Author Topic: Act of Perfect Contrition (Read 9066 times)

MyrnaM · « **Reply #30 on:** December 18, 2014, 04:44:40 PM »

It important to understand and believe that nothing takes the place of the Sacrament, but it will suffice if you should die before you can get to Confession through no fault of your own. God always provide to those who are sincere in their Faith.

As does BOD.

Miseremini · « **Reply #31 on:** December 18, 2014, 05:14:45 PM »

Quote from: 2Vermont

So you're trying to tell me that a good Catholic can't give truth while also being charitable in their words and actions. That would be a false assertion.

You're also assuming that Cantarella is actually right. I said she's more concerned in being right (that doesn't necessarily equate with actually being so).

To answer the first paragraph
Your are absolutely right I'm not trying to tell you that. You made a false assertion.

To answer the second paragraph
I understood the comment to mean she is more interested in the truth. I didn't assume anything.

Cantarella · « **Reply #32 on:** December 18, 2014, 05:29:42 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

It important to understand and believe that nothing takes the place of the Sacrament, but it will suffice if you should die before you can get to Confession through no fault of your own. God always provide to those who are sincere in their Faith.

As does BOD.

No, Myrna, no matter how many times it is said by the modernists, nobody can be saved without the Sacraments instituted by Christ Lord and dispensed the Church. Promising salvation without the Sacraments is actually a sin against charity. Furthermore, Penance and Baptism are different.

One could potentially enter Heaven without Penance if not guilty of mortal sin, but one is unable to enter Heaven without receiving Baptism. The possibility of being washed from original sin through Baptism and not being guilty of mortal sin during a life time is there.

Baptism is the first remission of sin. It grants a seal or mark upon the soul that cannot be erased. Even if the person falls from grace by committing mortal sin. But to obtain forgiveness of sins committed after Baptism, one is not allowed to be baptized again, but must receive the Sacrament of Penance. Penance in this sense is an ongoing conversion and after Baptism, indispensably necessary for people who have committed sins, to enter heaven.

There is no real, tangible matter in Penance (as opposed to Baptism, for which is water). It is considered that the matter may be the acts of the penitent (contrition, confession and satisfaction). The form of the Sacrament of Penance consists in the words of absolution, given by a priest. If a person dies fallen from grace, this is, in state of mortal sin, cannot enter Heaven. No soul enters Heaven stained with sin. Their grave sins must be forgiven. Those who die without obtaining from God pardon for their sins will not be saved, but will be damned as they have made themselves unworthy of Heaven. It is Catholic dogma that the Sacrament of Penance is necessary for salvation to those who, after Baptism, fall into grievous sin.

Having said this, what is defined as an Act of Perfect Contrition is true sorrow for one's sins with the commitment of actually going to receive the Sacrament from a priest. Therefore, the obligation to confess remains and hopefully one does not die before receiving absolution since true sorrow may suffice for venial sins but most likely not so for mortal sin. Better not to take any unnecessary risks. After all, it is really one's soul which may forever perish.

From the Catechism:

Quote

Canon 1452 When it arises from a love by which God is loved above all else, contrition is called "perfect" (contrition of charity). Such contrition remits venial sins; it also obtains forgiveness of mortal sins if it includes the firm resolution to have recourse to sacramental confession as soon as possible.51

Canon 1453 The contrition called "imperfect" (or "attrition") is also a gift of God, a prompting of the Holy Spirit. It is born of the consideration of sin's ugliness or the fear of eternal damnation and the other penalties threatening the sinner (contrition of fear). Such a stirring of conscience can initiate an interior process which, under the prompting of grace, will be brought to completion by sacramental absolution. By itself however, imperfect contrition cannot obtain the forgiveness of grave sins, but it disposes one to obtain forgiveness in the sacrament of Penance.52

2Vermont · « **Reply #33 on:** December 18, 2014, 05:43:58 PM »

Quote from: Miseremini

Quote from: 2Vermont

So you're trying to tell me that a good Catholic can't give truth while also being charitable in their words and actions. That would be a false assertion.

