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Offline 1st Mansion Tenant

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Australia Law to Breach Confessional
« on: June 14, 2018, 06:57:01 PM »
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  • https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2018/06/legal_confidentiality_of_catholic_confession_to_be_breeched_.html

    June 14, 2018
    Legal confidentiality of Catholic confession to be breached
    By Thomas Lifson
    The Catholic Church's practice of Confession is a sacrament of the faith, with the priest hearing confessions held to an inviolable sacramental seal, under pain of excommunication for the priest if that seal is broken.  Accordingly, the law in most Western countries protects the priest hearing confessions from being compelled to testify against the penitent who admits a crime.
    That accommodation of law is about to be broken in Australia.  The Australian Associated Press reports:
    Quote
    South Australian priests hearing confessions about child abuse will have a mandatory obligation from October to report the matter to police.
    SA will become the first state to adopt the recommendation of the abuse royal commission, meaning priests face the prospect of criminal charges for failing to report child abuse revealed in confession.
    "For many years priests and ministers have been obliged to report outside of confessional and we changed the law last year to be effective first of October," Attorney-General Vickie Chapman told ABC radio on Thursday.
    [color][size][font]
    A later dispatch from the AAP elaborates:
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    Not reporting abuse will carry a maximum $10,000 fine, and brings expectations of priests in line with those of social workers, teachers, medical professionals and others in positions of authority.
    But Bishop Greg O'Kelly said the church had not been made aware of the change which was legislated last year, and was now considering its implications.


    Basilica of St. Peter's confessional booth, Vatican City (Wikimedia Commons).
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    Protecting abused children of course is a worthy goal and a particular vulnerability of a Catholic Church still recovering from its own child sex abuse scandals.  For those opponents of the Church eager to do it harm, it represents an ideal opportunity to attack its legal status and bring turmoil to its priestly ranks, who will be forced to choose between prosecution and excommunication.
    Even though I am not a Catholic, I view this move with great alarm.  Owing to its history, size, and status as a diplomatic entity with sovereign capital in Vatican City, the Church stands as a bulwark for biblical teachings.  That has won it determined enemies.
    Our Australian correspondent John McMahon, who brought this to my attention, comments, "This was inevitable.  The long term aim of these activists has always been to destroy the Catholic Church."[/font][/size][/color]

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #1 on: June 14, 2018, 07:51:41 PM »
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  • I believe this is bluff.

    Can somebody name the new "law" and when is passed through the Upper and Lower Houses of Parliament? When was this debated and who voted and how?

    How would anyone one what was confessed?
    And how would a child abuser  go about proving he confessed his sin to a priest?
    And would such a report be likely?


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #2 on: June 14, 2018, 08:10:03 PM »
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  • .
    It's hard to imagine how this could be enforced. What priest is going to be able to say with absolute certainty what the identity of the penitent was? Of course, he would be concerned that he might make a mistake. Maybe he had THOUGHT that it was John Smith confessing, who sounds a lot like Andrew Crabtree, but he couldn't be entirely certain which it was. Does he report both names? Then at least one would be a mistake. Maybe they're both mistakes! Then the real responsible party goes free and two innocent men are falsely accused!
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    So they'd have to require that priests in Australia have a new system by which anyone confessing their sins would have to fill out an application to confess and a clerk or someone like a notary, would have to verify identity of the penitent before he would be allowed to enter the confessional, and the priest hearing the confession would have to have access to the verified information on the application while he's hearing the confession so he would be able to decide if what he hears rises to the level of his obligation to make a report. He might want to come out of the confessional to make a visual check on who the penitent was speaking to him. So they'd be prone to getting rid of the confessional screen that seems to hide the faces of penitent and priest. Does that encourage sinners to confess their sins?
    .
    If it applies to child abuse, why stop there? If someone admits to murder, or bank robbery, or embezzlement or any other crime, why would the state NOT want to require the priest to report the information and attest to the identity of the admitted perpetrator?
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #3 on: June 14, 2018, 08:24:10 PM »
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  • I believe this is bluff.

    Can somebody name the new "law" and when is passed through the Upper and Lower Houses of Parliament? When was this debated and who voted and how?

    How would anyone one [know?] what was confessed?
    And how would a child abuser go about proving he confessed his sin to a priest?
    And would such a report be likely?
    .............. A post by an Australian resident! 
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    If put into effect, every priest hearing confessions would be exposing himself to inspection by under cover investigators, people who are working for the government and pretending to confess their sins in order to trap the priest! 
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    I can envision the already-short confession schedules to become a lot shorter. 
    Some parishes in my area have "Sacrament of Reconciliation available by Appointment Only" written prominently in the bulletin.
    And that's BEFORE any snooping law is put into practice. 
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    Offline JPaul

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #4 on: June 14, 2018, 08:25:47 PM »
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  • Needless to say, the Jews have considerable influence and power in the government.  This is rich, considering their predeliction for pedophilia.   The fellow is right about trying to destroy the Church, what else is new?


    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #5 on: June 14, 2018, 11:24:23 PM »
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  • I emailed a priest I know and he wrote:



    Quote
    Yes, I had seen the news. It's also in this weekend's Catholic Weekly.
    .
    I had presumed the article was about ACT (Australian Capital Territory – a small enclave surrounding the capital, Canberra)! But it's SA, which makes that the second jurisdiction in Australia.
    .
    The ACT government had earlier also legislated a similar law on priests' mandatory reporting of child abuse heard in confession. The trouble is, the archbishop there who is 'fighting' it actually invited the government of ACT to legislate more laws in the interests of child safety, so he is getting what he deserved. The bishops should never encourage the government to interfere in Church affairs, because such laws are the result. Even liberal priests will disobey the law in this matter, if we are to take the word of Fr Frank Brennan!


