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Author Topic: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview  (Read 2860 times)

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Offline bodeens

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Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
« Reply #30 on: May 27, 2022, 01:24:22 PM »
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  • I've addressed this criticism before.

    1) What would you have him do?  Start ordaining priests and bishops ... when there are a half dozen or more Trad groups already doing that?

    2) You underestimate the power of +Vigano's writing.  He's emboldening more and more of the conservative Conciliar fence-sitters who used to hold their tongue out of misplaced "respect" for the Conciliar hierarchy, to start criticizing and attacking Bergoglio and to waking up about the true nature of the Crisis (not just a misinterpretation of Vatican II with their go-to "hermeneutic of continuity").  That "hermeneutic of continuity" was always what these types hid behind to apologize for V2.
    It's insanity that we have someone within the conciliar sect hierarchy saying everything within a micron of declaring the chair empty and has to be in hiding but this is somehow controlled and ZOG/Opus Dei like this... He is a human and is working through this like everyone. Thus I pray for him daily. I guarantee ZOG would drone Vigano if he was fully on their radar.

    If he were truly controlled he would be putting out content like Meaning of Catholic, where a recent interview boosts left wing "trads who love Vatican II". Everyone in the conciliar sect has to rationalize VII and he is breaking out of this programming. The Indult "traditionalists" have mostly abandoned Vigano, the dishonest know there isn't money in it and the honest are allied with VII, true believers in it.
    Regard all of my posts as unfounded slander, heresy, theologically specious etc
    I accept Church teaching on Implicit Baptism of Desire.
    Francis is Pope.
    NO is a good Mass.
    Not an ironic sig.


    Offline Sir Percival

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #31 on: May 27, 2022, 01:25:41 PM »
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  • Or he'd get attacked and slandered as +Thuc did for ordaining unqualified men to the priesthood.  He'd probably have to set up his own seminary.  But then he'd really get it from Traditionalists who already believe he's an Opus Dei operative setting up a controlled opposition.  So he really can't win.

    He doesn’t have to be like +Thuc though. Msgr. Thuc was a massive disaster with his consecrations and ordinations. I don’t think they were invalid, but oh boy were they catastrophically ill chosen.

    Instead if he sets up shop like Msgr. Lefebvre did, with an operation which is essentially tied to the institutional structure of the Church, and is prudential about it then we would get another SSPX type society and that would be much better than these letters.

    Let’s not forget, once Msgr. Vigano passes away, most of his legacy will be forgotten almost overnight. His writings are not all that special. They’ve been said by bigger and better men in much more profound ways. :cowboy:
    “How can the ignorant teach others? How can the licentious make others modest? And how can the impure make others pure? If anyone hates peace, how can he make others peaceable ? Or if anyone has soiled his hands with baseness, how can he cleanse the impurities of another? We read also that if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into the ditch [Matt. 15:14]. But first correct yourselves, in order that, free from blame , you may be able to correct those who are subject to you.”

    Pope Urban II


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #32 on: May 27, 2022, 01:26:02 PM »
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  • It's insanity that we have someone within the conciliar sect hierarchy saying everything within a micron of declaring the chair empty and has to be in hiding but this is somehow controlled and ZOG/Opus Dei like this... He is a human and is working through this like everyone. Thus I pray for him daily. I guarantee ZOG would drone Vigano if he was fully on their radar.
    Bravo.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline bodeens

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #33 on: May 27, 2022, 01:28:00 PM »
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  • Perhaps you can help me understand how somebody can be against the vaccine but support the Father of the Vaccine who is still out there promoting it?
    How about you ask your local sede clergy? You won't listen to our arguments so instead ask your priest. This is pointless.
    Regard all of my posts as unfounded slander, heresy, theologically specious etc
    I accept Church teaching on Implicit Baptism of Desire.
    Francis is Pope.
    NO is a good Mass.
    Not an ironic sig.

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #34 on: May 27, 2022, 01:34:50 PM »
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  • Let’s not forget, once Msgr. Vigano passes away, most of his legacy will be forgotten almost overnight.

    Actually, a few have taken measures to ensure that does not happen.

