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Author Topic: "Dont have children, they cause poverty."  (Read 4596 times)

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Offline LaramieHirsch

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"Dont have children, they cause poverty."
« on: January 13, 2015, 09:35:27 PM »
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  • So, I found a fellow who I enjoy listening to on many matters, however, today I learned his opinion about having kids.  

    And so, now, I want to float this by you folks--particularly ggreg--and I want to see what you all think.  

    I have my thoughts, but I'm more interested in y'all at the moment.










    (can someone embed these for me?)
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    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle


    Offline Matto

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #1 on: January 13, 2015, 09:45:54 PM »
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  • I guess if everyone thought that way we would have a bright future. :detective:
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.


    Offline songbird

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #2 on: January 13, 2015, 09:48:54 PM »
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  • Children are assets.  They become taxpayers as soon as they take on a job to carry your groceries.

    This person on youtube, overlooked the number 1 problem, the government! They cause problems( baby shots) then labels the child ADHD or such and government uses federal $ for the problems they create.

    And there is no doubt, this young man has no God in his sights.

    So, if children are the number 1 problem, how does he think the world serves him?  We all start out as a baby.

    Offline Cantarella

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #3 on: January 13, 2015, 10:15:59 PM »
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  • What a child boy!

    A pathetic soulless individual, as many today abound. Behind all his external confidence, there is just an unloved boy, afraid of responsibility and commitment. This is part of the syndrome of the boy who refuses to grow up. This syndrome is brought up by the evil of Feminism and the sɛҳuąƖ revolution of the 60's.

    A real man is not afraid of taking a wife and having children and living all his life with the sacredness, dignity and motivation that fatherhood entails. Granted, not all men are born to marry and make his own family but if he does not want to have any children, then he must choose to have a decent celibate life, instead of having a vasectomy! neutering himself as a beast, totally forgetting that according to Divine Law, the number one purpose of human sɛҳuąƖity is precisely having children, who are blessings from the Lord; not burdens as the modern world want us to believe.  

    The common modern hatred for children is a sure sign of the complete domination of the Enemy in society. That we live in a world who values more pets than human children is beyond heartbreaking.

    Diabolical and repulsive!
    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.

    Offline poche

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #4 on: January 13, 2015, 10:24:41 PM »
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  • Actually poeverty is caused when the father leaves the home and the mother is left alone to support and raise the kids


    Offline Nickolas

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #5 on: January 13, 2015, 10:27:34 PM »
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  • LaramieHirsch, the world is full of fools like this.  Why would anybody want to listen to this poor fool to gain his insight on anything? I am not surprised about his opinion on children, but he should realize that if his poor mother and father had the same opinion as he does, he wouldn't be alive.  What really surprises me is that 1.) thousands of fools watched his videos and 2.) you asked us to waste time watching them.  Was this some kind of sociology experiment?  

    Offline wxg101

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #6 on: January 13, 2015, 11:33:07 PM »
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  • Here's my two cents on the subject...

    Cent number 1- In this economic system, children are an "asset", and as such, do not produce any "GDP" within a household, yet are expenditures. In this, this man shows his utter incompetency to think outside the box.

    This system is based on the individual, and hardly accounts for the fact of whether or not one wants to have children. Add that the typical wages one earns do not accommodate for the traditional family structure: i.e. having more than 5 children. Also add in the fact that this system is a dual income system, which makes it even harder for couples to have children as well because wealth is not widely available to single income household since 50% of the country's working age population entered the workforce without having a 50% increase in wealth to accommodate such an increase, and as such incomes were slashed, the parents began to have an "economic" mentality, and children became looked at as a burden if anything. Basically, the odds are stacked against couples already, despite what this man thinks. However, what he reveals is startling, in that in order to survive in this economy, one essentially has to do what this man has done and choose not to have children. We can only imagine the result if every single human being on the entire planet thought as this man does. We would no longer exist.

