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Author Topic: Bring Back Multiple Wives?  (Read 5554 times)

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Offline B from A

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Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
« Reply #30 on: February 21, 2019, 07:06:48 PM »
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    Offline Judith 15 Ten

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #31 on: February 21, 2019, 07:07:49 PM »
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    • The Successor of Peter holds the Keys (Matthew 16:16-19), and he can loosen the one wife restriction to allowing multiple wives like the marital order of the Old Testament (the fact that Abraham, David, Solomon, et al, had multiple wives proves it's not inherently bad).

    Canon II of Trent speaks of the current law (which can change by the pope using the Keys) because having relations and fake "marriages" outside of the current one husband - one wife law is adultery.

    That's the bottom line. Most everything else people said on this thread is either missing the forest for the trees, ad hominem fallacy, red herring fallacy and strawman fallacy
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    Offline Matto

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #32 on: February 21, 2019, 07:18:06 PM »
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    • I am not sure if it is true, but I have heard it claimed that the Catholic Bishops of Paraguay allowed the men of that country to take on multiple wives after the War of the Triple Alliance where most of the country's men were killed because there were many more women than men left alive after the war was over. I don't know if this is true but I have heard the claim made.
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    Offline Vintagewife3

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #33 on: February 21, 2019, 07:31:41 PM »
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    • Do you really believe it would lead to a harmonious marriage?
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    Offline dymphnaw

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #34 on: February 21, 2019, 08:53:04 PM »
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    • Multiple wives?  Why on earth would the Church reduce woman to the level of a Mormon or a Muslima? As for the patriarchs, was there ever a happy home with multiple wives in the Bible. Leah and Rachel were at each other's throats.  Hagar and Sarah weren't happy together. David's wives were in constant competition. Solomon's wives led him away from proper worship. Finally, when did Our Lord ever say that it was okay to have more than one woman?
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    Offline jen51

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #35 on: February 22, 2019, 04:30:52 AM »
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    • I couldn't bare the thought of another woman being with my husband. It would be a sad and miserable existence. I can't imagine how women who share their husbands must feel, or NOT feel. It would be a shame to never experience the loyalty and companionship of husband and wife yet still be married. I'm grateful our culture and religion forbids it.

    Not only that it's just.... Gross. Really gross. I mean, who in their right mind would be comfortable with having multiple "partners" or being married to someone who does? 
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    Offline ihsv

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #36 on: February 22, 2019, 07:47:39 AM »
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    • Quote from: Judith 15 Ten on February 20, 2019, 03:25:23 PM
    I'd like to see the Catholic Church bring back multiple wives as an option for men who seek marriage like back in Abraham's and the early Hebrews' days. Righteous Abraham, King David and King Solomon had multiple wives.  

    We know in Matthew 16:16-19, Jesus Christ gave Peter the Keys of the Kingdom of Heaven to bind and loosen on earth, and the same will be bound and loosened in Heaven. This doesn't only mean retaining and forgiving sins, and rendering and lifting the temporal punishment tied to the sin. It, also, means "by making rules and laws for the government of the Church" as stated in the commentary of Haydock Catholic Bible apropos to the aforementioned scripture. It seems the number of wives allowed for a husband by the Church is a disciplinary law, which can change by what is deemed by the Successor of Peter, but Divine Law can never change (truth can't change - God can't change), and such Divine Law is for the man to remain faithful to his wife or wives and not commit adultery and fornication with women outside of his marriage(s), along with the other moral duties of the husband towards his wife or wives.

    I think multiple wives is one of the solutions to, and hedges against, feminism and a contentious wife. Women naturally compete with each other to please the central figure in their lives, which in this case would be their husband, thereby, receiving the affection & security they desire from him. If other wives are in this same husband's life, she will not disgruntle him over trivial matters or for selfish reasons (which is all too common in marriages in this post-modern world), because his favor & affection will shift towards the other wives, although he must still love and support the wife with whom he has retracted much of his favor. Also, in a group setting with other women, these same women will usually check their inner resentments, objections, and dislikes for the other women in order to get along as a cohesive group, because they know their very survival depends on it. This is an intuitive defense mechanism of normal, healthy women in any group setting containing a plurality of women.

    Judith/Croix, whether you realize it or not, you have some serious spiritual issues.  This proposition to have multiple wives is founded on lust, and the veneer of noble-sounding goals and clever justifications only advertises the fact.  No one here is deceived by your senseless arguments, least of all God.

