Author Topic: Are the Jєωs still God's chosen people? (Read 2937 times)

radtrad · « **on:** July 28, 2009, 09:23:40 PM »

The Jєωs were the chosen people. God chose them for many great things. This does not mean they are the chosen people.

God chose them, but they refuse to choose Him! This all goes back to the old covenant God made with the Jєωιѕн people. There was a covenant with Abraham and there was one with Moses. Abraham's covenant is still intact, Moses is not.

Look over Sungenis' site. He writes extensively on this.

Robert

Dylan · « **Reply #1 on:** July 28, 2009, 10:14:28 PM »

The Jєωs were never 'God's Chosen People' - The Israelites were. The fact is that the modern (αѕнкenαzι) Jєωs descend from the Idumeans (Edomites) who were forcibly converted to Hebrewism by John Hyrcanus in 125 BC. Many of these Edomite converts rose to some of the highest positions of power within the Israelite religious hierarchy, eventually debasing it into what became known as Pharisaism and later progressed into тαℓмυdism, and then into modern Judaism.

http://christsassembly.com/literature/Pharisees_Idumeans.htm

The Israelites eventually became the modern Indo-European peoples after their captivity in 721 BC in Assyria. But, today the Church is the True Israel, so the Church is really God's Chosen People.

radtrad · « **Reply #2 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:03:53 AM »

Quote from: Dylan

The Jєωs were never 'God's Chosen People' - The Israelites were.

Very well put. It is a distinction many, included myself, overlook.

Robert

Vladimir · « **Reply #3 on:** July 29, 2009, 05:36:54 PM »

Dylan, your knowledge concerning the Jєωs and the various Biblical ethnicities never ceases to amaze me. Do you have any reading material to recommend? Scanning through next year's history textbook, I have a feeling that I will spend much of my time arguing with my teacher and liberal classmates....

Matthew · « **Reply #4 on:** July 29, 2009, 05:41:53 PM »

Quote from: Dylan

The Jєωs were never 'God's Chosen People' - The Israelites were. The fact is that the modern (αѕнкenαzι) Jєωs descend from the Idumeans (Edomites) who were forcibly converted to Hebrewism by John Hyrcanus in 125 BC. Many of these Edomite converts rose to some of the highest positions of power within the Israelite religious hierarchy, eventually debasing it into what became known as Pharisaism and later progressed into тαℓмυdism, and then into modern Judaism.

http://christsassembly.com/literature/Pharisees_Idumeans.htm

The Israelites eventually became the modern Indo-European peoples after their captivity in 721 BC in Assyria. But, today the Church is the True Israel, so the Church is really God's Chosen People.

That website seems to be quoting some kind of scriptures I've never heard of. Is that a Mormon website?

Matthew

Vladimir · « **Reply #5 on:** July 29, 2009, 05:45:04 PM »

I believe that it may be a Jehovah's Witness website.

Dylan · « **Reply #6 on:** July 29, 2009, 07:57:19 PM »

Quote from: ChantCd

Quote from: Dylan
The Jєωs were never 'God's Chosen People' - The Israelites were. The fact is that the modern (αѕнкenαzι) Jєωs descend from the Idumeans (Edomites) who were forcibly converted to Hebrewism by John Hyrcanus in 125 BC. Many of these Edomite converts rose to some of the highest positions of power within the Israelite religious hierarchy, eventually debasing it into what became known as Pharisaism and later progressed into тαℓмυdism, and then into modern Judaism.

http://christsassembly.com/literature/Pharisees_Idumeans.htm

The Israelites eventually became the modern Indo-European peoples after their captivity in 721 BC in Assyria. But, today the Church is the True Israel, so the Church is really God's Chosen People.

That website seems to be quoting some kind of scriptures I've never heard of. Is that a Mormon website?

Matthew

I think it's a Christian Identity website - Christian Identity is a theological/historical position that the Indo-European peoples descend from the lost tribes of Israel. It's mainly followed by Protestants but, I know of other Catholics (including myself) who believe that the Indo-European peoples are the lost tribes of Israel.

