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Author Topic: Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs  (Read 1694 times)

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Offline Kelley

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Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
« on: May 27, 2013, 04:11:33 PM »
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  • Koch stresses 'no conversion of Jєωs'
    17 May 2013



    Cardinal Kurt Koch forcefully emphasized that the Church's relations with Jєωs are different in kind from its relations with all other religions.

    "We Christians must not bear witness in relation to the Jєωs to a path of salvation which is completely foreign to them, as we do with other religions," the President of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity and the Commission for Religious Relations with Jєωs said on a visit to Jerusalem last week.

    "This is because the New Testament is built up totally on the basis of the Old Testament. The Catholic Church therefore does not have an organized Jєωιѕн mission, as certain Evangelical groups do."

    The cardinal was speaking at a fringe meeting of the Joint Commission for Jєωιѕн-Catholic Dialogue on 9 May.


    http://www.thetablet.co.uk/latest-news/5310



    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #1 on: May 27, 2013, 04:32:51 PM »
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  • Koch is a heretic and an embarassment to Catholics everywhere.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.


    Offline Matto

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #2 on: May 27, 2013, 05:06:19 PM »
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  • I feel so bad for the Jєωs. With cunning devil-men like this guy in the Catholic hierarchy telling them they don't need to convert, they will believe him and never convert and all of them will be damned.  :facepalm:

    Though, I don't know if converting to conciliarism would help them achieve salvation, they would have to convert to true Catholicism.
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline Matto

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #3 on: May 27, 2013, 05:12:30 PM »
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  • Sometimes I think the Novus Ordo hierarchy is full of idiots. Sometimes I think it is full of cunning evil men who want every soul to be damned.
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline Sigismund

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #4 on: May 27, 2013, 06:06:52 PM »
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  • I am generally regarded as a philo-semite here, so it my surprise many when I say that the Cardinal is either a heretic or an idiot.  Or both.  They are not mutually exclusive. For any Catholic to suggest that anyone who is not a Catholic should not become one is just beyond absurd.  
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir


    Offline Charlemagne

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #5 on: May 27, 2013, 09:56:54 PM »
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  • Quote from: Matto
    Sometimes I think the Novus Ordo hierarchy is full of idiots. Sometimes I think it is full of cunning evil men who want every soul to be damned.


    I'm beyond just thinking that; it's been my conclusion for quite a while.
    "This principle is most certain: The non-Christian cannot in any way be Pope. The reason for this is that he cannot be head of what he is not a member. Now, he who is not a Christian is not a member of the Church, and a manifest heretic is not a Christian, as is clearly taught by St. Cyprian, St. Athanasius, St. Augustine, St. Jerome, and others. Therefore, the manifest heretic cannot be Pope." -- St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline Mithrandylan

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #6 on: May 27, 2013, 10:17:51 PM »
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  • This really shouldn't be much of a surprise.  The Balamand Agreement says the exact same thing except about the Eastern Schismatics, and that's been around for more than twenty years.  

    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #7 on: May 28, 2013, 10:52:16 AM »
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  • First Pope Francis is "implying" that atheists are redeemed without believing and now, although this particular "Cardinal" has been saying stuff like this for decades now, "Cardinal" Koch is saying Jєωs don't need to accept Our Lord.  



    Offline RomanCatholic1953

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #8 on: May 28, 2013, 11:04:15 AM »
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  • It is men like Cardinal Koch that are responsible for the loss of Jєωιѕн
    Souls. Also, are responsible for the evil they do that is bringing on the
    age of the anti-Christ.

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #9 on: May 28, 2013, 11:40:49 AM »
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  • Isn't Cardinal Koch one of those "converts from Judaism"?

    And isn't there another article where he is quoted as saying "...somehow everything leads to Christ..."  

    This public indifferentism isn't an accident, it's intentional.  The Montinian Church has been playing this game for years.  

    Offline Ethelred

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #10 on: May 28, 2013, 01:55:13 PM »
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  • Quote from: RomanCatholic1953
    It is men like Cardinal Koch that are responsible for the loss of Jєωιѕн Souls. Also, are responsible for the evil they do that is bringing on the age of the anti-Christ.

