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Author Topic: Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"  (Read 5975 times)

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Offline cathman7

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Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
« on: December 14, 2012, 08:44:44 AM »
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  • Religious differences: Calgary bishop warns congregation that the city’s newest Catholic church isn’t really Catholic

    Jen Gerson, National Post Staff | Dec 13, 2012 9:08 PM ET
    More from National Post Staff

    Father Jurgen Wegner prays in the chapel of St. Joseph Center in Saint-Cesaire, Quebec. Fr. Wegner says the St. Pius X Society had purchased a church in Calgary as its congregation had grown.

    The Roman Catholic Diocese of Calgary is warning its congregants away from a new church it believes is wrongly identifying itself as Catholic.

    The St. Pius X Society — Catholic traditionalists who broke from the mainstream during the church reforms of the late ’60s — has purchased a Catholic church in the city’s Southwest.

    The group, which believes in holding Latin Mass according to older liturgical rites, is renovating the building and plans to open it after a blessing ceremony to be held on Dec. 27.

    This seems to have raised the ire of Calgary’s conservative bishop, Fred Henry. In September, he distributed a newsletter warning parishioners away from the city’s newest place of worship, which has been renamed St. Dennis Church.

    “St. Dennis is not a Catholic church and the fact that they are identifying themselves as a Catholic church is problematic and confusing for many people,” he wrote.



    “The [society] has gotten more strident over time, harboring sedevacantists [a sect that denies the authority of recent Popes] and others with positions more extreme than [the society’s founder] would have tolerated,” Bishop Henry wrote.

    Father Jurgen Wegner, the district superior of the St. Pius X Society in Canada, said he was surprised to see the letter, but hopes to build bridges with the bishop.

    “I was a little bit surprised to see this clarification without having been contacted before by the bishop. It’s a fact that St. Pius X is a congregation with 40 years of existence.”

    During the ’60s, the church held the Second Vatican Council, which attempted to create ecclesiastical and liturgical reforms more in line with the modern era. Changes were made to certain rituals and, most notably, Mass was permitted to be held in the vernacular, rather than in Latin. These alterations proved to be controversial in some corners, giving rise to a Catholic traditionalist movement, including the St. Pius X Society.

    Fr. Wegner said the modern approach to Mass is far too liberal and places too much emphasis on the individual, rather than on the importance of man serving God.

    One of the changes, for example, is that the priest now faces his congregants. According to older rites, the priest should be facing the altar, his focus on worship.

    “In the liturgy, if you put man in the centre, the most important thing is man. If you put God aside, that makes a big difference,” he said.

    Attendance in Catholic masses has steadily declined since the ’60s, a fact Fr. Wegner attributes to the church wavering on dogma in the face of a modern onslaught. By comparison, the St. Pius X congregation is growing, he said.

    ‘St. Dennis is not a Catholic church and the fact that they are identifying themselves as a Catholic church is problematic’
    Fr. Wegner said he doesn’t dispute any of Bishop Henry’s stances on social issues, of course.



    “We’re happy he takes traditional Catholic stances, but he’s not the only bishop in the world and we can see everywhere those who would not take the same stands as the Bishop of Calgary,” he said.

    “Ask, for example, for people the right of contraception, the right of abortion. That’s not the official Catholic doctrine and stand. But there are members of the Catholic church, and even in the hierarchy, who would claim these rates based on the Second Vatican Council.”

    Fr. Wegner said the St. Pius X Society has about 600 adherents in Calgary; it purchased the other church because their congregation is growing and required more space. St. Dennis should be able to seat 700 people when it opens after Christmas. The church also runs a private school with 91 pupils. The growth of the church, he said, proves that some Catholics long for a more traditional approach to spirituality.

    Nonetheless, Fr. Wegner said he met with Bishop Henry on a recent trip to Calgary. The meeting was amiable. The priest even invited the bishop to attend St. Dennis’ blessing ceremony.

    There has been no word as to whether he will attend, but his letter appeared adamant: “Roman Catholics of the Diocese of Calgary should not attend St. Dennis Church, nor receive sacraments from any priest who is a member of the Society of Saint Pius X unless in dire emergency or danger of death,” the bishop wrote.

    A traditional Catholic Mass, approved by the Diocese, is available at St. Anthony’s Parish.

    Bishop Henry declined to comment on the matter.

