Author Topic: 6 days of Creation or not (Read 3187 times)

ShepherdofSheep · « **Reply #15 on:** September 27, 2013, 07:55:23 AM »

Quote from: Boloki

Why would they be on the side of the pagan godless scientists?

One may be a pagan godless scientist and still develop a valid theory and discover truths. For example, Francis Crick was an atheist and yet I do not doubt in any way his discovery of the structure of DNA. The double helix, the base pairing, and everything else is pretty well accepted and proven. I'm pretty certain Thomas Cech is also a pagan godless scientist but he discovered ribozymes, RNA molecules that possess catalytic function, and these are being worked with today in the hopes of fighting viruses. Examples abound.

Marlelar · « **Reply #16 on:** September 27, 2013, 09:13:22 AM »

Quote from: Himagain

Quote from: parentsfortruth
If we said otherwise, it would be reducing the Bible to allegory, and isn't that what the protestants do?

If we do it to that one part of the bible, then why not the rest of it?

:detective:

Does anyone believe that this man was actually swallowed by a sea creature?
Doesn't the truth of the story lay in the lessons of the futility of resisting the will of God?

I believe he was. It says God prepared the fish. Must have been a very special fish.
And yes it does demonstrate the futility of resisting God.

Marsha

InfiniteFaith · « **Reply #17 on:** September 27, 2013, 09:46:06 AM »

Quote from: TKGS

It is the unanimous teachings of the Fathers that the accounts in Genesis are historical accounts and that Catholics must believe that what is written in Genesis (as all historical books) is to be taken as actual events.

It is not, however, the unanimous teaching of the Fathers that the creation accounts are necessarily to be taken literally in accord with current understandings of various terms. The term "day" may not be precisely 24 hour periods of day and night since the sun was not created until the fourth day.

However, the Church has always leaned towards a more literal understanding of the creation account in Genesis but has never declared that to be dogma. One may hold a less literal interpretation and not be an heretic. What is heretical is the Conciliar understanding that the first 11 chapters of Genesis (the history before Abraham) are fables designed to teach moral lessons and not actual history.

Personally, I believe in a more or less literal interpretation of Genesis. This believe has evolved (pardon the pun) over time as I've learned more and more of the actual science behind the "old earth theory" is built upon a great number of assumptions that simply cannot be demonstrated to be true while many assumptions can absolutely be demonstrated to be built on data that doesn't add up.

I think i'm going to correct my original statement in this thread and go with 6 days.

When considering the creation story, I think God created a number of things before he actually created the earth. When we think of one day, we use the amount of time that it takes to the earth to revolve around its axis one time. Here on earth, one day is 24 hours. Whereas on jupiter and other planets, one day is longer or shorter than 24 hours. So basically, one day is subjective based on where you are.

At the same time, I imagine that Genesis was using the earth as a reference since we are pretty much the center of God's focus. So everything in the Bible is probably spoken/written from the planet earth point of view.

I'm sticking to 6 days 24 hours each.

InfiniteFaith · « **Reply #18 on:** September 27, 2013, 09:53:22 AM »

Quote from: InfiniteFaith

Quote from: TKGS
It is the unanimous teachings of the Fathers that the accounts in Genesis are historical accounts and that Catholics must believe that what is written in Genesis (as all historical books) is to be taken as actual events.

It is not, however, the unanimous teaching of the Fathers that the creation accounts are necessarily to be taken literally in accord with current understandings of various terms. The term "day" may not be precisely 24 hour periods of day and night since the sun was not created until the fourth day.

However, the Church has always leaned towards a more literal understanding of the creation account in Genesis but has never declared that to be dogma. One may hold a less literal interpretation and not be an heretic. What is heretical is the Conciliar understanding that the first 11 chapters of Genesis (the history before Abraham) are fables designed to teach moral lessons and not actual history.