    From the moment that canon from Trent that another poster provided showed up on this board, you should have immediately acquiesced and adjusted your beliefs to match what the Church decrees.  Instead, you dig in your heels and double-down.  This isn't surprising, since St. Thomas points out that the vice most opposed to the virtue of faith is impurity.  He also explains that impurity bedims the intellect.  I need make no further comments on that.

    Furthermore, I have never run into any spiritual writer, theologian, saint, etc., who argues what you do.  You're alone in your views, and that should scare you.

    You have a very pagan view of the Sacrament of Matrimony, grounded in the dust of the earth rather than the teachings of Christ.  St. Paul tells us that Matrimony is a great sacrament, intended to mirror the union between Christ and his Church.  Does Christ have multiple churches?   This is a view I would expect from Bergoglio, not advocated for here.

    It is demeaning to men.  Even more-so to women, reducing them to objects meant to "please the central figure in their lives... their husbands".  Pure paganism.  It completely negates the noble state that Christ has raised women (and men) to by virtue of the Sacrament of Matrimony.   Your justifications and explanations on why this would be "good" are founded entirely on the concupiscible passions, relying on competition, jealousy, favor and selfishness to achieve peace, happiness, etc.  Impossible.  No mention of the Christian virtues.  No mention of charity, humility, patience, meekness, self-sacrifice, etc.

    I've seen you complain on these boards that there aren't any good girls out there.  They're all infected with feminism, etc.  The reality is, the good ones can smell the stench of base passions a mile away, and none of them would have anything to do with such a man.

    And as Jen51 pointed out, it's disgusting.  

    This thread needs to die.
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    Online PAT317

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #37 on: February 22, 2019, 08:14:53 AM »
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    • Quote from: ihsv on February 22, 2019, 07:47:39 AM
    Judith/Croix, whether you realize it or not, you have some serious spiritual issues.  This proposition to have multiple wives is founded on lust, and the veneer of noble-sounding goals and clever justifications only advertises the fact.  No one here is deceived by your senseless arguments, least of all God.

    From the moment that canon from Trent that another poster provided showed up on this board, you should have immediately acquiesced and adjusted your beliefs to match what the Church decrees.  Instead, you dig in your heels and double-down.  This isn't surprising, since St. Thomas points out that the vice most opposed to the virtue of faith is impurity.  He also explains that impurity bedims the intellect.  I need make no further comments on that.

    Furthermore, I have never run into any spiritual writer, theologian, saint, etc., who argues what you do.  You're alone in your views, and that should scare you.

    You have a very pagan view of the Sacrament of Matrimony, grounded in the dust of the earth rather than the teachings of Christ.  St. Paul tells us that Matrimony is a great sacrament, intended to mirror the union between Christ and his Church.  Does Christ have multiple churches?   This is a view I would expect from Bergoglio, not advocated for here.

    It is demeaning to men.  Even more-so to women, reducing them to objects meant to "please the central figure in their lives... their husbands".  Pure paganism.  It completely negates the noble state that Christ has raised women (and men) to by virtue of the Sacrament of Matrimony.   Your justifications and explanations on why this would be "good" are founded entirely on the concupiscible passions, relying on competition, jealousy, favor and selfishness to achieve peace, happiness, etc.  Impossible.  No mention of the Christian virtues.  No mention of charity, humility, patience, meekness, self-sacrifice, etc.

    I've seen you complain on these boards that there aren't any good girls out there.  They're all infected with feminism, etc.  The reality is, the good ones can smell the stench of base passions a mile away, and none of them would have anything to do with such a man.

    And as Jen51 pointed out, it's disgusting.  

    This thread needs to die.
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    :applause:
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    This thread needs to die.
    .
    As does Judith/Croix's CI membership, permanently.  
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    Offline Vintagewife3

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #38 on: February 22, 2019, 08:22:42 AM »
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    • The last 3-4 post here  :applause:

    You guys are very well spoken.

    I would find it gross for sharing my husband as any man would sharing his wife.

    Christ, and the church have never been oppressive to women. They were not to be treated as cattle. 
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #39 on: February 22, 2019, 08:35:09 AM »
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    • Quote from: Judith 15 Ten on February 21, 2019, 07:07:49 PM
    Canon II of Trent speaks of the current law (which can change by the pope using the Keys) because having relations and fake "marriages" outside of the current one husband - one wife law is adultery.

