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Offline Matthew

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To those who believe in the Moon Landings
« on: February 20, 2019, 12:36:00 PM »
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  • What would it take for you all to admit that I am right, that man never set foot on the moon?

    How many years have to pass without
    * any country (there are plenty of countries technologically capable: China, Russia, India, Europe, USA, Canada, Japan)
    * leaving low earth orbit for ANY reason

    which would begin to "repeat" the accomplishment of man going to the Moon?

    Right now, it's been 46 years and counting. No country has so much as left low-earth orbit since then. Color me suspicious.

    What if you saw the following table of max jumping height for John Jones:
    2009: 1.1 foot
    2010: 1000 feet
    2011: 1.2 foot
    2012: 1.2 foot
    2013: 1.1 foot
    2014: 1.3 foot
    2015: 1.1 foot
    2016: 1.1 foot
    2017: 1.2 foot
    2018: 1.3 foot
    2019: 1.3 foot

    Wouldn't you throw out the reading for "2010" as an aberration?

    My assertion: The so-called "moon landings" are an aberration so far above the mean that they must be discarded.

    I don't buy all the pathetic excuses that "it's too expensive", "people are bored with it", "people would rather watch I Love Lucy" and so on. Maybe some of those excuses held in the 1970's, but they have been invalid for some time.

    Then there's the positive evidence I have: NASA talking about having "lost the technology" to land on the Moon, and how they still need to solve the problem of passing through the Van Allen Belts of radiation surrounding the Earth. Wait, what? I thought they did so already, past tense, in the "moon landings" of the 1970's?

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    Offline RomanTheo

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #1 on: February 20, 2019, 12:50:45 PM »
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  • What would it take for you all to admit that I am right, that man never set foot on the moon?
    Video evidence  :)


    Offline Matthew

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #2 on: February 20, 2019, 12:51:38 PM »
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  • In fact, in light of NASA saying they lost the technology, saying they can't pass through the Van Allen Belts at the moment, I would go even further:

    Even if we DID go to the Moon, we didn't go. We can no longer brag about it as an expression, "We can go to the moon, but we can't solve poverty" and so on. No, we CAN'T go to the moon, any more than they could in 1510. 

    If we want to test ourselves again, maybe we can rehabilitate that expression. But having done something and then losing the ability completely such that you're back where you were 20 years before it happened -- what good is that?

    And keep in mind the USA is the only country that went. All the other countries never even claim to have landed a man on the moon.
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    Offline ggreg

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #3 on: February 20, 2019, 01:42:29 PM »
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  • It would take you to not be wrong about lots of other stuff...

    But since you frequently promote utter nonsense I don't value your opinion on such matters.  You are not qualified to judge.  You are just latching onto the conspiracy theories of others.

    If you didn't have such a track history of being led by your own bias and being selective about what is "evidence" and what is not,  AND there was not huge amount of evidence that NASA went to the moon such as images of the tracks left there by lunar orbiters and several hundred pounds of moon rocks which are given and lent to universities around the world to examine under spectrometry, then I might consider it possible.

    But given all the evidence, it seems certain to me that it is just another fool theory you latch onto because it gives you a feeling of control or understanding about the plans of the "star council" of evil men.  You like to think you know how the world operates.  It makes you feel powerful.

    And I am not just picking on you Matthew.  Everyone I know, including my elder sister, who believes in such nonsense is unreasonable and unbalanced and makes poor decisions in other aspects of their life.  If I met someone wise, accomplished and with very good judgement on other things who believed the moon landings were faked then I'd listen to what they had to say, but I have never met such a person.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #4 on: February 20, 2019, 02:25:23 PM »
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  • Ggreg, I'm only going to say this once.

    I am OK with you providing a "dissenting voice" on this forum.

    However, I do have one requirement for you "coming back" to the forum and continuing your membership here.

    You must not bring up, or mention in any context, my water leak from a few years ago.

    In case you forgot, I'll remind you: your being a jerk about that was the reason I banned you. You showed not the least bit of sympathy, and threw the book at me for a human flaw that I believe I share with almost everyone else.

    I told you at the time and I'll tell you again: I'm no expert at what one thousand, a hundred thousand, or 1 million gallons of water looks like in a pool or spread over a large surface. Maybe everyone else can easily envision astronomical quantities and I'm just retarded. But either way, I insist that you LAY OFF about this disaster which cost my family over $900 (that was with the water company giving me 1/2 off).

    But I know, you earn that much in a 3 hour visit to one of your clients. But not me!
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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #5 on: February 20, 2019, 02:33:10 PM »
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  • And I am not just picking on you Matthew.  Everyone I know, including my elder sister, who believes in such nonsense is unreasonable and unbalanced and makes poor decisions in other aspects of their life.  If I met someone wise, accomplished and with very good judgement on other things who believed the moon landings were faked then I'd listen to what they had to say, but I have never met such a person.