    ;)
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Sir Percival

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #35 on: May 27, 2022, 01:35:46 PM »
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  • How about you ask your local sede clergy? You won't listen to our arguments so instead ask your priest. This is pointless.

    The same Sede clergy who won’t recognize +Vigano as a valid bishop and will condemn him as a heretic for his ecclesiology probably won’t have nice things to say about him. :laugh2:
    “How can the ignorant teach others? How can the licentious make others modest? And how can the impure make others pure? If anyone hates peace, how can he make others peaceable ? Or if anyone has soiled his hands with baseness, how can he cleanse the impurities of another? We read also that if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into the ditch [Matt. 15:14]. But first correct yourselves, in order that, free from blame , you may be able to correct those who are subject to you.”

    Pope Urban II

    Offline Miser Peccator

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #36 on: May 27, 2022, 01:40:30 PM »
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  • What are you talking about?  He barely mentioned US politics at all in this interview, i.e. didn't mention Biden either.  He was focusing on the globalist forces, WEF, Schwab, Soros et al.
    It's almost entirely about the Great Rest including a section entitled:

    "Who are the main architects – the leaders, masterminds, influencers, and organizations – of the Great Reset?"

    Once again, he leaves Trump out.  The Great Reset could have never happened worldwide without Trump and that's mainly because of the blindness of Trump supporters.

    Vigano has set a clear pattern in his writings of this topic.

    He either lies, deflects from or fails to mention Trump's responsibility.

    I wondered if people would continue to support Vigano after he lied to the Trump supporters to cover for him.

    If he is going to influence the world in their understanding of who is to be held accountable for the Great Reset, he of all people should be calling out Trump as the originator. 

    This is especially true because he helped the Father of the Vaccine get elected.

    Perhaps that has something to do with his refusal to name Trump and deflect from his responsibility?









    I exposed AB Vigano's public meetings with Crowleyan Satanist Dugin so I ask protection on myself family friends priest, under the Blood of Jesus Christ and mantle of the Blessed Virgin Mary! If harm comes to any of us may that embolden the faithful to speak out all the more so Catholics are not deceived.



    [fon

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #37 on: May 27, 2022, 01:41:48 PM »
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  • The same Sede clergy who won’t recognize +Vigano as a valid priest and will condemn him as a heretic for his ecclesiology probably won’t have nice things to say about him. :laugh2:

    So far as I know, all sedes accept the validity of Vigano’s priestly ordination (which was according to the old rite).

    His episcopal consecration remains an asterisk in the minds of many, yet even despite that, most sedes do not dispute the doctrine of Vigano (which is what matters most).
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #38 on: May 27, 2022, 01:43:14 PM »
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  • It's almost entirely about the Great Rest including a section entitled:

    "Who are the main architects – the leaders, masterminds, influencers, and organizations – of the Great Reset?"

    Once again, he leaves Trump out.  The Great Reset could have never happened worldwide without Trump and that's mainly because of the blindness of Trump supporters.

    Vigano has set a clear pattern in his writings of this topic.

    He either lies, deflects from or fails to mention Trump's responsibility.

    I wondered if people would continue to support Vigano after he lied to the Trump supporters to cover for him.

    If he is going to influence the world in their understanding of who is to be held accountable for the Great Reset, he of all people should be calling out Trump as the originator. 

    This is especially true because he helped the Father of the Vaccine get elected.

    Perhaps that has something to do with his refusal to name Trump and deflect from his responsibility?

    What an idiot.

    :facepalm:
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Sir Percival

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #39 on: May 27, 2022, 01:45:36 PM »
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  • So far as I know, all sedes accept the validity of Vigano’s priestly ordination (which was according to the old rite).

    His episcopal consecration remains an asterisk in the minds of many, yet even despite that, most sedes do not dispute the doctrine of Vigano (which is what matters most).

    Meant to say “bishop” instead of “priest.” Corrected original post. :fryingpan:

    As for doctrine? Nahhhh. Sedes aren’t fans.

    https://novusordowatch.org/2021/02/confused-vigano-bizarre-theology/
    “How can the ignorant teach others? How can the licentious make others modest? And how can the impure make others pure? If anyone hates peace, how can he make others peaceable ? Or if anyone has soiled his hands with baseness, how can he cleanse the impurities of another? We read also that if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into the ditch [Matt. 15:14]. But first correct yourselves, in order that, free from blame , you may be able to correct those who are subject to you.”

