Stanley, I already asked you about your own possible links the American space industry. Tell me, sir, do you have any skin in the game?

The fallout from the fake Apollo moon landing program has become a bit more problematic for me than just the simple rejection of an alleged moon landings narrative. One could look at that fabulous boondoggle in isolation and conclude, simply, that it wasn’t true; then go on from there.

 
But some of us, I think, are forced to face some unsettling thoughts about the very country which gave birth to NASA and Apollo, and, most recently the nascent Orion program.

It is rather unnerving to confront the possibility that America herself, at her core and in her essence, from her very foundations, may be as starkly fake and phony as the Apollo project was. It is altogether possible, in my mind anyway, that a country, capable of creating a hoax as immense and (diabolically) complex as Apollo, could just as easily have manufactured many other elaborate hoaxes any time and any where along the spectrum of its 250 year history.

We live in a country whose government has repeatedly lied to its people.
Our cινιℓ ωαr was not essentially about freeing the slaves. It was, historians tell us, about “preserving the Union,” which, upon closer examination, had little to do with upholding any inviolable statute or indelible precept of the US Constitution.

Our government lied to us about the sinking of the Maine. We did it to ourselves in order to finally finish off a Spanish presence in the West and elsewhere in the world, and replace it with the emerging American empire.

It lied to us about the real reasons we entered WWI, in the face of earlier assurances from the then president that our boys would never be sent into a foreign war.

It lied to us about the real reasons we sent Marines into Latin America early in the 20^th century. We did it on behalf of huge corporations, particularly United Fruit. Gen. Smedly Butler explained the real reason best:
“I spent most of my time being a high class muscle-man for Big Business, for Wall Street and for the Bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. “

American government lied to us about Pearl Harbor. It was not a surprise attack by the Japanese. We goaded them into it. Our president and his cabinet provoked them into it. Our leaders were itching for war. We knew exactly where the Japanese fleet was from the moment it left the Kuriles and headed slowly south towards Hawaii. It was a day of infamy, alright- a day of American infamy.

Our govt. in tandem with the British, lied to us about the nαzι Blitzkrieg. It was not an unprovoked attack by Hitler. The RAF started carpet bombing German cities and civilian populations months before German bombs struck London.

Vietnam was a lie from beginning to end. The Bay of Tonkin incident was a supposed event which, we know now, never occurred. Pres. Johnson and the rest of his criminal cabal knew it from the start.

 
Our govt. lied to us about WMDs. No one now believes that Sadam had them. No way! The US needed a manufactured excuse for starting a war there on behalf of Israel. Iraq was never a “national security threat.”

911 was obviously a lie. No building came down due to the hijacking of commercial jets by 19 Arab terrorists, which subsequently rammed into the Twin Towers. Bldg. 7 came down obviously from controlled demolition from within. Most likely, the CIA in tandem with Mossad, got that all going.

Sandy Hook was a shameless lie and an elaborate hoax, generated by the US government using lots of crisis actors, in a futile attempt to take guns out of the hands of average law-abiding American citizens.

This whole thing about Trump colluding with the Russians and alleged obstruction of justice charges come to us courtesy of some of the most powerful agencies of American government, including most of the intelligence apparatus. It is a bald faced lie!

Now Iran has become the new Boogey Man threatening America. They tell us endless lies about Iran’s alleged threat to our interests and those of Israel. We need to act now, they warn!

So serious has the whole thing become for me that I am finding it difficult to remove my hat and place my hand over my heart when the Pledge of Allegiance is recited at a public event.

That is not a huge statue of the Virgin Mary, torch uplifted, which greets visitors to our shores. No, that was a gift from French revolutionaries, depicting the Masonic goddess of reason, or liberty, or some such thing.

Maybe the Iranians are right. Maybe America is, in fact, ‘The Great Satan.’ A few chapters of the Apocalypse might even allude to it. Babylon the Great, the Scarlet Whore... These two graphic depictions alone seem to share some of the same characteristics of the great American empire.

Theodore Drieser, I think, told us that the business of America is business. Apollo was an American business venture on a scale never achieved or imagined before. It was sponsored by the American Govt.. and implemented by huge American aerospace companies and their subsidiaries, with plenty of fawning coverage by the press.   Only America the Great could have pulled it all off on such a gigantic scale. To that extent, the project must at least command awe and grudging respect. It was too big to ignore and eventually forget.

