Author Topic: "Brain dead" organ donors feel pain (Read 19462 times)

Alex · « **Reply #1 on:** June 02, 2008, 01:18:57 AM »

Since we all know that most organs are obtained from killing "brain dead" people (who are still alive), what should a Catholic do about having an organ transplanted in them? The Church has said that organ transplantation is acceptable, but that is only taking into fact that the person that the organ was taken from was actually dead.

Dulcamara · « **Reply #2 on:** June 05, 2008, 10:40:02 AM »

Well, if we know that today they come from people who were still alive, I think it is only sane to say that the Church (in her right state) would never permit Catholics to support such activities by receiving the organs harvested from live persons. It would be equivalent to going to the black market, where I hear they do the same... in some cases harvesting from a perfectly healthy inmate (I heard this of a communist country) when they arrive to meet the buyer.

There is, I think, however, something far worse going on here. That is, people have developed this morbid fear of death, wherein they are willing to do just about anything, no matter how painful, expensive, ethically correct or moral it is, just to stay alive. What ever happened to making a good confession and resigning one's self to God's holy will? Is the thought of submission to God's providence that distasteful?

People shun that kind of thinking as being backwards, and indeed, you can't just not take care of your body. We do have a moral responsibility to accept ethically correct cures which do work. But if the cure is unethical...?

The ends don't justify the means. This is a widely accepted error today, but it is an error. You cannot just do "whatever it takes" that good may come of it. You cannot do evil in order to obtain good. If my liver gives out, and my option is taking one, the absence of which murdered another human being... Well, it may appear I have a choice, but I think, in the sight of God, it only APPEARS that way. If I love God, I cannot promote murder of anyone, on any scale (eg, even embryos), even if the doctor thinks it's just fine to do so.

These people are dying horrible deaths, because there are a LOT of selfish people out there, who don't mind doing something unnatural and unethical in order to live... and for what? So they can sleep around some more? Have another party? Commit a lot more sins? Go to Florida? Buy that big screen TV?

What is life? Is it a party time? Is it a place to have good, fuzzy feelings with friends and family, seeing sights, blowing cash and collecting material things? Or by any chance, are we here to save our SOULS? To get to heaven? To live and die for and in Christ?

Even if we're "nice" ... even if we're "good" (according to the world, which translates that you like animals, you're a vegetarian and you recycle your newspaper)... even if we have friendly chats with our neighbors over the fence in the back yard... this life is not about that. This life is about being a saint, and one part of that is following God's law and doing the right thing, even if we die for it in consequence. It's part of accepting divine providence. Yes, if you're not well and there's a cure that is ethical, you're bound to take care of your body according to Catholic teaching. But if there's no ethical cure, then hey... it's divine providence. The patient will say, "yes, but if I take the organ, I'll live!" Well, if the martyrs had taken a sword to their executioners, THEY might have lived. But would they have gone to heaven for doing that instead?

Our lives belong to God. We BELONG to God. (Our dear, beloved family members... even THEY belong to God, NOT to us!) And He will do with us what He knows is best, not what we think is best. And if it's better for us to die at a particular time, and instead we cheat death by unethical means, we've really cheated ourselves... sinning in order to live.

People need to get back to an appreciate of what life is, and what life is about. There ARE worse things than death! There's eternal death! And if we do everything we can within moral limits to live, and we end up dying... hey... that's divine providence. And it's much better for us, because it comes from an all-loving, all-knowing God.

orapronobis · « **Reply #3 on:** June 11, 2008, 03:15:30 AM »

Alex · « **Reply #4 on:** June 12, 2008, 01:16:50 AM »

CARACAS (Reuters) - A Venezuelan man who had been declared dead woke up in the morgue in excruciating pain after medical examiners began their autopsy.

Carlos Camejo, 33, was declared dead after a highway accident and taken to the morgue, where examiners began an autopsy only to realize something was amiss when he started bleeding. They quickly sought to stitch up the incision on his face.

"I woke up because the pain was unbearable," Camejo said, according to a report on Friday in leading local newspaper El Universal.

His grieving wife turned up at the morgue to identify her husband's body only to find him moved into a corridor -- and alive.

Reuters could not immediately reach hospital officials to confirm the events. But Camejo showed the newspaper his facial scar and a docuмent ordering the autopsy.

Alex · « **Reply #5 on:** June 12, 2008, 01:18:22 AM »

Declared dead by doctors, then rescued from the mortuary, Freddie Maguire has made such a strong recovery that he has been nicknamed Jesus Christ.

Mr Maguire, 47, from Dublin&#65533;s north inner city, was pronounced dead by doctors at the Mater Hospital after they fought for 30 minutes to save his life on Easter Day.