I think you're referring to the citations of the historical works of Flavius Josephus (e.g. Ant. 15.11.1-2; 380-90 = War 1.21.1; 401).

Dylan · « **Reply #7 on:** July 29, 2009, 07:59:52 PM »

Quote from: Vladimir

I believe that it may be a Jehovah's Witness website.

I think the "Watchman" reference is regarding the Watchman of Israel mentioned in the Bible. The Jehovah's Witnesses' have "Watchtower" as their symbol

Dylan · « **Reply #8 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:17:26 PM »

Quote from: Vladimir

Dylan, your knowledge concerning the Jєωs and the various Biblical ethnicities never ceases to amaze me. Do you have any reading material to recommend? Scanning through next year's history textbook, I have a feeling that I will spend much of my time arguing with my teacher and liberal classmates....

trad123 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:34:20 PM »

If Indo-Europeans descended from Japheth then that would not make us Israelites, because Abram (Abraham) was descended from Sem (I'm using D-R version):

Quote

Genesis 5:31 And all the days of Lamech came to seven hundred and seventy-seven years, and he died. And Noe, when he was five hundred years old, begot Sem, Cham, and Japheth.

Quote

Genesis 11:10 These are the generations of Sem....

Quote

Genesis 11:26 And Thare lived seventy years, and begot Abram, and Nachor, and Aran.

trad123 · « **Reply #10 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:37:37 PM »

Even if it is true that the αѕнкenαzι Jєωs are actually from the Kingdom of Khazaria you still have to account for the Sephardic Jєωs.

trad123 · « **Reply #11 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:48:57 PM »

I believe that is where we get the word "Semite" from. Those who call themselves "Semites" are descended from Sem.

Dylan · « **Reply #12 on:** July 29, 2009, 09:02:25 PM »

Quote from: trad123

If Indo-Europeans descended from Japheth then that would not make us Israelites, because Abram (Abraham) was descended from Sem (I'm using D-R version):

Quote
Genesis 5:31 And all the days of Lamech came to seven hundred and seventy-seven years, and he died. And Noe, when he was five hundred years old, begot Sem, Cham, and Japheth.

Quote
Genesis 11:10 These are the generations of Sem....

Quote
Genesis 11:26 And Thare lived seventy years, and begot Abram, and Nachor, and Aran.

I didn't say that Indo-Europeans descend from Japheth. I said they were descendants of the 12 tribes of Israel and thus, descended from Shem. The Vasconic, Kartvelian, Finno-Ugric, Turkic, Mongoloid, and Amerindian peoples descend from Japheth.

It is commonly assumed that Japheth gave rise to the Indo-Europeans but, in actuality he fathered some of the pre-Indo-European peoples of Europe, like the Vascons, Tartessians, Ionians, and Tyrrhenians who were later driven out and replaced by Shemites. Modern people in Europe who descend from Japheth are the Hungarians, Finns, Estonians, Lapps, Georgians, and possibly the Basque people of Spain.

The books I provided above go into detail using historical, archaeological, and Scriptural evidence on how the Lost Tribes became the modern Indo-European peoples.

The Jєωs would only descend from Shem or Abraham through Esau (Edom), while the Indo-Europeans descend from Shem and Abraham through Jacob (Israel). The Jєωs, however, descend from Canaan and Ham through Esau's Canaanite wives.

Dylan · « **Reply #13 on:** July 29, 2009, 09:05:11 PM »

Quote from: trad123

Even if it is true that the αѕнкenαzι Jєωs are actually from the Kingdom of Khazaria you still have to account for the Sephardic Jєωs.

The Sephardic Jєωs are a mix of ancient Edomite and ancient Israelite ancestry, as well as the ancestry of the lands of their residence for instance, a Spanish Sephardic Jєω might have some actual Spanish ancestry and a Moroccan Sephardic Jєω might have some Berber ancestry.