Apollo is the greatest hoax which America has manufactured to date.

 

 

 

 

 



 

… But some of us, I think, are forced to face some unsettling thoughts about the very country which gave birth to NASA and Apollo, and, most recently the nascent Orion program.
…
So serious has the whole thing become for me that I am finding it difficult to remove my hat and place my hand over my heart when the Pledge of Allegiance is recited at a public event.
…
Apollo is the greatest hoax which America has manufactured to date.

Dear Holly,

Your list of deceptions, many of them truly Satanic in aim and scope, is certainly a good one,* and I sincerely congratulate you on your perspective. I differ with you only regarding your inclusion of the Apollo Project and, in particular, the Apollo 11 moon landing, whose half-century anniversary has been the proximate spur to this and other threads.

I was two months shy of twenty-four when the landing took place. But being a Vietnam vet (though definitely not by choice) and having just eight weeks prior to July 21 been released from the army, I was far from being inattentive to my surroundings or in a particularly deceivable frame of mind.

Nothing I've seen, heard, read, or otherwise experienced in the past fifty years has led me to discredit the evidence my senses provided back then.**

I could go on in this vein, but it wouldn't serve a purpose, would it? Your mind is made up.

You really should understand, however, that there are a great many people, people who are as cognizant as you are of the empire of lies that engulfs us all, who are not prepared to count Apollo and the rest of the space program as one more stone on the mountain of deception.

Let me suggest, too, that the fact that far more than half of the people connected with the space program were not NASA or other government employees—a state of affairs that our masters would not tolerate today, need I add?—ought to get you and the few other thoughtful scoffers to consider rethinking your categorical dismissal of a body of hard data, docuмentary evidence, and individual and corporate testimony that may without exaggeration be termed overwhelming.

Lastly, someone ought to say for the record that Stanley N has done a very fine job of presenting supporting data from the perspective of an informed and technically knowledgeable observer. Surely nothing he has written, here or elsewhere, has been of such a nature as to merit the unworthy implication, made by you and a few others, that he is some sort of stooge. Indeed, in some instances—not yours, happily—the sneers and insults give off the sulfurous stench of an envious hatred of learning by those who arrogantly cling to ignorance.

Two brief concluding comments: (1) pledging allegiance to the flag nowadays involves so many necessary mental reservations that one might feel sympathy with Colin Kaepernick et alii were the football players in question not such jerks and clowns; and (2) Calvin Coolidge made the remark you attribute to Dreiser; whether he thought the situation he described was a good thing is open to question.
__________________
* The only one of any consequence missing is of course the biggest one of all, the titanic fraud that the Jєωs have dubbed the h0Ɩ0cαųst expressly to show their contempt for the One True h0Ɩ0cαųst of Christ on the Cross. Fortunately, very few people here need persuading on that topic!

** You may have seen something I wrote on another thread several months ago—namely, that my older brother was one of a dozen or so men who designed and developed the engine of the Apollo 11's command module—but that was not something I knew at the time. Indeed, I learned of it only about twenty-five years later. As was true of a great many people involved with the space program, especially scientists and engineers, my brother was an exceptionally tight-lipped guy. At eighty-five, he still is, God bless him.

Apollo astronauts responding to the hoax proponents: https://www.bitchute.com/video/lmv0YXdIgB7y/

I like Duke's response best.

One thing that isn't mentioned enough is that all the major moon hoax proponents are h0Ɩ0h0αx promoters, including Sibrel.

Curiously I bet most of the astronauts believe in the h0Ɩ0h0αx, though I don't see any of them promoting it, so who knows.

I heard that the construction industry will have a declining budget for the next 20 years, which will mysteriously cause it to lose the technology to build buildings.

That technology will be lost.

We are all going back to yurts.

I heard that the construction industry will have a declining budget for the next 20 years, which will mysteriously cause it to lose the technology to build buildings.

That technology will be lost.

We are all going back to yurts.

I heard something similar. There are only 6 working construction supercranes left in the world, and they get destroyed in the process of erecting a super-tall building. The technology to make them is the property of the US Govt, which has made all previous supercranes. These supercranes cost 1% of the US federal budget to make, and Trump has directed the National Architecture and Construction Administration not to make any more. Most of the companies who made the parts and tools for them will be closing shop, though some will probably retool to support building the wall. So even though we have the know-how to build one-off supercranes, we will soon lose the manufacturing chain to actually build another one.
With its reduced budget, the construction industry will focus on moderately tall buildings instead, which don't require a supercrane to construct.

