rally, "In reply to the Holy Father came a single cry like thunder still ringing in our ears: 'No!'"[16]

In a subsequent apostolic letter, Acerrimo Moerore, the Pope publicly condemned the Cardinal's conviction and described his tortures.

On 30 October 1956, during the Hungarian Revolution of 1956, Mindszenty was released from prison. He returned to Budapest the next day. On 2 November, he praised the insurgents. The following day, he made a radio broadcast in favour of recent anti-communist developments.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B3zsef_Mindszenty