You're also assuming that Cantarella is actually right. I said she's more concerned in being right (that doesn't necessarily equate with actually being so).

To answer the first paragraph
Your are absolutely right I'm not trying to tell you that. You made a false assertion.

To answer the second paragraph
I understood the comment to mean she is more interested in the truth. I didn't assume anything.

As Catholics we should tell the Truth in charity. This post was about a concern I had about the Act of Perfect Contrition. She took it as another opportunity to take a jab at sedevacantists. Nowhere did she tell the truth in charity. Period.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #34 on:** December 18, 2014, 07:55:45 PM »

Cantarella your words here again ... " Having said this, what is defined as an Act of Perfect Contrition is true sorrow for one's sins with the commitment of actually going to receive the Sacrament from a priest. Therefore, the obligation to confess remains and hopefully one does not die before receiving absolution since true sorrow may suffice for venial sins but most likely not so for mortal sin. Better not to take any unnecessary risks. After all, it is really one's soul which may forever perish."

The Catechism is clear, that a Perfect Act of Contrition does indeed forgive sins if Confession is not obtainable THROUGH NO FAULT of the sinner, AND IF THE PERSON DIES. If the person, lives however, of course they would have to go Confession or receive Baptism ASAP.

I realize you do not believe in BOD, but I do.

Cantarella · « **Reply #35 on:** December 18, 2014, 09:07:03 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Cantarella your words here again ... " Having said this, what is defined as an Act of Perfect Contrition is true sorrow for one's sins with the commitment of actually going to receive the Sacrament from a priest. Therefore, the obligation to confess remains and hopefully one does not die before receiving absolution since true sorrow may suffice for venial sins but most likely not so for mortal sin. Better not to take any unnecessary risks. After all, it is really one's soul which may forever perish."

The Catechism is clear, that a Perfect Act of Contrition does indeed forgive sins if Confession is not obtainable THROUGH NO FAULT of the sinner, AND IF THE PERSON DIES. If the person, lives however, of course they would have to go Confession or receive Baptism ASAP.

I realize you do not believe in BOD, but I do.

Nowhere does it appear in the catechism the modernist excuse of "through not fault of his own". The vast, vast majority of Catholics are actually able to find themselves a priest to hear their confessions before they die, if they really believe in it, and really wish it. Chances are it is a matter of will and of course, God's grace. If one must walk 1000 miles, so be it. If one must drive 20 hours, so be it. The saints used to do those kinds of actions and even more so; but nowadays we have become whiny wimps who complain for having to drive 2 hours to a weekly Mass! but receiving the Sacraments to nourish our spiritual life is worth any sacrifice. This is probably the kind of desire or votum the Council of Trent talks about when referring to some Sacraments (Baptism not included here). The "votum" that is conductive to action, not vague wish. Surely, if God sees the worthy disposition and a sincere desire, he will ensure that the soul is able to get to a priest before death.

Provide a clear example of a situation of "no fault of his own"...that would justify a Catholic to die without confession of a mortal sin... like if one is trapped on a desert island without a priest and then suddenly dies? perhaps. This does not sound like the situation described in the OP, although who knows?.

Miseremini · « **Reply #36 on:** December 18, 2014, 09:31:48 PM »

Quote from: Cantarella

Provide a clear example of a situation of "no fault of his own"...that would justify a Catholic to die without confession of a mortal sin... like if one is trapped on a desert island without a priest and then suddenly dies? perhaps. This does not sound like the situation described in the OP, although who knows?.

Unfortunately this tiype of situation is more common than we like to believe. How many people in nursing homes want a priest and are denied? People in hospital with a heart attack or stroke or cancer and the non believing family won't call a priest because they haven't been to church for so long they don't know how to behave if the priest came.

I know a man who stayed with his wife day and night for several days in the hospital to make sure no priest was admitted to his dying wife.
I hope God accepted her mental anguish as reparation.