Claudel: You really should understand, however, that there are a great many people, people who are as cognizant as you are of the empire of lies that engulfs us all, who are not prepared to count Apollo and the rest of the space program as one more stone on the mountain of deception.

Thanks, Claudel. You are, no doubt, a sincere individual, who speaks honestly according to his own lights. And I am aware that many people are aware of “the empire of lies that engulfs us all.”

But still, there is a huge gap in our thinking about the Apollo Project.


That your “tight-lipped” brother was one of a dozen who worked on the command module of Apollo 11 is impressive and extremely interesting to me. Does he ever open up to you on the subject? Why is he so “tight-lipped?”

I will say again that I am not a scientist, an aerospace engineer, or a person connected in any way with the space industry, either directly, or through family ties. But about one particularly vocal forum member, the same can not be definitively stated. I have asked Stanley twice to reveal his possible ties to NASA and the aerospace industry. He has thus far not replied.

I am not saying that Stanley does not have knowledge of the Apollo Program and of the technology surrounding it. But he does infer that his knowledge is indisputably correct, and superior to that of his opponents, who are merely conspiracy nutters who rely 100% on Youtube videos for their information. I would remind Stanley and others that there are plenty of qualified scientists and engineers who either dismiss Apollo as an utter hoax, or who have grave doubts about it.

You’re right, I have made up my mind. The only thing that gives me the briefest pause are the testimonies of some still living Apollo astronauts who will swear on a stack of Bibles that they went to the moon.

 
That is the human factor, and one not so easily dealt with. Human beings are extremely complex creatures, subject to all kinds of behavioral conditioning and vicissitudes throughout life. It would be entirely possible, in my mind anyway, to channel lies through individuals, who under normal conditions, are impeccably honest, for whom any lie is anathema.

But even in that pool of Apollo astronauts, there are those individuals who seem to give the lie to the testimonies of others among them.

Astronaut Gus Grissom, for example. On several occasions he expresses what can only be interpreted as (almost) total disdain for the Apollo Project. He has no confidence in the program at all, it seems. He even hangs a lemon on his lunar module simulator to show his disgust. One month before the Apollo 1 launch(?), in January of 1967, he’s a dead man, along with two of his companions. Gosh, that’s suspicious!

Neil Armstrong becomes, allegedly, the first man to set foot on the moon in Feb. of 1969. Armstrong comes back, gives a rather brief NASA-sponsored interview to the press, along with his two companions on the flight. All of them seem nervous and ill at ease. Thereafter, until his death in 2005, Armstrong makes himself as invisible as possible, and, we understand he suffers from bouts of mental illness. So also does his partner, Buzz Aldrin, by his own admission.

Then, to top it all off, this hero of the century, rather than be buried in Arlington, VA, where most such military heroes are interred, his ashes are scattered over the Pacific. This is just strange!

 
Then there’s James Irwin, commander of the Apollo 15 lunar module. He has a history of heart problems, admittedly. But in early August, 1991, not many days before his death, he phones Bill Kaysing, staunch moon landing denier, and says they need to talk. He asks Kaysing to call him back later on what Irwin considers a more secure phone line. Kaysing figures that the man wants to get something off his chest. But two or three days later Irwin is dead and no conversation takes place between the two men. How propitious, some might argue.

It is rumored that Apollo 12 astronaut Pete Conrad wants to go public on the fake moon landings back in 1999, the 30^th anniversary of that mission. He never does. Conrad is killed in a motorcycle accident one week before the event. Very weird!

Again, Claudel, almost everything I’ve read, heard and viewed about the Apollo Missions leads me to believe that they really never happened. But the human angle must be factored in. There are some puzzling, not fully explained, human responses for which I have no answer yet, unless one wants to pursue the Manchurian Candidate angle.

 But some of the elliptical remarks made by certain NASA officials in recent times serve as clinchers for me. I understand plain English. And in plain English they tell me that 1) all the Apollo technology has been lost and can’t be recovered; and 2) NASA has never gotten a manned space craft out of lower earth orbit. End of story for me.