    National Post


    Offline wallflower

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #1 on: December 14, 2012, 09:12:40 AM »
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  • Quote from: obscurus

    There has been no word as to whether he will attend, but his letter appeared adamant: “Roman Catholics of the Diocese of Calgary should not attend St. Dennis Church, nor receive sacraments from any priest who is a member of the Society of Saint Pius X unless in dire emergency or danger of death,” the bishop wrote.



    Huh, well then they must be Catholic.

    Does anyone ever say, Baptists are not Catholic, do not attend the Baptist church or receive their sacraments unless in dire emergency or danger of death? Nope.


    Offline eddiearent

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #2 on: December 14, 2012, 09:13:07 AM »
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  • Typical. The New Church diocese of Orlando also labels the SSPX chapel as "schismatic."

    Source: http://www.orlandodiocese.org/schismatic-churches

    Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #3 on: December 14, 2012, 09:17:40 AM »
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  • Rev. Fr. Leonard Goffine's
    The Church's Year

    INSTRUCTION ON THE EIGHTH SUNDAY AFTER PENTECOST

    ON THE SIN OF DETRACTION
    And the same was accused unto him. (Luke XVI. 1.)
    The steward in the gospel was justly accused on account of the goods he had wasted; but there are many who lose their good name and honor by false accusations, and malicious talk! Alas, what great wrongs do detracting tongues cause in this world! How mean a vice is detraction, how seldom attention is paid to its evil, how rarely the injury is repaired!

    When is our neighbor slandered?
    When he is accused of a vice of which he is not guilty; when a secret crime is made known with the intention of hurting him, or when our duty does not require us to mention it; when we attribute an evil intention to him or entirely misconstrue his actions and omissions; when his good qualities or commendable actions are denied or lessened, or his merits underrated; when we remain silent, or speak ambiguously in cases where praise is due him; when we lend a willing ear to detractions, and make no effort to stop them; and lastly, when joy is felt in the detraction.

    Is detraction a great sin?
    Yes, for it is directly opposed to the love of our neighbor, therefore to the love of God, hence it is, as St. Ambrose says, hateful to God and man. By it we rob our neighbor of a possession greater than riches, (Prov. XXII. 1.) and often he is plunged by it into want and misery, even into the greatest vices; St. Ambrose says: "Let us fly from the vice of detraction, for it is altogether a satanic abyss, full of deceit." Finally, detraction is a great sin, because it can seldom be recalled, and the injury done by it is very great, and often irreparable.

    What should we do when we have committed this sin?
    We should retract the calumny as soon as possible and repair the injury done to our neighbor in regard to his name or temporal goods; we should detest this sin, regret it, and be cleansed from it by penance, we should daily pray for him whom we have injured, and in future guard against the like fault.

    Are we ever allowed to reveal the wrongs of our neighbor?
    To make public the faults of our neighbor only for the entertainment of idle people, or for the sake of news, and to satisfy the curiosity of others, is always sinful. But if after having reproached or advised our neighbor fraternally, without obtaining our end, we make known his faults to his parents or superiors for the sake of punishment and reformation, far from being a sin it is rather a duty, against which those err who are silent about the sins of their neighbor, when by speaking they could prevent the sin and save him much unhappiness.

    Is it a sin to listen willingly to detraction?
    Yes, for we thus give the detractors occasion and encouragement. Therefore St. Bernard says: "Whether to detract is a greater sin than to listen to detraction, I will not decide. The devil sits on the tongue of the detractor as he does on the ear of the listener." In such cases we must strive to interrupt, to prevent the detracting words, or else withdraw; or if we can do none of these, we must show in our countenance our displeasure, for the Holy Ghost says: The northwind driveth away rain, so doth a sad countenance a backbiting tongue. (Prov. XXV. 23.) The same demeanor is to be observed in regard to improper language.

    What varieties of detraction are there?
    There is a certain detestable kind of detraction which degrades and ridicules others by witty and sneering words. Still worse is that detraction which carries the faults of others from one place to another, thus exciting those who are on good terms to hard feeling, or making those who are living in enmity more opposed to each other. The whisperer and the double tongued, says the Holy Ghost, is accursed, for he bath troubled many that were at peace.

    What should deter us from detraction?
    The thought of the enormity of this sin; of the difficulty, even impossibility of repairing the injury caused; of the punishment it incurs, for St. Paul expressly says: Calumniators shall not possess the kingdom of God, (I Cor. VI. 10.). and Solomon writes: My son, fear the Lord, and the king: and have nothing to do with detractors; for their destruction shall rise suddenly. (Prov. XXIV 22.)

