Author Topic: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated  (Read 1336 times)

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Online Neil Obstat

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The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
« on: October 21, 2017, 09:26:39 PM »
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    Long video but not TOO long. Second half is even better.
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    Online Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #1 on: October 21, 2017, 11:19:00 PM »
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    Suzanne Pearson pronounces her words precisely. ESL listeners can understand every word.
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    Offline MyrnaM

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #2 on: October 22, 2017, 09:43:12 AM »
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    Long video but not TOO long. Second half is even better.
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    After watching your video Sedevacantism seems to be not the answer but A SANCTUARY, the answer is and always was to recognize God's Justice and beg His Mercy.    
    Galatians 1; 8
    But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema.

    Online Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #3 on: October 25, 2017, 06:21:19 PM »
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  • After watching your video Sedevacantism seems to be not the answer but A SANCTUARY, the answer is and always was to recognize God's Justice and beg His Mercy.    
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    The sedevacantists I've known do not have the same outlook on the Fatima consecration question as that shown in the two videos above. 
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    Even among sedes who like to promote Our Lady of Fatima and commemorate the 13th of the month (or at least particular months) and have put on some kind of program this year for the centennial, 1917 - 2017, they stop short of praying for the Collegial Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary because they think there is no pope, and there's no way to elect a real pope. And they don't recognize the new bishops as real bishops so they think there's no point in getting their cooperation.
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    When you ask them about Our Lady's promise that the pope will do it (the consecration together with all the bishops of the world) but it will be late, and that when it's done Russia will convert and period of peace will be granted to mankind, they don't have any answer. They change the topic, in a way reminiscent of how Protestants deal with difficult questions. 
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    If they disagree then they have to answer the question of whether they think Our Lady was lying when she made that promise.
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    Online Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #4 on: October 26, 2017, 10:30:34 PM »
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    The new M.I. promoted by the SSPX has a new booklet by Fr. Stehlin, SSPX
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    Fr. Karl Stehlin, SSPX 
    The Consecration of Russia             
    to the Immaculate Heart of Mary                

    Kolbe Publications 2017

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    https://knightlibrary.files.wordpress.com/2017/09/consecration_of_russia_en_web.pdf
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    https://knightlibrary.files.wordpress.com/2017/09/consecration_of_russia_en_web.pdf
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    https://militia-immaculatae.info/en/new-booklet-the-consecration-of-russia/
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    New booklet „The Consecration of Russia”
    ON: 19. SEPTEMBER 2017

    New booklet „The Consecration of Russia”


    We propose a new brochure on the message of Our Lady of Fatima. This booklet called “The Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary”.

    In booklet “The Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary” Fr. Stehlin has written about very important two matters:

    • Requests of Our Lady who asked for the consecration of Russia to her Immaculate Heart.
    • The refusal to consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart

    On the 13th of July 1917, Our Lady of Fatima asked for the consecration of Russia to her Immaculate Heart.
    In Tuy (on the 13th of June 1929) Our Lady told Sr. Lucia: The moment has come when God asks the Holy Father to consecrate Russia in union with all the bishops of the world to my Immaculate Heart, promising to save it by this means.”

    From the time that Sr. Lucia made the Second Secret known in 1942, with its request for the consecration of Russia, various Popes have performed consecrations similar to the one requested by Our Lady, while still failing to follow her precise wishes.
    Download in pdf: M.I. Library
    Order: Kolbe Publications

                                         Contents
    Introduction ............................................................. 5 
    Consecration — keyword of Fatima ...................... 7 
    Why the Consecration of Russia? ............................. 10 
    The Pope in union with all the bishops ................... 15 
    Marvellous Promises ......................................... 22 
    The tragedy foretold at Fatima ................................. 24 
    The Refusal to the Consecration of Russia ......... 27 
    Establishment of M.I. 2 — Mission for Russia ......... 39

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    Online Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #5 on: October 26, 2017, 10:53:37 PM »
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    [At the end of the booklet linked above is the following, p. 39]
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    Establishment of M.I. 2 — Mission for Russia     

    The Director of the Militia Immaculatae, Fr. Karl Stehlin 
    established M.I. 2 — Mission for Russia 
    (a second degree of the Militia Immaculatae), 
    bringing together Knights to pray for the consecration 
    of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, 
    according to the requests of Our Lady at Fatima and Tuy. 

    __________________________________________________________________

    Every day these Knights would offer a prayer for the consecration of Russia: 

    ‘Oh Immaculata, I ask you that, in union with all the bishops of the world, 
    the Holy Father will consecrate Russia to your Immaculate Heart’
    __________________________________________________________________

    The goal of M.I. 2 — Mission for Russia is to provide supernatural and natural help for the works being undertaken for the fulfillment of the request of Our Lady of Fatima to consecrate Russia to her Immaculate Heart. If you want to join M.I. 2 — Mission for Russia, please write your intention of joining (full name, country of residence, e-mail address, and a promise to pray every day for the intention of the consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary), to: 

    [I don't know how to duplicate the image of Our Lady standing in front of the outline of Russia on the .pdf]

    All information about the M.I. 2 — Mission for Russia is available at: 


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    Online Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #6 on: October 26, 2017, 11:04:58 PM »
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  • It looks like this: 

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    Online cassini

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #7 on: October 31, 2017, 03:18:55 PM »
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  • Hopefully this thread is open for discussion.