    So it's all about the messenger, huh? It's all about people rather than ideas? You know what gender thinks that way?

    What happened to being a man and arguing IDEAS? So I could have powerful arguments but if I'm dressed in rags you totally dismiss my arguments with a good old "ad hominem"? How feminine.

    For what it's worth, I have the same respect for your judgment that you have for mine. So the feeling is mutual.


    But nevertheless, I just burst your bubble. I guess I don't fit the mold at all.

    I am highly educated and intelligent. I'm a software developer. I spent 3.5 years at a traditional seminary and got good grades (hint: not everyone did). I completed the 3-year Latin program in 2 years. Besides an English teacher's command of English, a decent grasp of Latin, I also can speak/understand a lot of Spanish and Japanese. I studied German enough to know the basics.

    If you can pretend you're a man and enter the world of facts/evidence for a few minutes, the evidence suggests I don't have bad judgment either. I have excellent credit, have zero debt, I live on acreage with an average sized house (stone exterior) plus outbuildings, all paid for. We've never received a late notice, much less had any utilities threatened. I married my wife 14 years ago and we're still living in harmony with our 8th child on the way. Our children are all happy, healthy, and well adjusted. I don't have a criminal record, not even misdemeanors. I haven't even received a traffic ticket since my early 20's. I don't drink or smoke, much less use drugs.

    I don't make as much as you because I choose to be more aloof from the World than you. It was/is my choice. Money doesn't equal good judgment or wisdom, much less sanctity, or else we should canonize or at least idolize Ted Turner, Oprah, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, etc.

    What other yardsticks do you have to measure "bad judgment"? I'd love to hear them.

    I'm no mental patient, damaged goods, or someone that can be accused of having bad judgment.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #6 on: February 20, 2019, 02:36:37 PM »
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  • Next, Ggreg, let me address your other nonsense.

    1. The jury is still out on the "Ruth Bader Ginsburg" issue. Too soon to declare either of us wrong on this one.

    2. Ditto for the SSPX. I never called dates! You show me where I called a date, and then I'll admit that I was wrong.
    Nevertheless, even if I did say "SSPX Deal - sign on the dotted line - imminent!" I wasn't exactly wrong. If the SSPX is choosing to get approval from Rome in steps, piecemeal, one sacrament at a time, so as not to alarm the Trad faithful, was I really wrong? Not at all!

    I never said anything about a piece of parchment with a huge John Hancock on it from +Fellay, the Pope, and a few other officials. Sure, this might come EVENTUALLY, but by then it will have been LONG OVER for the Traditionalism of the SSPX.

    What matters is the SSPX changing their position, and de-facto selling out to Vatican II and the Modern World, by laying down their arms TO ANY DEGREE. Once they BEGIN to compromise in this way, it's time to jump ship. At least if it's true that said sellout is coming from the top down -- which it is.
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    Offline forlorn

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #7 on: February 20, 2019, 03:03:07 PM »
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  • It would take you to not be wrong about lots of other stuff...

    But since you frequently promote utter nonsense I don't value your opinion on such matters.  You are not qualified to judge.  You are just latching onto the conspiracy theories of others.

    If you didn't have such a track history of being led by your own bias and being selective about what is "evidence" and what is not,  AND there was not huge amount of evidence that NASA went to the moon such as images of the tracks left there by lunar orbiters and several hundred pounds of moon rocks which are given and lent to universities around the world to examine under spectrometry, then I might consider it possible.

    But given all the evidence, it seems certain to me that it is just another fool theory you latch onto because it gives you a feeling of control or understanding about the plans of the "star council" of evil men.  You like to think you know how the world operates.  It makes you feel powerful.

    And I am not just picking on you Matthew.  Everyone I know, including my elder sister, who believes in such nonsense is unreasonable and unbalanced and makes poor decisions in other aspects of their life.  If I met someone wise, accomplished and with very good judgement on other things who believed the moon landings were faked then I'd listen to what they had to say, but I have never met such a person.
    Star council of evil men? Try the Freemasons. You know that little group that pre-Vatican 2 Popes warned us about and banned Catholics from joining, the very same little group who the last couple Popes just so happen to be members of. It beggars belief why you're even a Trad at all when you seem to love Jews and Masons. 


    Offline Matthew

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #8 on: February 20, 2019, 03:09:42 PM »
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  • Star council of evil men? Try the Freemasons. You know that little group that pre-Vatican 2 Popes warned us about and banned Catholics from joining, the very same little group who the last couple Popes just so happen to be members of. It beggars belief why you're even a Trad at all when you seem to love Jews and Masons.