    Think of what currency is needed for. It is needed for the basic necessities, that being food, water, clothing, and shelter. In the past, it was much easier to acquire these necessities outside of acclimating to any sort of organized "grid" (read economy), with agriculture, wells, and women who knew how to sew. The only issue I could see is the shelter but even then, it is also not that hard to imagine that these skills were much more widely available to one who had grown up outside of the organized grid, or were possessed by the surrounding community, or (importantly) lands and properties with architecture on them were inherited from previous families, making it possible to live on the land without the knowledge of building. Basically, all of these basic necessities that are required to live a human existence were not provided by an outside grid, but by yourself for the purpose of sustaining yourself, your wife and progeny. The point being, currency was not necessary. Trading also sufficed as an efficient form of currency for a long time, and this practice has all but died out...

    Now we zoom onto our era, which no one possesses any sort of knowledge on any of these previous skills, we all have to outsource these skills and pay someone else to provide them for us. Granted, some people would choose to do this, even in ancient times, by going into a city and having these necessities provided for us via markets and skilled laborers. Typically, however, these people had to have amassed some wealth, and those who didn't, became beggars. Well, now, we all are the beggars, because the typical earnings have not caught up to the typical price of the basic necessities, and the result of which is most of our money is going to items that can be provided by ourselves and can be looked at as the foundation of being able to live on Earth, yet it is now being treated as an economic good. This is why we are poor: the system is unsustainable and is inimical to the family structure. Covetous people took advantage of the fact that these are products people need to live and they would pay ANY price to get them.

    Cent 2- Some may argue that it may not be "selfless" in this current system to refuse to have children, what with the avoidance of necessary governmental interventions at the expense of the taxpayer because of the loss of potential GDP at the expense of children. However, I argue that this man is being completely selfish in his reasoning, mostly because he explains about how it benefits him and how he can live such a comfortable life, getting up whenever he wants, going out and riding his motorcycle x amount of times a day; I say that this man is not contributing to his society as well as he could. This is the typical mindset of one who thinks as he.

    Generally, what would drive a man to give to his society would be the very fact that his help would help himself as well, help himself provide for his family, and in this case, it is a win-win scenario for all. Man helps society by discovering/building/doing something positive: society pays man back and in turn, man utilizes this as a means to provide for his family. That is a very selfless, healthy, and honestly pious way of living out the married vocation. If one does not have children, where is the incentive? We are speaking strictly economics here. The man in the video clearly does not show any incentive to produce something worthwhile, he only works to live, and he has free time. Well, I answer that idle hands are the devil's sandbox. He also is a very troubled man as a result. Basically, he is not the man that he could or should be! Women are good at helping men become this, because of that incentive.

    Basically, all in all, his opinions only work in our evil economy, whose fruits are death.

    (The above statement about incentive does not apply to religious orders or people who profess celibacy for religious reasons. I also recognize the few examples of non-professing religious people who did not marry and achieved great things.)
    "An other parable he proposed vnto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a mustard-seede, vvhich a man tooke and sovved in his field. Which is the least surely of al seedes: but vvhen it is grovven, it is greater then al herbes, and is made a tre

    Offline ggreg

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #7 on: January 14, 2015, 12:38:21 AM »
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  • What is he saving up for otherwise?


    Offline overmind

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #8 on: January 14, 2015, 05:43:27 AM »
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  • When you're old and it's cold and who cares if you live or you die.
    The one consolation your children who stop and say hi.

    Offline ggreg

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #9 on: January 14, 2015, 06:54:11 AM »
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  • OK you specifically asked for my thoughts and I am sure you'll get all sorts of religious arguments, which you know already, but of course this person is not religious so they are likely to wave those away as are those who agree with them.

    Let's argue it from a logical or rational perspective.

    I have water-skied, parachuted, dived the Great Barrier Reef several times (was a certified Scuba Diving Instructor no less back in the 1990s but let it lapse).  I've owned about 500 cars, most of them ordinary but some fancy sports cars and luxury cars too. Owned about 15 motorcycles and driven them down the Pacific Highway and up the East Coast of Australia nearly all the way to Cape York.

    I've jetted around the world, and visited over 90 countries, and every State in the US, including Alaska, seen ballet at the Bolshoi many times, Opera at La Scala, seen Rome.