Personally, I believe in a more or less literal interpretation of Genesis. This believe has evolved (pardon the pun) over time as I've learned more and more of the actual science behind the "old earth theory" is built upon a great number of assumptions that simply cannot be demonstrated to be true while many assumptions can absolutely be demonstrated to be built on data that doesn't add up.

I think i'm going to correct my original statement in this thread and go with 6 days.

When considering the creation story, I think God created a number of things before he actually created the earth. So there was no measure of a day at one point since earth did not exist.

When we think of one day, we use the amount of time that it takes the earth to revolve around its axis one time. Here on earth, one day is 24 hours. Whereas on jupiter and other planets, one day is longer or shorter than 24 hours. So basically, one day is subjective based on where you are.

At the same time, I imagine that Genesis was using the earth as a reference since we are pretty much the center of God's focus. So everything in the Bible is probably spoken/written from the planet earth point of view.

I'm sticking to 6 days 24 hours each.

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #19 on:** September 27, 2013, 10:09:01 AM »

Quote from: Nadir

Quote from: Timothy
Quote from: Matto
I believe the world was created in six days and on the seventh day, God rested.

That's one thing that always confused me. Why would God need or want to rest?

As an example for us to follow.

Exodus 31:15
Quote
Six days shall you do work: in the seventh day is the sabbath, the rest holy to the Lord. Every one that shall do any work on this day, shall die.

So I suppose, according to some in this thread, we wouln't have to go to Mass for 6,000 years before we finally have the obligation to go, since "a day is like 1,000 years to God."

Do you see why this doesn't make any sense?

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #20 on:** September 27, 2013, 10:11:33 AM »

Quote from: Himagain

Quote from: parentsfortruth
If we said otherwise, it would be reducing the Bible to allegory, and isn't that what the protestants do?

If we do it to that one part of the bible, then why not the rest of it?

:detective:

Looking at what might be the most clear example of allegorical teaching in the bible, the story of Jonas, could help answer the question you've posed parentsfortruth. http://www.drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=37&ch=2&l=1#x
Does anyone believe that this man was actually swallowed by a sea creature?
Doesn't the truth of the story lay in the lessons of the futility of resisting the will of God?

Why would I not believe that Jonas was actually swallowed by a whale? :stare: It's conceivable that he could have survived inside a whale for 3 days, if GOD ALLOWED IT to happen!

Timothy · « **Reply #21 on:** September 27, 2013, 10:18:15 AM »

What about things in Genesis that we now know are not true? For instance:

Quote from: Genesis 1:6-8

And God said: Let there be a firmament made amidst the waters: and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made a firmament, and divided the waters that were under the firmament, from those that were above the firmament, and it was so. And God called the firmament, Heaven; and the evening and morning were the second day.

We know that the sky (the "Heavens") is not made up of water behind a firmament.

TheKnightVigilant · « **Reply #22 on:** September 27, 2013, 10:25:45 AM »

Quote from: Timothy

What about things in Genesis that we now know are not true? For instance:

Quote from: Genesis 1:6-8
And God said: Let there be a firmament made amidst the waters: and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made a firmament, and divided the waters that were under the firmament, from those that were above the firmament, and it was so. And God called the firmament, Heaven; and the evening and morning were the second day.

We know that the sky (the "Heavens") is not made up of water behind a firmament.

Simply a reference to the moisture in the sky, the clouds. See "A Practical Commentary on Holy Scripture" by Bishop Frederick Justus Knecht for the answer to this and other questions.

InfiniteFaith · « **Reply #23 on:** September 27, 2013, 10:40:05 AM »

Quote from: parentsfortruth

Quote from: Himagain
Quote from: parentsfortruth
If we said otherwise, it would be reducing the Bible to allegory, and isn't that what the protestants do?

If we do it to that one part of the bible, then why not the rest of it?