    Yes, indeed.
    Bishop Williamson called this wrong behaviour of the Newchurch men "true antisemitism", please see these two of his ECs :


    --------------------------------------

    Eleison Comments 34 (23 February 2008)

    True Anti-Semitism

    Most people seeing how Pope Benedict XVI has changed the Church’s Good Friday prayer for the Jєωs will think he has been their friend, because the change was in a direction demanded by spokesmen of theirs, who made themselves heard. However, for any Catholic who has the Catholic Faith, Benedict XVI has been in this not their friend but their enemy.

    The difference is quite simply the difference between our brief life here below, and life everlasting: For purposes of this life, lasting for each of us, let us say, 70 years, he has been their friend, because by, for instance, taking out of the 1962 text the references to the Jєωs’ "blindness", "darkness" and "the veil over their hearts", he has softened the Church’s solemn criticism of their condition. On the other hand by the same softening he will also have diminished Catholics’ awareness of how especially Jєωs need the charity of Catholics’ prayers.

    For indeed from Adam to world’s end, faith in the one and only Redeemer, to come or having come, can alone save any soul from eternal damnation, unless that soul lives without serious sin and is honestly ignorant of the Redeemer. But honest ignorance presents a particular difficulty for the Jєωs who had all the privileges of the Old Testament to prepare them for the coming of their Messiah, Jesus Christ, and who ever since have had to put "the veil over their hearts" in order not to recognize him in the multiple prophecies of their Old Testament, notably Isaiah LIII.

    Therefore the recent Good Friday liturgy change, by diminishing Catholics’ awareness of that real "veil", etc, has done a disservice to Jєωs’ eternal salvation. In this respect of the Catholic Faith, Benedict XVI has, objectively, shown himself to be against the Jєωs purely as Jєωs. Is there any other possible true definition of the expression "αnтι-ѕємιтє"?

    Sacred Heart of Jesus, between now and world’s end, grant to your Church many martyrs to die for the eternal salvation of your racial kinsmen, beloved by you! Kyrie eleison.

    Bishop Richard Williamson



    ----------------------------------

    Eleison Comments 35 (1 March 2008)

    False Anti-Semitism

    When "Eleison Comments" last week argued that insofar as Pope Bnedict XVI's Good Friday prayer change worked against the eternal salvation of Jєωs, he had proved himself -- no doubt unintentionally -- to be a true αnтι-ѕємιтє, ie enemy of Jєωs purely as Jєωs, a number of readers apparently agreed. I congratulate them, because they had to be thinking with their Catholic minds instead of merely emoting with their (objectively) vile media. Let us think a little further.

    Obviously, the basic principles apply to all men and not just to Jєωs: to wish them eternal salvation is to love them truly, because it is to wish them the greatest good of all, namely everlasting happiness in Heaven, through and with Our Lord Jesus Christ. To wish them welfare or prosperity merely in this little life on earth is to love them much less, especially if that worldly success would get in the way of their eternal salvation, as it all too easily can do -- Mt.XIX, 24.

    But fewer and fewer people today believe in life everlasting, or in Our Lord, so naturally the perspective of such people is different. If I urge upon them eternal life, or if I do what I prudently can to obstruct their campaigning against Our Lord, then I will seem to them to be their enemy when I am in fact their best friend. It is all a question of perspective, but it is not a question of opinion: the eternal perspective is true, while the anti-Christian perspective is objectively and absolutely false.

    Now ever since the Jєωs were responsible for the crucifying of Our Lord Jesus Christ -- "His blood be upon us and upon our children", Mt.XXVII,25 -- they have as a race and as a religion, always with noble exceptions, continued to reject him down to our day. Thus St. Paul observed that they not only "killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets", but they also prohibited St. Paul himself from "speaking to the Gentiles so as to save them". In brief, their behavior was such that "they please not God and are adversaries to men" (I Thess. II,14-16). Closer to our own time, it is a matter of historical record that the designing and launching of, for instance, Communism, to wrest mankind away from God and to replace his Heaven with a man-made paradise, was largely their achievement.

    So they persecuted St. Paul at every turn (see Acts of the Apostles) as being one of their arch-enemies, when in fact nobody loved them more truly or labored more for their real well-being than did St. Paul (cf. Rom. IX,1-5). Similarly today, they will call an "αnтι-ѕємιтє" anybody who gets in the way of any godlessness of theirs, when in fact all people laboring for their salvation, as for the salvation of Gentiles, are their best friends. St Paul, pray for us! Kyrie eleison.