    I've gone hunting with new Russians (who were essentially criminals by western standards), hiked in Yellowstone Park, The Rockys, The Applachian Trail, The Blue Mountains, The Alps, The Alp Maratime and the Annamite and Luang Prabang Ranges.

    Had French, Italian, Uruguayan, Russian, English, Danish, Serbian, Spanish, Japanese and Australian girlfriends and been on some very fancy dates with them.  I've sailed out 1000 miles into the Pacific Ocean on a 2 week voyage and been swimming with Great White Sharks, Manta Rays, Hammerheads, and even a Minke Whale.

    I did 90% of all that in my 20s when I was single, and earning decent money.  And at the time it was kinda fun, but I don't look back and miss it and frankly at 46 the LAST thing I want to do is board an aeroplane and go anywhere.  I am happy where I am at.  I don't like plane travel or staying in hotels.  I like my own bed, and toilet.

    To be a determined and persistent hedonist you have to be a bit stupid and emotionally impoverished and shallow.  IT IS JUST NOT THAT MUCH FUN after a couple of times of trying ANYTHING.  And I do mean ANYTHING.

    Sure, I'd like to go to the moon for shits and giggles, but I would not want to go to the moon twice and I certainly would not want to go at my age.  I would prefer watching a movie about other people going to the moon, whilst soaking in a large bath.

    Driving motorbikes?  How long can you do that for and continue to enjoy it, assuming you are intelligent?  How many girlfriends can you have before the memories merge into one amorphous mass?

    But I've always found children fun from the age of 10 when my eldest sister had my first niece right through to today and our youngest who is obsessed by The Minions from Despicable Me and runs around dressed like one.  What makes healthy human beings happy in this life is fulfilling relationships and you cannot have those in such as committed way as a selfish single person whose goal is that of hedonism.

    So a single person is going to get a solid decade, two at best where they can enjoy their freedoms before they get very jaded and are just doing it because they don't know what else to do.

    With children you can enjoy their company ALL of your life.  When you are old and wrinkly and grey they think it is cool that you look like Colonel Sanders.

    Look at any old people's home and what makes their eyes light up.  It isn't looking through photograph albums of their old conquests or adventures, or the cars they used to own.  It is when a bunch of children turn up and they see that spark of life and youth and joy and are reminded of when they were young.  Our elderly neighbours often come to dinner and my children put on a little stage show for them and sing songs from Rogers and Hammerstein musicals and the look on their faces is priceless.

    You miss out on that and you are missing at least 4 decades and possibly 6 decades of the sort of fun.  Emotionally rewarding events that don't get boring.


    Offline claudel

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #10 on: January 14, 2015, 08:49:06 AM »
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  • Quote from: poche
    Actually poeverty is caused when the father leaves the home and the mother is left alone to support and raise the kids


    Not really, poche. Poeverty is a medical condition characterized by a father leaving home because of a psychological obsession with ravens, bells, pendulums, and a teenage girl he dated one summer at a seaside resort. Once the diagnosis of poeverty has been confirmed, treatment frequently includes finding a job to distract the afflicted man. Bricklaying and working as an usher have been found to be especially helpful vocational pursuits.


    Offline Dolores

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #11 on: January 14, 2015, 09:32:22 AM »
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  • His view is the logical conclusion to make for someone caught up in the individualized, consumerist culture.  Money and things are ends unto themselves, rather than means to raise and support a family.  To be honest, his viewpoint reminds me of Ebenezer Scrooge, and all of the A Christmas Carol films I've watched over the past month or so.  Scrooge was rich, alone, and miserable, while Cratchit was poor, had a large family, and was happy.  No one mourns Scrooge when the Ghost of Christmas Yet to Come shows him dead (in fact, people rob him and celebrate is demise), but the Crachits comfort each other and mourn when Tiny Tim is shown to have died, and are still able to find some happiness among themselves.

