Read an Interview with Matthew, the owner of CathInfo

Author Topic: Annulments - VII church path to hell by Adultery  (Read 3378 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Matthew

  • Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 22949
  • Reputation: +20087/-243
  • Gender: Male
Re: Annulments - VII church path to hell by Adultery
« Reply #75 on: February 18, 2019, 08:57:36 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Yes, and I think what we're trying to say is that the Church shouldn't WANT a bunch of couples to be "divorcing", even for a good reason. Better to prevent the attempted non-marriage in the first place.

    As I keep mentioning, there are permanent, real-world consequences for "attempted marriage" such as children, broken homes, jealousy, child support, experience with multiple partners, etc. These real problems occur even if everything is hunky-dory with the Church, in the eyes of God, etc.

    Even if the couple are just stupid, ignorant (and therefore blameless) for not knowing the nature of marriage, the Church certainly should know better, and try to head off these bad consequences.

    The Church should be instructing couples properly, and preventing these non-marriages before they get started.
    Start your Amazon.com session by clicking this link, and my family and I get a commission on your purchase!

    Offline Stanley N

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 511
    • Reputation: +153/-210
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Annulments - VII church path to hell by Adultery
    « Reply #76 on: February 18, 2019, 08:59:42 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Think before writing. That was an excellent point made by ggreg. No one can argue against it. The same lawful impediment before the marriage invalidates the marriage forever. The same lawful impediment is what will be used in the future to validly annul the marriage.  
    Scenario again: she was divorced civilly. He and she married in the Church (N.O.). Her previous situation was known, examined, and handled by the priest before the marriage. (I also understand what happened, possibly better than my uncle did at the time.) It's not new information.


    Offline ggreg

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3002
    • Reputation: +177/-175
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Annulments - VII church path to hell by Adultery
    « Reply #77 on: February 18, 2019, 02:37:15 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • 1. Then this is the fault of the Conciliar Church, which fails to properly prepare couples for marriage or even vet them before marriage -- this alone is enough reason to be a Trad (leave the Conciliar Church, even if it means staying home on Sundays)

    After all, what affects your chance of salvation more than your vocation or marriage? It's kind of important.

    2. Even if they are OK in God's eyes, it doesn't change the fact that man SOMETIMES forgives and nature NEVER forgives. You will still have all the issues of divorce that any worldling experiences: ex-spouses, child custody, child support, dealing with lawyers and courts, demeaning the other spouse when you're with your child, comparing past partners to your current one, jealousy, loneliness, etc.
    Agreed, the Conciliar Church ENTIRELY fails in that regard.  In the UK, at least, it did more than just fail it positively taught that contraception was something left entirely to your conscience and HV something of an embarrassment to be ignored by sensible people.  I can remember arguing with the RE Teacher, the School Headmaster, the local parish priest and so on when I was at a Catholic school in the 1980s.  They were ALL contracepted to the eyeballs as were the vast majority of my friends families.  Our 9 was exceptional.  There was a 5 and a few 4s but the vast majority of my friends came from 3, 2 or 1 sized families.
    Not sure about other countries, but I've not heard of anywhere the bishops have preached heavily against a contraceptive mentality which I imagine is why Catholic Europe's birth rate is lower than the UKs, Sweden and France (who produce the most births in Europe and roughly equal to the USA's birth rate.
    Portugal's is lower than Japan's.  That really is low.  I think Catholic Portugal (which apparently still has the Dogma of the Faith kicking around somewhere) has the third lowest birthrate on planet Earth. 197 countries are more "open to life" than the Portuguese.
    I can never look at the birth rate statistics without thinking of Luke 14
    "A certain man made a great supper, and invited many. And he sent his servant at the hour of supper to say to them that were invited, that they should come, for now all things are ready. 18.And they began all at once to make excuse. The first said to him: I have bought a farm, and I must needs go out and see it: I pray thee, hold me excused. And another said: I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to try them: I pray thee, hold me excused. And another said: I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come. And the servant returning, told these things to his lord. Then the master of the house, being angry, said to his servant: Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in hither the poor, and the feeble, and the blind, and the lame. And the servant said: Lord, it is done as thou hast commanded, and yet there is room. And the Lord said to the servant: Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled. But I say unto you, that none of those men that were invited, shall taste of my supper." 
    http://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/total-fertility-rate/
    It strikes me that the selfishness of those who won't have children as God sends them and cooperate with God's plan are very similar those who will not attend the wedding feast of their master.  101 excuses none of them good.
    If people can afford 6 children in Niger then they can certainly afford them in Portugal.
    Will God destroy the non productive races and start over with Africa?  Certainly there are going to be a billion more black faces and a billion less white ones by 2100; even if He does nothing.

    Offline ggreg

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3002
    • Reputation: +177/-175
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Annulments - VII church path to hell by Adultery
    « Reply #78 on: February 18, 2019, 02:51:12 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • They should react to divorce like a man from 1850, when divorce was scandalous and rare. 
    Do any religions act like that today about divorce or adultery?
    Which loosely Christian sects are, practically speaking, the most against divorce and adultery?

    Offline Last Tradhican

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2926
    • Reputation: +1617/-955
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Annulments - VII church path to hell by Adultery
    « Reply #79 on: February 18, 2019, 06:01:30 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Scenario again: she was divorced civilly. He and she married in the Church (N.O.). Her previous situation was known, examined, and handled by the priest before the marriage. (I also understand what happened, possibly better than my uncle did at the time.) It's not new information.
    The civil divorce is not as important as the previous marriage, THAT IS what is important to know, for the Novus Ordo regularly grants annulments to couples married in the Church for years and even with children. 
    The Vatican II church - Assisting Souls to Hell Since 1962

    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. Mat 24:24


    Offline Stanley N

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 511
    • Reputation: +153/-210
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Annulments - VII church path to hell by Adultery
    « Reply #80 on: February 20, 2019, 09:55:00 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • The civil divorce is not as important as the previous marriage, THAT IS what is important to know, for the Novus Ordo regularly grants annulments to couples married in the Church for years and even with children.
    I have made it quite clear that the uncle's marriage is valid.

    The problem is that despite being told that, there were people who just had to know what was going on so that THEY were satisfied. Which is not unlike what happened in this thread. (To Matthew's credit he stopped being involved on this issue.)

    Do I really need to explain the circumstances of my uncle's marriage before someone can just accept it? I don't think I should have to - it would mean explaining it to everyone who asked, potentially for decades.

    I told people who asked that it's not your business, and take your concerns to our trad. priest if you must. What do you think the priest told them?

    On a different point, sometimes an invalid marriage cannot be validated because the impediment is ongoing. A solution is likely either going to be difficult for any children, or difficult for the couple.

     

    Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16