    Bishop Richard Williamson


    Offline InfiniteFaith

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #11 on: May 28, 2013, 03:11:58 PM »
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  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    Isn't Cardinal Koch one of those "converts from Judaism"?

    And isn't there another article where he is quoted as saying "...somehow everything leads to Christ..."  

    This public indifferentism isn't an accident, it's intentional.  The Montinian Church has been playing this game for years.  


    If he was a convert from Judaism then maybe he did not convert at heart. Maybe he infected our Church just so that one day he could gain a little power and say something like that. Who knows. Just more reason not to trust the Jєωs. Even if they "join" the Church.

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #12 on: May 28, 2013, 04:43:11 PM »
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  • Infinite Faith,

    One key factor to check on (if possible) when a Jєωιѕн person converts to Catholicism.  This key factor is that their family will sit "Shiva" on them - it's a Jєωιѕн custom to mourn for the dead for seven days in Judaism.  Now, when someone abandons the faith and becomes a Catholic or some other religion, the family of the person who lives will literally renounce all ties with them and not even acknowledge them.  

    So, if this doesn't happen, then it's a sham.  The Jєωιѕн religion is perfectly accepting of someone pretending to join sides with the other to wreak havoc.  It's hard wired into their psyche and it's written into their scriptures.  Their rabbis and the great commentators do not view it as a sin to lie to a non-Jєω.  

    And I may be remembering incorrectly, but Cardinal Koch's Jєωιѕн relatives are still on close terms with him.  

    Jєωιѕн converts to Catholicism are problematic.  They spend their entire life denying Christ and despising His Holy Church.  Then, suddenly, they embrace His Church but tend to wax eloquent about how this has made them a better Jєω.  We can't really stop someone from pretending to convert because their intentions are often hidden from us be the Church should refrain from trusting them in positions of any authority at all.    

    The Faith changes a person.  Someone who loves Christ and His Holy Church also loves everything about that Holy Church.  A pormographer who has a conversion and embraces the Catholic Faith doesn't continue in the porn industry and, likewise, a hater and despiser of Christ who is graced by Our Lord with conversion doesn't continue in his hatred.  A Jєω who converts should renounce his entire past because it's very undesirable in all the principal departments.  

    Offline InfiniteFaith

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #13 on: May 28, 2013, 08:10:54 PM »
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  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    Infinite Faith,

    One key factor to check on (if possible) when a Jєωιѕн person converts to Catholicism.  This key factor is that their family will sit "Shiva" on them - it's a Jєωιѕн custom to mourn for the dead for seven days in Judaism.  Now, when someone abandons the faith and becomes a Catholic or some other religion, the family of the person who lives will literally renounce all ties with them and not even acknowledge them.  

    So, if this doesn't happen, then it's a sham.  The Jєωιѕн religion is perfectly accepting of someone pretending to join sides with the other to wreak havoc.  It's hard wired into their psyche and it's written into their scriptures.  Their rabbis and the great commentators do not view it as a sin to lie to a non-Jєω.  

    And I may be remembering incorrectly, but Cardinal Koch's Jєωιѕн relatives are still on close terms with him.  

    Jєωιѕн converts to Catholicism are problematic.  They spend their entire life denying Christ and despising His Holy Church.  Then, suddenly, they embrace His Church but tend to wax eloquent about how this has made them a better Jєω.  We can't really stop someone from pretending to convert because their intentions are often hidden from us be the Church should refrain from trusting them in positions of any authority at all.    

    The Faith changes a person.  Someone who loves Christ and His Holy Church also loves everything about that Holy Church.  A pormographer who has a conversion and embraces the Catholic Faith doesn't continue in the porn industry and, likewise, a hater and despiser of Christ who is graced by Our Lord with conversion doesn't continue in his hatred.  A Jєω who converts should renounce his entire past because it's very undesirable in all the principal departments.  


    Couldn't have said it any better than that.

    Offline Maizar

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    Christians must NOT bear witness to Jєωs
    « Reply #14 on: May 28, 2013, 09:02:29 PM »
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  • Quote from: Matto
    Sometimes I think the Novus Ordo hierarchy is full of idiots. Sometimes I think it is full of cunning evil men who want every soul to be damned.


    They are psychopaths and snakes. They are right up there with CEO's, serial killers and despots, and they don't know any other way to think or behave. Unfortunately Fellay has exhibited some of the same traits. There needs to be a discussion about why it is that bishops keep conferring holy orders to people with these personality traits.