    Offline Croixalist

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #12 on: January 14, 2015, 10:43:03 AM »
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  • This guy represents what I'd call the secular backlash to the social and economic repercussions of the radical secularization in our society. The frustration is legitimate, the secular "solution" is not. We know how modern women are liabilities in every possible way. They aren't worthy wives or mothers and if they don't metamorph into gelatinous food and money drains, their self-regard metastasizes until they resemble spindly black widows who frequent their perverted social scene with a drink in their hand and selfies on their cell phones. Both lead to divorce, poverty and pure misery for their men and for their children. The black widow can usually squeeze in a few more marriages (and many more affairs) than her walrus counterpart, though it has been observed that those traditionally unattractive women are more likely to accept the role of "sugar-mommy" even to the point of granting pedophiles access to their own children!

    These women also feed the LGBT movement through the natural outflow of their runaway egotism. Some find themselves masculinized almost to lesbianism once they've had their way with men (or have been completely rejected by them). That is at least up to the point they discover that they were actually repressing their "inborn" ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖity "the whole time." Then the real man-hating begins!

    This YouTube personality, like many more like him out there, can easily see the damage these women are capable of once they give birth, though it's usually only after they've fallen prey to it themselves as younger men. Their idea of fixing the problem is to "fix" themselves by destroying their capacity to have children (by condom or vasectomy). That way, they don't have to develop the moral resistance required to avoid falling into the ancient honey trap.

    If we are honest with ourselves, we have to admit that barring a miracle or traditional parenting (which is also a miracle), the average adult female today simply cannot be relied upon for anything but her own personal interests. Men aren't much better! If men do have one advantage today, it's that we aren't shielded from the consequences of our actions. This in turn can lead to genuine repentance over what we've done wrong. Not so for women on average. The only women I see in the traditional movement either come in behind their fathers,  boyfriends or husbands. They almost never strike out alone to follow the Church. They never come in with their "girlfriends" either.

    Our satanic society has simultaneously taken advantage of the weaknesses inherent in both sexes while at the same time flipping them around in primacy. We never question the concept of the "maternal instinct" while the "paternal instinct" is a laughable afterthought. What people fail to realize, women in particular, is that the paternal instinct is a far more powerful instinct in men than the maternal instinct is in women because it covers the love, the providing for and the protection of not only children, but also wives! A good woman worth her weight in gold will be raised (by a good father) to mirror this instinct for her husband but it is not something that comes naturally to her.  

    How many modern women have any natural pride in providing for their family and husbands? Yet these are the same women who are getting the lion's share of college diplomas, higher salaries on average, and still complain about being oppressed like a true brainwashed soviet! The debauched man might object to this outrage, but he would sooner snip off his own testicles than submit himself to the true Catholic and Apostolic Church.

    Fortuna finem habet.

    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #13 on: January 14, 2015, 03:15:16 PM »
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  • Odd that creating a thread like this immediately earns me a down-thumb.

    Quote from: Nickolas
    2.) you asked us to waste time watching them.  Was this some kind of sociology experiment?  


    And you ask me to waste time answering you?  How precious must be your time!  Get over yourself.

    No.  This ain't no sociology experiment.  I want to hear opinions on the guy before I share my own.  He is at the forefront of a growing movement called the MGTOW Movement.  That stands for "Men Going Their Own Way," and it is a reaction to over a half century of Western emasculation.  It seems that the movement comprises mostly of atheist men with this style of thinking.  I would like to think there are some Catholics involved in this new direction men are going, but I've yet to spot any.

    Plus, I have people who think this way in my own life, and so I'm personally open to other Catholics' opinions on the matter.

    Rest assured, I disagree with Clarey.  

    Thank you, Greg, for the input.  I appreciate your prudent take on the matter, as always.
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    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline wxg101

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    "Dont have children, they cause poverty."
    « Reply #14 on: January 14, 2015, 03:16:33 PM »
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  • Quote from: Croixalist


    How many modern women have any natural pride in providing for their family and husbands? Yet these are the same women who are getting the lion's share of college diplomas, higher salaries on average, and still complain about being oppressed like a true brainwashed soviet! The debauched man might object to this outrage, but he would sooner snip off his own testicles than submit himself to the true Catholic and Apostolic Church.



     :applause:
    "An other parable he proposed vnto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a mustard-seede, vvhich a man tooke and sovved in his field. Which is the least surely of al seedes: but vvhen it is grovven, it is greater then al herbes, and is made a tre