Cantarella · « **Reply #37 on:** December 19, 2014, 12:16:26 AM »

Quote from: Miseremini

Quote from: Cantarella

Provide a clear example of a situation of "no fault of his own"...that would justify a Catholic to die without confession of a mortal sin... like if one is trapped on a desert island without a priest and then suddenly dies? perhaps. This does not sound like the situation described in the OP, although who knows?.

Unfortunately this tiype of situation is more common than we like to believe. How many people in nursing homes want a priest and are denied? People in hospital with a heart attack or stroke or cancer and the non believing family won't call a priest because they haven't been to church for so long they don't know how to behave if the priest came.

I know a man who stayed with his wife day and night for several days in the hospital to make sure no priest was admitted to his dying wife.
I hope God accepted her mental anguish as reparation.

These (the elderly, the sick, the invalid) do sound as genuine examples of when the grace of Perfect Contrition could be received before the Sacrament; as stated in The Council of Trent:

Quote from: Trent

"though it sometimes happens that this contrition is perfect and that it reconciles man with God before the actual reception of this sacrament, still the reconciliation is not to be ascribed to the contrition itself apart from the desire of the sacrament which it (contrition) includes".

But the general rule is that Catholics (every single one who can) are obliged to confess each mortal (and venial) sin and no one can enter Heaven with the stain of mortal sin in their souls.

Quote from: Trent

"For those who after baptism have fallen into sin, the Sacrament of Penance is as necessary unto salvation as is baptism itself for those who have not yet been regenerated" (Council of Trent, Sess. XIV, c. 2).

The Perfect Contrition of which the Council speaks necessarily includes the(votum) to receive the sacrament and he is obliged to confess when he has the opportunity. But it does not follow that the penitent is at liberty to choose between two modes of obtaining forgiveness, one by an act of contrition independently of the sacrament, the other by confession and absolution. This view was actually condemned by Pope Sixtus IV in 1479:

Condemned: "mortal sins as regards their guilt and their punishment in the other world, are blotted out by contrition alone without any reference to the keys";

Cantarella · « **Reply #38 on:** December 19, 2014, 12:21:23 AM »

From the condemned proposition:"mortal sins as regards their guilt and their punishment in the other world, are blotted out by contrition alone without any reference to the keys" (The keys refer to the actual sacrament of Penance).

Therefore it is clear that in the present order of salvation, not even heartfelt sorrow based on the highest motives, dispense with the power of the keys (the Sacrament of Penance). The Act of Contrition teaching is being heavily abused by the liberals nowadays who end up concluding that they can get away with it any time and that Catholic priests are no longer necessary for absolution.

There is no real reason why God's providence would not send a priest to a sincere penitent before death.

This brings to mind the following said by Fr. Feeney in Bread of Life:

------------------------------------

"May I pause here to declare that I think, both with regard to the Sacrament of Baptism and the Sacrament of Penance, that the Liberal theologians, when it suits them, are making perfect acts of love of God altogether too easy for a fallen nature like ours.

I am not going to think it as difficult for a Catholic who has fallen into mortal sin but who, through his Faith, remembers his Holy Communions, his Blessed Mother, his past confessions, God’s rich forgivenesses in the sacraments, to make an act of perfect love, as for a catechumen, who has not had yet the benefit of one of God’s sanctifying sacraments. But the very fact that the Church requires every mortal sin committed to be confessed, whether one is perfectly sorry for it or not, shows the Church has a maternal suspicion of this perfect act of love of God obtaining forgiveness apart from the Sacrament of forgiveness instituted by Christ.

When I am dying, my dear children, if I tell you I am in the state of mortal sin (and I promise to do so if so it seems to me) do run for a priest, no matter how far you have to run! Do not just kneel down and teach me how to perfectly love without any sanctifying grace in my soul!

If the priest reaches me before I die, know that I have truly received the mercy of God. If the priest does not reach me, then wonder very much whether I have received it or not!"