    SUPPLICATON Guard me, O most loving Jesus, that I may not be so blinded, either by hatred or, envy, as to rob my neighbor of his good name, or make myself guilty of such a grievous sin.

    CONSOLATION FOR THOSE WHO HAVE SUFFERED FROM DETRACTION
    If your good name has been taken away by evil tongues, you may be consoled by knowing that God permitted this to humble you, to exercise you in patience and free you from pride and vain self-complacency. Turn your eyes to the saints of the Old and the New Law, to the chaste Joseph who was cast into prison on a false charge of adultery, (Gen. XXXIX.) to the meek David publicly accused by Semei as a man of blood, (II Kings XVI. 7.) to the chaste Susanna who was also accused of adultery, tried and condemned to death. (Dan, XIII.) Jesus, the king of saints, was called a drunkard, accused and condemned as a blasphemer, a friend of the devil, an inciter of ѕєdιтισn among the people, and like the greatest criminal was nailed to the cross between two thieves. Remember besides that it does not injure you in the sight of God, if all possible evil is said of you, and that He, at all times, cares for those who trust in Him; for he who touches the honor of those who fear God, touches, as it were, the pupil of His eye, (Zach. II. 8.) and shall not go unpunished. St. Chrysostom says: "If you are guilty, be converted; if you are innocent, think of Christ."

    PRAYER  O most innocent Jesus, Who wert thus calumniated, I submit myself wholly to Thy divine will, and am, ready like Thee, to bear all slanders and detractions, as with perfect confidence I yield my good name, convinced that Thou at Thy pleasure wilt defend and protect it, and save me from the hands of my enemies.

    Offline Telesphorus

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #4 on: December 14, 2012, 09:42:44 AM »
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  • Quote from: wallflower
    Quote from: obscurus

    There has been no word as to whether he will attend, but his letter appeared adamant: “Roman Catholics of the Diocese of Calgary should not attend St. Dennis Church, nor receive sacraments from any priest who is a member of the Society of Saint Pius X unless in dire emergency or danger of death,” the bishop wrote.



    Huh, well then they must be Catholic.

    Does anyone ever say, Baptists are not Catholic, do not attend the Baptist church or receive their sacraments unless in dire emergency or danger of death? Nope.


    Well, wallflower, the Greek "Orthodox" have valid orders and they can be approached in an emergency for Last Rites I believe.

    So essentially he's saying the SSPX is schismatic.  Yawn.

    What is ironic is that the SSPX leadership in trying to liberalize, just gets treated more contemptuously.  As Bowler said, the conciliarists never called them "heretics" until now.  Behind the carrot is a stick.

    I got a real kick out of the statement that they harbor more extreme people than they used to.  Seems to me Archbishop Lefebvre consecrated Bishop Williamson, Archbishop Lefebvre was almost jailed after being prosecuted by LICRA.

    Now Bishop Williamson is thrown out and Jєωs have been called "elder brothers" - acceptance of parts of Nostra Aetate has been signaled, and now they're called "more extreme"

    It's a good sign that message boards are letting these conciliarists know what we believing Catholics really think of them.


    Offline wallflower

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #5 on: December 14, 2012, 09:58:47 AM »
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  • Quote from: Telesphorus
    Quote from: wallflower
    Quote from: obscurus

    There has been no word as to whether he will attend, but his letter appeared adamant: “Roman Catholics of the Diocese of Calgary should not attend St. Dennis Church, nor receive sacraments from any priest who is a member of the Society of Saint Pius X unless in dire emergency or danger of death,” the bishop wrote.



    Huh, well then they must be Catholic.

    Does anyone ever say, Baptists are not Catholic, do not attend the Baptist church or receive their sacraments unless in dire emergency or danger of death? Nope.


    Well, wallflower, the Greek "Orthodox" have valid orders and they can be approached in an emergency for Last Rites I believe.


    Yes, and I thought later that there are other sects whose baptisms are valid so my point doesn't really work.




    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #6 on: December 14, 2012, 02:51:10 PM »
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  • Check out one of the last lines of the article where it states that a Traditional Latin Mass, approved by the Diocese is offered.

    Was that offer available before the SSPX purchased a chapel?  Or did they set it up on the fly?

    Offline Sigismund

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #7 on: December 14, 2012, 04:09:26 PM »
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  • The bishop thinks the SSPX has been getting more stridently anti_Vatican.  Does he read a newspaper, or have an internet connection?
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir


    Offline Stephen Francis

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #8 on: December 14, 2012, 05:10:05 PM »
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  • What's funny is that the article says that these "Catholic traditionalists" "broke away from the mainstream" in the 1960s.