    Trent teaches that one man and one woman is DIVINE LAW.  As I explained to you in my first post, the Church CANNOT "bind or loose" divine law.  Period.  End of thread.  While polygamy is not necessarily opposed to natural law, God chose not to impose the divine law prior to the arrival of Our Lord due to the hardness of their hearts.

    You have very much shown yourself to be a misogynist (we know that you're Croix/Quid returning for a 3rd time after having been banned), yet you would have many of these inferior creatures around you.  Only explanation that makes sense is the one put forward by ihsv, that it's driven by lust.

    I have stated over and over again here on CI that it's almost always the case that misogynists actually struggle with impurity, a way in which the find themselves dominated by women (though their passions).  Consequently, they lash out violently against women and wish to beat them down and oppress them.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #40 on: February 22, 2019, 08:54:44 AM »
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    • Well, although my wife doesn't have an account here, and just lurks (I've encouraged her to sign up before), I just have to post her comment:


    Quote
    If Croix did have multiple wives, then I'm sure they would all be thankful for the fact that there was more than one.  I'm sure they'd all be infighting - not to be his favorite but to be his least favorite

    It's your turn - no, it's your turn - he likes YOU better, no he likes YOU better.  You can have him tonight, no thank you I insist YOU have him.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #41 on: February 22, 2019, 09:00:24 AM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on February 22, 2019, 08:35:09 AM
    Trent teaches that one man and one woman is DIVINE LAW.  As I explained to you in my first post, the Church CANNOT "bind or loose" divine law.  Period.  End of thread.  While polygamy is not necessarily opposed to natural law, God chose not to impose the divine law prior to the arrival of Our Lord due to the hardness of their hearts.

    You have very much shown yourself to be a misogynist, yet you would have many of these inferior creatures around you.  Only explanation that makes sense is the one put forward by ihsv, that it's driven by lust.

    I have stated over and over again here on CI that it's almost always the case that misogynists actually struggle with impurity, a way in which the find themselves dominated by women (though their passions).  Consequently, they lash out violently against women and wish to beat them down and oppress them.
    VERY on-target and well said. There is no chance that Ladislaus is wrong about any of this.
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    Offline Matto

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #42 on: February 22, 2019, 10:34:42 AM »
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    • I am a misogynist by normie standards. But I do not hate women at all in reality, in fact I love them so much that often it hurts. I do not think Croix really hates women. I just think he is reacting to feminism and the world's erection of the female into an idol against all reason. I have noticed this even in the anti-feminist world such as among trad-dom. I think there is a tendency to view Christian women as almost un-fallen. I do not often struggle with sins of impurity even though I am a "misogynist" (though I used to sin in that way often in the past) and I would not accuse Croix of that either even though those sins are common. Of course, as with charges of anti-semitism I tend to err on the side of exoneration. Perhaps we should gather around Croix and cry out in unison "Who hurt you?"
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #43 on: February 22, 2019, 10:49:36 AM »
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    • Quote from: Matto on February 22, 2019, 10:34:42 AM
    I do not think Croix really hates women.

    I disagree.  There have been just too many comments in his posting history that lead me to the opposite conclusion.  He is clearly not just standing up, as a matter or principle, against feminism.
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    Offline Cantarella

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    Re: Bring Back Multiple Wives?
    « Reply #44 on: February 22, 2019, 02:02:05 PM »
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    • Quote from: Judith 15 Ten on February 21, 2019, 07:07:49 PM
    The Successor of Peter holds the Keys (Matthew 16:16-19), and he can loosen the one wife restriction to allowing multiple wives like the marital order of the Old Testament (the fact that Abraham, David, Solomon, et al, had multiple wives proves it's not inherently bad).

    Canon II of Trent speaks of the current law (which can change by the pope using the Keys) because having relations and fake "marriages" outside of the current one husband - one wife law is adultery.

    Not even the Pope, the Vicar of Christ on earth himself, has the power to change what the Church has defined infallibly, such as a Tridentine Canon. Canons are dogmas of the Faith. They do not concern disciplinary or temporary affairs; but are dogmatic, which means they are true for ever. These truths are immutable.

    Popes can only revise or alter disciplinary matters and sometimes even override each other pertaining those, but they cannot touch dogmas. The Catholic Church has already condemned Polygamy in the Council of Trent; and this is a dogmatic infallible truth. For the good of your soul, it is best to put this issue to rest.
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