    Pope Urban II

    Offline Miser Peccator

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #40 on: May 27, 2022, 01:49:53 PM »
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  • How about you ask your local sede clergy? You won't listen to our arguments so instead ask your priest. This is pointless.
    I'm sorry, but I didn't see any arguments explaining how you can lament the thousands of deaths and millions of injuries caused by the vaccine but still support the man who wants credit for it.

    Did somebody post that and I missed it?
    I exposed AB Vigano's public meetings with Crowleyan Satanist Dugin so I ask protection on myself family friends priest, under the Blood of Jesus Christ and mantle of the Blessed Virgin Mary! If harm comes to any of us may that embolden the faithful to speak out all the more so Catholics are not deceived.



    [fon


    Offline bodeens

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #41 on: May 27, 2022, 01:50:40 PM »
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  • The same Sede clergy who won’t recognize +Vigano as a valid priest and will condemn him as a heretic for his ecclesiology probably won’t have nice things to say about him. :laugh2:
    I'm sorry, but I didn't see any arguments explaining how you can lament the thousands of deaths and millions of injuries caused by the vaccine but still support the man who wants credit for it.

    Did somebody post that and I missed it?
    You aren't parsing my argument correctly.

    1) They would 100% recognize him as a priest, not a bishop. 24th March, 1968 he was ordained (June was when the changes were approved). What sede clergy has said he is not a priest is a better question?

    2) The entire reason I bring up sede clergy is because almost all of the +Thuc clergy I go to for sacraments support Trump but say taking the vaccine is mortal sin or is a problem... So again, ask clergy, not me, because they have +Vigano's position.

    Apparently I had to make this argument more clearly as the only responses to it did not address the meat of it.
    Regard all of my posts as unfounded slander, heresy, theologically specious etc
    I accept Church teaching on Implicit Baptism of Desire.
    Francis is Pope.
    NO is a good Mass.
    Not an ironic sig.

    Offline Miser Peccator

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #42 on: May 27, 2022, 02:00:13 PM »
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  • 2) The entire reason I bring up sede clergy is because almost all of the +Thuc clergy I go to for sacraments support Trump but say taking the vaccine is mortal sin or is a problem... So again, ask clergy, not me, because they have +Vigano's position.

    Apparently I had to make this argument more clearly as the only responses to it did not address the meat of it.

    Do the people on this forum also have Vigano's position?

    Do you guys lament the thousands of deaths and millions of injuries caused by Trump but still support him?

    If so, maybe you can explain that to me because I'm baffled.

    Can you explain why Vigano calls these people who do not care how many will die from the effects of the vaccine "enemies of the good and enemies of God" but still support Trump?


    Quote
    Let us have no illusions: these servants of the nєω ωσrℓ∂ σr∂єr who have managed to occupy the highest positions of national governments and international organizations are our enemies: enemies of the good and enemies of God. They do not care how many of us will have to die from the effects of the vaccine
    --Vigano to Trump supporters April 2, 2022
    I exposed AB Vigano's public meetings with Crowleyan Satanist Dugin so I ask protection on myself family friends priest, under the Blood of Jesus Christ and mantle of the Blessed Virgin Mary! If harm comes to any of us may that embolden the faithful to speak out all the more so Catholics are not deceived.



    [fon

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #43 on: May 27, 2022, 02:04:36 PM »
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  • Instead if he sets up shop like Msgr. Lefebvre did, with an operation which is essentially tied to the institutional structure of the Church, and is prudential about it then we would get another SSPX type society and that would be much better than these letters.

    But why would we want yet another rival to SSPX?  That's when he would be accused of setting up a rival controlled opposition group to draw Traditionalists away from the TRUE Traditional movements.  He can't win in this Tradscape here.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: +Vigano Publishes Unpublished 11/21/21 Interview
    « Reply #44 on: May 27, 2022, 02:06:10 PM »
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  • Actually, a few have taken measures to ensure that does not happen.

    ;)