    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #6 on: June 14, 2018, 11:25:25 PM »
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  • https://www.catholicweekly.com.au/threat-to-the-seal-of-confession/

    Threat to the seal of confession
    By Staff writers   June 7, 2018   0


    Archbishop of Canberra and Goulburn Christopher Prowse at last year’s national youth festival, ACYF. PHOTO: Cyron Sobrevinas
    The Catholic Archbishop of Canberra and Goulburn Christopher Prowse has expressed shock over the passage of a new child protection law which seeks to force priests to break the seal of confession in cases where child abuse is disclosed.
    The change is an expansion of the ACT’s current reportable conduct scheme to include religious organisations’ ‘activities, facilities, programs or services’ to report allegations, offences, or convictions related to children to the ACT Ombudsman.
    This expansion was supported by Archbishop Prowse, who had been calling for the reportable conduct scheme to include parishes and religious organisations for “well over a year.”
    However, the new law does not provide an exemption for disclosures made in the sacrament of confession, a move that has been criticised as an overreach.
    The new law comes into effect on 1 July, but the provision relating to the confessional won’t apply until 31 March, 2019 to give Church authorities time to discuss with the Government how it will work.
    If no solution is found, the ACT will become the country’s only jurisdiction where priests can be convicted for maintaining the seal of confession.
    The law was passed by the ACT Legislative Assembly on 7 June, although three Liberal MPs, Andrew Wall, Elizabeth Kikkert, and Vicki Dunne, expressed concerns that the clause on confession was a step too far.
    “I’m extremely disappointed that [the bill] was augmented to include intervention into the sacrament of confession without any consultation with the archdiocese,” Archbishop Prowse said.
    “To have the Church’s sacramental life intruded upon is quite extraordinary given the democratic country we live in.
    “I’m quite in shock about that.
    “The way we are moving is towards a fundamental infringement on basic human rights of religious expression and freedom.”
    The Archbishop told The Catholic Weekly that he only received notification about the clause on confession in a letter from the Attorney General dated 7 May.
    “I immediately wrote to the Attorney General requesting a meeting which is scheduled for June 19. I was given minimal time to respond and I just found in the last week that it was going to be debated in parliament yesterday.
    “That meeting will now be pivotal because I still don’t know what they’ve got in mind.
    “I believe that is it not an ‘either-or’ situation of ensuring child safety or the integrity of the sacrament.
    “It’s ‘both-and’ child safety and the integrity of the sacrament.
    “All of us have got to work these areas out together in a respectful tone of mutual dialogue.”
    The archbishop said he has been in touch with canon lawyers for advice on the issue and would also speak with the Apostolic Nuncio, Pope Francis’ representative in Australia.
    In an opinion article for The Canberra Times, Archbishop Prowse said the requirement to break the seal of confession would neither help to prevent abuse or efforts to improve the safety of children in Catholic institutions.
    Apart from the fact that child abusers do not confess their crimes, such legislation would also threaten Catholic’s religious freedom and put it out of step with other jurisdictions, he wrote.
    “The government threatens religious freedom by appointing itself an expert on religious practices and by attempting to change the sacrament of confession while delivering no improvement in the safety of children.
    “Sadly, breaking the seal of confession won’t prevent abuse and it won’t help our ongoing efforts to improve the safety of children in Catholic institutions.”
    He also argued it would be difficult to put into practice, as most confessions are done anonymously and there’s no proof of identity required from penitents.
    Last year’s Royal Commission recommendations included the creation of laws covering priests who fail to report abuse admissions made during confession.
    Several politicians have expressed a preference for the seal of the confessional to be addressed by the Council of Australian Governments (COAG), rather than governments in isolation.
    NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian in April said her government’s response to the Royal Commission recommendation was to “take it through the COAG process”.
    “They’re complex issues that need to be balanced with what people believe to be religious freedoms,” she said.
    The Catholic Code of Canon Law states that ‘The sacramental seal is inviolable; therefore it is absolutely forbidden for a confessor to betray in any way a penitent in words or in any manner and for any reason: Can. 983 §1’.

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #7 on: June 15, 2018, 01:36:35 AM »
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  • .

    .
    https://www.catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=690
    .
    In his early childhood, John Nepomucene was cured of a disease through the prayers of his good parents. In thanksgiving, they consecrated him to the service of God. After he was ordained, he was sent to a parish in the city of Prague. He became a great preacher, and thousands of those who listened to him changed their way of life [not including the King, apparently]. Father John was invited to the court of Wenceslaus IV [not to be misconstrued for Good King Wenceslaus, who "looked out on the Feast of Stephen"]. He settled arguments and did many kind deeds for the needy people of the city. He also became the queen's confessor. When the king was cruel to the queen, Father John taught her to bear her cross patiently. One day, about 1393, the king asked him to tell what the queen had said in confession. When Father John refused, he was thrown into prison. A second time, he was asked to reveal the queen's confession. "If you do not tell me," said the king, "you shall die. But if you obey my commands, riches and honor will be yours." Again Father John refused. He was tortured. The king ordered him to be thrown into the river. Where he drowned, a strange brightness appeared upon the water. He is known as the "martyr of the confessional." He is patron of Czechoslovakia, [now goes by Czech Republic] where he is invoked against floods and against slander. His feast day is May 16.
    .
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    Offline poche

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    Re: Australia Law to Breach Confessional
    « Reply #8 on: June 16, 2018, 02:40:16 AM »
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  • Needless to say, the Jews have considerable influence and power in the government.  This is rich, considering their predeliction for pedophilia.   The fellow is right about trying to destroy the Church, what else is new?
    Protestants also do not respect the seal of confession.

     

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