:detective:

Looking at what might be the most clear example of allegorical teaching in the bible, the story of Jonas, could help answer the question you've posed parentsfortruth. http://www.drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=37&ch=2&l=1#x
Does anyone believe that this man was actually swallowed by a sea creature?
Doesn't the truth of the story lay in the lessons of the futility of resisting the will of God?

Why would I not believe that Jonas was actually swallowed by a whale? :stare: It's conceivable that he could have survived inside a whale for 3 days, if GOD ALLOWED IT to happen!

I know that Jonah was swallowed by a whale. The 3 days and 3 nights that he spent inside the whale foreshadowed the 3 days that Christ spent in His tomb. Jonah was later spat up on land, and this was to foreshadow Christ resurrecting from His tomb.

Jonah and the actions of others throughout the Old Testament foreshadowed the Messiah.

Matto · « **Reply #24 on:** September 27, 2013, 02:38:35 PM »

Quote from: Himagain

Does anyone believe that this man was actually swallowed by a sea creature?

Yes, I believe he was swallowed by a great fish, or maybe a whale and that God miraculously preserved him alive inside the animal until he was vomited up on the beach.

Spork · « **Reply #25 on:** September 28, 2013, 07:39:09 AM »

It takes God more "energy" to forgive a mortal sin than it did for Him to create the world.

Matthew · « **Reply #26 on:** September 28, 2013, 07:45:31 AM »

Quote from: Timothy

What about things in Genesis that we now know are not true? For instance:

Quote from: Genesis 1:6-8
And God said: Let there be a firmament made amidst the waters: and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made a firmament, and divided the waters that were under the firmament, from those that were above the firmament, and it was so. And God called the firmament, Heaven; and the evening and morning were the second day.

We know that the sky (the "Heavens") is not made up of water behind a firmament.

That's where you're wrong.

It's not any MORE, but it certainly was before the Flood.

There used to be a massive water canopy enveloping the earth, blocking 99.999% of the UV rays, causing MUCH higher barometric pressure and allowing for larger creatures. The higher pressure, as well as the higher oxygen levels in the air, made man EXTREMELY vigorous to the point that he lived 800-900+ years.

If you look at the human body, and its regenerative abilities, one would conclude that it was designed to last virtually forever. Certainly longer than 60-80 years. We're practically dying in our infancy now.

Just when a man finishes his education and fully "grows up" in every department (around 50), his body begins falling apart and he's dead within 2 decades. Tragic, really.

Boloki · « **Reply #27 on:** September 28, 2013, 01:38:08 PM »

Quote from: Matthew

Quote from: Timothy
What about things in Genesis that we now know are not true? For instance:

Quote from: Genesis 1:6-8
And God said: Let there be a firmament made amidst the waters: and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made a firmament, and divided the waters that were under the firmament, from those that were above the firmament, and it was so. And God called the firmament, Heaven; and the evening and morning were the second day.

We know that the sky (the "Heavens") is not made up of water behind a firmament.

That's where you're wrong.

It's not any MORE, but it certainly was before the Flood.

There used to be a massive water canopy enveloping the earth, blocking 99.999% of the UV rays, causing MUCH higher barometric pressure and allowing for larger creatures. The higher pressure, as well as the higher oxygen levels in the air, made man EXTREMELY vigorous to the point that he lived 800-900+ years.

This is interesting. Where did you read this?

Nishant · « **Reply #28 on:** September 28, 2013, 02:29:05 PM »

Yes, according to the nearly unanimous consensus of the Fathers and practically all of Tradition, the world is no more than 10,000 odd years old.

Emitte Lucem Tuam · « **Reply #29 on:** September 29, 2013, 06:24:34 PM »

I'm just an average, simple layman who believes what the Bible says and what the Holy Fathers and Holy Church say what the bible says. I believe God created everything in 6 days and rested on the seventh. Whether 1 day to God is a million or a billion years or just one 24 hour cycle, I wouldn't dare to contemplate. I trust in God. My feeble human mind can only contemplate what a day means to me. I couldn't even fathom what God deems a day to be to Him.