Belloc · « **Reply #14 on:** August 06, 2009, 01:56:10 PM »

Quote from: Uriel

Is this entirely true or not? Can someone please explain to me by what is ment by GOD'S CHOOSEN PEOPLE? Is the artical bias in favor of the Jєω...still?

THX

Are the Jєωs still God's chosen people?

Yes, God chose Abraham and established through him an everlasting nation with the promise of an everlasting covenant (Genesis 17:1-8, 1 Chronicles 16:15-17, Luke 1:54-55). Since then, God has been identified as the God of Abraham and his offspring (Exodus 3:6, Acts 3:13), and as the God of Israel (Exodus 5:1, 1 Kings 1:30, Psalm 72:18, Jeremiah 51:33, Matthew 15:31). Throughout Jєωιѕн history, the Israelites continually broke God's commandments and were punished severely, however, God always forgave them and re-established their nation when they repented (Isaiah 30) -- which is the meaning of Israel itself ("he struggles with God" - Genesis 32:28, 35:9-10). This is the name the Lord gave to Jacob, because he struggled with God and men and overcame (Genesis 32:28).

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"Therefore say to the house of Israel, 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: It is not for your sake, O house of Israel, that I am going to do these things, but for the sake of my holy name, which you have profaned among the nations where you have gone. I will show the holiness of my great name, which has been profaned among the nations, the name you have profaned among them. Then the nations will know that I am the LORD, declares the Soverign LORD, when I show myself holy through you before their eyes.' " (Ezekiel 36:22-23)

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Even when the Israelites were disobedient to God, they still remained his chosen people for the sake of the Lord's name (1 Samuel 12:22, Psalm 106:8, Isaiah 43:25, 48:9-11, Jeremiah 14:20-21, Ezekiel 20:44, 36:22-23). After nearly 1,900 years, Israel has been established once again as God has promised -- even in the midst of all its enemies and with a lack of belief of the majority of its people.

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"I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew." (Romans 11:1-2)
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"Again I ask: Did they stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious. But if their transgression means riches for the world, and their loss means riches for the Gentiles, how much greater riches will their fullness bring!" (Romans 11:11-12)

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Although John the Baptist proclaimed that God could raise up sons for Abraham from stones (Matthew 3:9, Luke 3:8) and the Apostle Paul plainly states that those who believe by faith are sons of Abraham (Romans 4:16-17, 9:6-8, Galations 3:6-9), this in no way means that God now refers to Israel as the body of Christ and no longer as the Jєωιѕн nation he originally established (Luke 2:30-32, Acts 13:26). On the contrary, they still remain the firstfruits of God's chosen people (Jєωs and Gentiles) and the root of Christianity (Romans 11:16).

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"If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, do not boast over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you... After all, if you were cut out of an olive tree that is wild by nature, and contrary to nature were grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much more readily will these, the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree!" (Romans 11:17-24)

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Remember that salvation comes through the Jєωs (John 4:22) and for the Jєωs first (Romans1:16). Jesus was originally sent to save the Jєωιѕн Israelites only (Matthew 10:6, 15:24, John 12:12-16), and it wasn't until after they crucified him that salvation was made available to the Gentiles (Acts 11:1-18). Even so, this was the Messiah's first appearance, and at his second coming he promises to give his seal of redemption with the name of the Lamb and the Father to 144,000 pure members of the twelve original tribes of Israel --12,000 in each literal tribe (Revelation 7:3-8, 14:1-5)-- and to establish a new Holy City of Jerusalem with twelve gates named after the twelve tribes of Israel (Revelation 21:10-12). This means that those Jєωs who still live by the original covenant will be redeemed and retain their original standing as God's chosen nation.

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"I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: 'The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins.' [Isaiah 59:20-21] As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies on your account; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable. Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience, so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now receive mercy as a result of God's mercy to you. For God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all." (Romans 11:25-32)

Read Galatians, chosen are those who through faith are sons of Abraham......heirs according to promise.....

Author Topic: Are the Jєωs still God&#039;s chosen people? (Read 2937 times)

Author Topic: Are the Jєωs still God's chosen people? (Read 2937 times)