Mr Maguire, who has learning difficulties, was being treated for a separate condition when he suffered a heart attack. He was moved to the intensive care unit and treated by a team of medical staff, who pronounced him dead.

Mr Maguire&#65533;s relatives were coming to terms with their loss when they were informed that he was, in fact, alive. A member of staff saw his hand move as he was about to be put into a mortuary refrigerator.

Alex · « **Reply #6 on:** June 12, 2008, 01:24:12 AM »

Here's what I found on a blog:

"One of my science professors in college was working in a mortuary to help put himself thru school. This one old guy came in dead & was there on the table until they could find out what his wishes were (embalmed or cremated). Next day he had some extra time and he decided to go ahead & get him shaved & cleaned up before the mortitian could embalm or cremate and accidently knicked the guy and the guy started to bleed. OH MY GOSH... DEAD GUYS DON'T BLEED!! He called the hospital to come back & get him. He had some problem and had gone into an almost hybernation type state that the heartbeat & breathing was so low couldn't be detected but didn't die. He had been checked several times before taken to the mortuary and pronounced dead. If they would have tried to embalm him or cremate him instead of shaving him & cleaning him up first they may have had a worse problem.
He said it still freaked him out after 40+ years. "

"There was a show on not too long ago that had this lady on it. She had been sent to the cooler the first time, just to wake up several days later ( it was a weekend) in the company of true enough dead people laying around and in the dark. I think the first time was in the 50's or so. Second time she was pronounced dead, just about the same deal and ever since then that lady has been freaked out to go to sleep ( which I would be too ) . Her son lives with her now, just to make sure it doesn't matter to his mom again. Kind of sad to hear her side of the story. But she goes into the state like posted above where her heartbeat isn't able to be detected and was checked many times also. "

Alex · « **Reply #7 on:** June 12, 2008, 01:34:02 AM »

Brain Dead man says he feels pretty good

An Oklahoma man who was about to have his organs removed by doctors after they declared him brain dead says he feels "pretty good" four months on.

Zach Dunlap, 21, was pronounced dead at United Regional Healthcare System in Wichita Falls, Texas on November 19 after he was injured in a quad bike accident.

His family gave approval for his organs to be removed for donation.

But, as family members were paying their last respects, they were shocked to see him move his foot and hand, the Daily Mail reported today.

After 48 days in hospital, he was allowed to return home.

He and his family appeared on on NBC's Today morning show overnight.

"I feel pretty good. but it's just hard ... just ain't got the patience," Mr Dunlap said.

Mr Dunlap said he had no recollection of the crash.

"I remember a little bit that was about an hour before the accident happened. But then about six hours before that, I remember," he said.

But Mr Dunlap said he did remember hearing doctors pronounce him dead.

"I'm glad I couldn't get up and do what I wanted to do," he said.

His father, Doug, said he saw the results of the brain scan. "There was no activity at all, no blood flow at all."

Zach's mother, Pam, said that when she discovered he was still alive, "That was the most miraculous feeling."

She said her son was doing "amazingly well," but still had problems with his memory.

Alex · « **Reply #8 on:** June 12, 2008, 01:39:52 AM »

Man, I can't imagine a more torturous death!!

Brain dead patients have to be strapped to the operating table. They are treated with immobilizing medication.

Abdomen and thorax are opened from neck to pubic bone. The skin flaps are fixed to a kind of vessel which is filled with up to 15 litres of an ice-cold fluid. The organs are irrigated with an ice-cold perfusion, the blood is drawn off. The doctors lay the organs open while the heart is still beating and prepare them for the removal.

The ventilators and monitors are turned off after the removal.

Alex · « **Reply #9 on:** June 12, 2008, 04:26:29 AM »

CM · « **Reply #10 on:** September 05, 2009, 12:36:53 AM »

Alex, thank you very much for this article. It has been very enlightening and very useful.

CM · « **Reply #11 on:** September 05, 2009, 12:38:05 AM »

ummm... and scary.

Elizabeth · « **Reply #12 on:** September 06, 2009, 06:29:27 PM »

Ghastly.

Matto · « **Reply #13 on:** March 13, 2013, 03:51:27 PM »

I remember once my SSPX priest told the faithful not to be organ donors because that will allow the doctors to kill you prematurely to harvest your organs.

jester · « **Reply #14 on:** March 13, 2013, 04:43:40 PM »

They always need anesthetics. Organ procurement is done in the operating room and under general anesthesia.

Author Topic: &quot;Brain dead&quot; organ donors feel pain (Read 19462 times)

Author Topic: "Brain dead" organ donors feel pain (Read 19462 times)