    He doesn't necessarily love them, but he seems to join the modern world in mocking any and all "conspiracy theories" even when the whole Trad movement is founded on the truth of a specific conspiracy: that of Freemasons (a movement founded by Jews) to infiltrate the Catholic Church.

    He doesn't want to come right out and mock the Freemasonic conspiracy (like a neo-SSPX priest, Fr. Trevor Burfitt, did -- there's that other issue Greg and I disagree on!) so he makes up an exaggerated straw man like the "star council of evil men". Might as well build up a straw man and talk about Reptilians or something.

    BTW, I don't believe in any of the nonsense conspiracies. I don't believe any deceased entertainers are still alive. I don't believe in Flat Earth. I don't believe in aliens or time travel. I'd say my judgment is pretty sound and based on Catholic doctrine and a Catholic worldview. If I end up being wrong about any of the "conspiracies" I gave credence to, it certainly won't reflect badly on me. I'll have plenty of good reasons to point to, which justified a rational man giving them credence.

    Ggreg doesn't have a leg to stand on when he says I just follow like a sheep without thinking. Why am I not still with the SSPX then? Why am I not still with Fr. Pfeiffer? I was the first to sound the alarm at the first sign of trouble in both cases. For each and every unpopular opinion I have, I have hard data and logical reasons to justify it.
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    Offline klasG4e

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #9 on: February 20, 2019, 03:41:23 PM »
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  • Some of the stuff in the thread reminds of an amusing story told by E. Michael Jones.  He was disputing some important matters with a very rich man.  The very rich man in exasperation finally sarcastically asked of Jones why if he was "so damn smart" he wasn't "rich."  Without losing a beat Jones responded by asking him why if he was "so damn rich" he wasn't "smart."

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #10 on: February 20, 2019, 03:52:40 PM »
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  • Klas, 

    Great quote! I love it.

    I was going to add that it must bother Ggreg (and other like him) that his main asset (pardon the pun) is his wealth, income, and career. But how many people have him beat? Since he values worldly career, wealth, etc. he has to be jealous of all the 1%ers who have him beat. If his arguments against us "underachieving Trads" on CI hold any water, then he has to hold his head in shame for not measuring up to THEIR achievements. Sauce for the goose is good for the gander.

    Most of us on CI, on the other hand, can comfortably say that we haven't put all our eggs in the wealth or career basket. We had other priorities, which indeed hindered our careers, but they also allow us to not get upset when we see so many others richer than us. Wealth was never what we were after to begin with.
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    Offline klasG4e

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #11 on: February 20, 2019, 04:07:48 PM »
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  • One Solitary Life

    “HE WAS born in an obscure village, the child of a peasant woman. He grew up in still another village, where he worked in a carpenter’s shop until he was thirty. Then for three years he was an itinerant preacher.

    “He never wrote a book. He never held an office. He never had a family or owned a house. He did not go to college. He never visited a big city. He never traveled two hundred miles from the place where he was born. He did none of the things one usually associates with greatness. He had no credentials but himself.

    “He was only thirty-three when the tide of public opinion turned against him. His friends ran away. He was turned over to his enemies and went through the mockery of a trial. He was nailed to a [stake] between two thieves. While he was dying, his executioners gambled for his clothing, the only property he had on earth. When he was dead, he was laid in a borrowed grave through the pity of a friend.

    “Nineteen centuries have come and gone, and today he remains the central figure of the human race, and the leader of mankind’s progress. All the armies that ever marched, all the navies that ever sailed, all the parliaments that ever sat, all the kings that ever reigned, put together, have not affected the life of man on this planet so much as that one solitary life.”*An anonymous commentary on the life of Jesus Christ.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #12 on: February 20, 2019, 04:16:58 PM »
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  • He did none of the things one usually associates with greatness.
    Technically true (he didn't have an army or a large bank account) but he did work many miracles, which are normally out of the question for any human being. Let's not act like He did nothing great...
    Other than that, a great quote.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #13 on: February 20, 2019, 04:23:21 PM »
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  • But given all the evidence, it seems certain to me that it is just another fool theory you latch onto because it gives you a feeling of control or understanding about the plans of the "star council" of evil men.

    Methinks that you're rather cozy with said "star council" ... probably on a first-name basis with George Soros.  Such connections are the most likely source of your affluence, given that you have not demonstrated any kind of intelligence here on CI.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: To those who believe in the Moon Landings
    « Reply #14 on: February 20, 2019, 04:27:50 PM »
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  •  images of the tracks left there by lunar orbiters

    Now that I would like to see, tracks left by an orbiter.

     

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