Stubborn · « **Reply #39 on:** December 19, 2014, 10:38:05 AM »

Quote from: Nado

Quote from: Cantarella
Having said this, what is defined as an Act of Perfect Contrition is true sorrow for one's sins with the commitment of actually going to receive the Sacrament from a priest. Therefore, the obligation to confess remains and hopefully one does not die before receiving absolution since true sorrow may suffice for venial sins but most likely not so for mortal sin. Better not to take any unnecessary risks. After all, it is really one's soul which may forever perish.

From the Catechism:
Quote

Canon 1452 When it arises from a love by which God is loved above all else, contrition is called "perfect" (contrition of charity). Such contrition remits venial sins; it also obtains forgiveness of mortal sins if it includes the firm resolution to have recourse to sacramental confession as soon as possible.

Cantarella contradicts here own quote within the very same posting (see bolded). This is the result of being infected with Feeneyism while accepting the Novus Ordo.

That quote is from the Novus Ordo Catechism, but the Catechism of the Council of Trent teaches the same on that point. And, the Church does say that someone who gained sanctifying grace through perfect contrition will be saved if a mortal accident prevents him from getting to Confession.

You screwed up your own attempt at adulterating the meaning of what Cantarella was saying - I fixed it for you by making the corrct sentence bold.

Will you ever hang it up?

Stubborn · « **Reply #40 on:** December 19, 2014, 10:51:00 AM »

Quote from: Nado

Quote from: Stubborn
Quote from: Nado
Quote from: Cantarella
Having said this, what is defined as an Act of Perfect Contrition is true sorrow for one's sins with the commitment of actually going to receive the Sacrament from a priest. Therefore, the obligation to confess remains and hopefully one does not die before receiving absolution since true sorrow may suffice for venial sins but most likely not so for mortal sin. Better not to take any unnecessary risks. After all, it is really one's soul which may forever perish.

From the Catechism:
Quote

Canon 1452 When it arises from a love by which God is loved above all else, contrition is called "perfect" (contrition of charity). Such contrition remits venial sins; it also obtains forgiveness of mortal sins if it includes the firm resolution to have recourse to sacramental confession as soon as possible.

Cantarella contradicts here own quote within the very same posting (see bolded). This is the result of being infected with Feeneyism while accepting the Novus Ordo.

That quote is from the Novus Ordo Catechism, but the Catechism of the Council of Trent teaches the same on that point. And, the Church does say that someone who gained sanctifying grace through perfect contrition will be saved if a mortal accident prevents him from getting to Confession.

You screwed up your own attempt at adulterating the meaning of what Cantarella was saying - I fixed it for you by making the corrct sentence bold.

Will you ever hang it up?

It is still contradicted. She already made her statement in the context of "the commitment".

You don't even know what you are saying. Do you just post to read your own writing?

Stubborn · « **Reply #41 on:** December 19, 2014, 12:15:43 PM »

Playing with pretty colors now, isn't he a big boy!

confederate catholic · « **Reply #42 on:** December 19, 2014, 12:33:50 PM »

Quote

Playing with pretty colors now, isn't he a big boy!

:roll-laugh1:

do you think he ever actually reads before he posts?

Quote

“When you pray that your sins may be forgiven, strengthen yourself always by faith, and trust in God’s mercy, Who is ever ready to forgive our sins after sincere prayer, and fear lest despair should fall on your heart — that despair which declares itself by deep despondency and forced tears. What are your sins in comparison to God’s mercy, whatever they be, if only you truly repent of them? But it often happens that when a man prays, he does not, in his heart, inwardly hope that his sins will be forgiven, counting them as though they were above God’s mercy. Therefore, he certainly will not obtain forgiveness, even should he shed fountains of involuntary tears; and with a sorrowful, straitened heart he will depart from the Gracious God: which is only what he deserves. ‘Believe that ye receive them,’ says the Lord, ‘and ye shall have them.’ Not to be sure of receiving what you ask God for, is a blasphemy against God.”

confederate catholic · « **Reply #43 on:** December 19, 2014, 12:45:13 PM »

:cheers:

confederate catholic · « **Reply #44 on:** December 19, 2014, 12:46:41 PM »