    That's hysterical, and historically untenable to boot.

    The breaking away was done by the modernists and liberals who want to cozy up to the Jєω and Freemason power brokers in the secular world.

    As long as there is the Church, somewhere, even just in the faith of a dedicated few, the Novus Ordo will never win the day. We have the promises of Christ Our Lord Himself; they have 'open windows' and 'new evangelization' to go with their sex crimes and fraud.

    How's that working out for them, I wonder? ;)
    This evil of heresy spreads itself. The doctrines of godliness are overturned; the rules of the Church are in confusion; the ambition of the unprincipled seizes upon places of authority; and the chief seat [the Papacy] is now openly proposed as a rewar

    Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #9 on: December 14, 2012, 07:52:48 PM »
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  • Quote
    Was that offer available before the SSPX purchased a chapel? Or did they set it up on the fly?


    Good catch.  I didn't read all the way through.  I have a delicate stomach  :dancing:  
    However, I couldn't help but surmise that - as usual - this has everything to do with money and power, and not a thing to do with the love of our Savior.  

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #10 on: December 14, 2012, 11:48:51 PM »
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  • where is the "religious liberty"  and "ecuмencism"  The fact is that othere is religious liberty for all except Pius X Society and other traditional Catholics.

    the novus ordo has love and respect for all religions including athesism, wiccan,pagan and satanism too.

    And yet the novus ordo are hostile and attack Pius X society and other traditinal Catholics.


    And yes, it is about money and power.

    The novus ordo rather sell off their properties to athesists, wiccans, pagans and satanists, liberals, communists then traditional Catholics.



       
    May God bless you and keep you


    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    « Reply #11 on: December 14, 2012, 11:56:00 PM »
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  • Yes, someone should write a letter to the editor in response and ask them why Fred henry didn't warn his parishioners about other non-catholic churches in the area?

    I think alot of those who refer to themselves as "conservative" are really liberals in disguise.

    This is what is being preached at every single novus ordo "catholic community" and it has been going on for years.  And yet these hypocrits won't preach against abortion, divorce, etc.

     
    May God bless you and keep you

    Offline Geremia

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #12 on: December 25, 2015, 01:51:44 PM »
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  • Quote from: wallflower
    Does anyone ever say, Baptists are not Catholic, do not attend the Baptist church or receive their sacraments unless in dire emergency or danger of death? Nope.
    Actually, I have seen than, but not from even a Novus Ordo bishop, though.
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    Offline Geremia

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #13 on: December 25, 2015, 01:55:54 PM »
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  • Quote from: obscurus
    “The [society] has gotten more strident over time, harboring sedevacantists [a sect that denies the authority of recent Popes] and others with positions more extreme than [the society’s founder] would have tolerated,” Bishop Henry wrote.

    Father Jurgen Wegner, the district superior of the St. Pius X Society in Canada, said he was surprised to see the letter, but hopes to build bridges with the bishop.

    “I was a little bit surprised to see this clarification without having been contacted before by the bishop.
    Have Novus Ordo bishops ever directly warned/threatened SSPX priests in their dioceses to cease using the name Catholic?
    Quote from: obscurus
    It’s a fact that St. Pius X is a congregation with 40 years of existence.”
    That's an excellent way of summarizing the SSPX's situation.
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    Offline Maria Regina

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    Calgary bishop warns of SSPX church calling it "non-Catholic"
    « Reply #14 on: December 25, 2015, 04:55:19 PM »
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  • Quote from: Geremia
    Quote from: obscurus
    “The [society] has gotten more strident over time, harboring sedevacantists [a sect that denies the authority of recent Popes] and others with positions more extreme than [the society’s founder] would have tolerated,” Bishop Henry wrote.

    Father Jurgen Wegner, the district superior of the St. Pius X Society in Canada, said he was surprised to see the letter, but hopes to build bridges with the bishop.

    “I was a little bit surprised to see this clarification without having been contacted before by the bishop.
    Have Novus Ordo bishops ever directly warned/threatened SSPX priests in their dioceses to cease using the name Catholic?
    Quote from: obscurus
    It’s a fact that St. Pius X is a congregation with 40 years of existence.”
    That's an excellent way of summarizing the SSPX's situation.


    Former Cardinal Mahony of Los Angeles threatened the SSPX in Duarte.
    Lord have mercy.