    Recently a friend of mine told me that in the apparition of Knock St John the Evangelist was wearing an eastern Orthodox miter or crown. He had always wondered about this.

    We live today 128 years after Knock and 100 after Fatima. A lot has happened in the world since both, shall we say a Catholic length of time.

    Another friend who has studied Fatima for years is convinced that Heaven did accept Pope John Paul II's 1984's consecration of the world, that had to include Russia. I confess I never did because I would not like Pope John Paul II, that pope who stood among pagans and heretics at Assisi, to be credited with doing anything like that. Even when Communism came apart and the Berlin Wall was torn down without any bloodshed, I still refused to believe Heaven accepted that 1884 consecration.

    Since then, at an unbelievable pace, I witnessed the demise of very Catholic Ireland to an ANTI-CATHOLIC country. I witnessed Europe losing its Christian heritage. Things are simply getting worse by the day. Who on Earth is going to save Christianity in this horrible world?

    Given we have had RELATIVE peace for many years, nothing like the 2nd world-war that Our Lady of Fatima forecast, I wondered why Putin is getting so much bad publicity from the West. I have long come to the conclusion that the West is a far bigger liar than the Russians. Where the truth lies is a mystery today.

    Lately a friend mailed me this website:
    http://russian-faith.com/letter-traditional-catholics-russia-god%E2%80%99s-chosen-nation-re-convert-west-n1172

    on it are some very, very interesting papers. My friend is certain that Russia will be the last bastion of Eastern Christianity and could well have been chosen by God (and Mary) to save Christianity. One site tells uis that there have been 1000 churches built a year for the last 28 years, yes, 28000 churches while in the west ten times that number have closed down.

    Only last Sunday, after our Christ-the-king procession I spoke to a man who known the man who spoke to Sister Lucia. I think you know who I mean. "He told me to my face that Lucia said that Heaven accepted the 1984 consecration." This friend has been to Fatima many times and knew all involved in the controversy. "Fr Gruner took the opinion that it wasn't, and that kept him in business all these years."

    Let us look at the facts. Since 1984 communist Russia, atheistic persecutor of millions has changed rather mysteriously in that Christianity is on the rise there as it declines in the west. Heaven does not miraculously impose Christianity against Mans' free-will. My own prejudice against crediting JPII with the consecration was lessened when my friend said God can use any He likes to do good, even a pope who was taking the Church into Modernism.

    This synthesis at least gives us hope. The 'not yet done' with the present Rome is looking for another miracle. !884 was 'late' but that was prophesied.  



     


    Offline Last Tradhican

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #8 on: October 31, 2017, 04:02:11 PM »
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  • Quote
    My friend is certain that Russia will be the last bastion of Eastern Christianity and could well have been chosen by God (and Mary) to save Christianity
    Eastern "Christianity" is not Catholicism, but heresy and schism, and always has been. The Russian Orthodox church is part of a false christianity, no different than all the other schismatics and heretics like the High Anglicans.

    "In the country of blind men, the one eyed man is a king".
    The Vatican II church - Assisting Souls to Hell Since 1962

    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. Mat 24:24

    Offline DZ PLEASE

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    • "Lord, have mercy."
    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #9 on: October 31, 2017, 04:33:56 PM »
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  • Eastern "Christianity" is not Catholicism, but heresy and schism, and always has been. The Russian Orthodox church is part of a false christianity, no different than all the other schismatics and heretics like the High Anglicans.

    "In the country of blind men, the one eyed man is a king".
    And again, why JP2 and not Pope Pius XII for example?
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Online cassini

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #10 on: October 31, 2017, 06:52:59 PM »
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  • Eastern "Christianity" is not Catholicism, but heresy and schism, and always has been. The Russian Orthodox church is part of a false christianity, no different than all the other schismatics and heretics like the High Anglicans.

    "In the country of blind men, the one eyed man is a king".

    Did I not say that God can use any means He likes to bring about good. If I had suggested God is using Islam to conquer the world and that they would convert, then it would be far fetched. If I said God will convert the ex Christian Pagans of America and Europe by waving His hands, without free will, that would be nonsense.

    In the case of Russia today, they are at least christian while others are Catholic. It seems to me that their conversion to traditional Catholicism seems more realistic to any other scenario I can think of.

    Now maybe you can tell us how you think the promise of Fatima will come abouit?


    Online cassini

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #11 on: October 31, 2017, 06:54:29 PM »
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  • And again, why JP2 and not Pope Pius XII for example?

    Because JPII tried, Pius XII didn't.

    Offline DZ PLEASE

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #12 on: October 31, 2017, 06:55:28 PM »
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  • Because JPII tried, Pius XII didn't.
    What do you mean by "tried"?
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Offline DZ PLEASE

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #13 on: October 31, 2017, 07:01:25 PM »
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  • Did I not say that God can use any means He likes to bring about good.

    So He can, for example and according to you, lie?

    If I had suggested God is using Islam to conquer the world and that they would convert, then it would be far fetched.

    If He can, as you wrote, "use any means" then why would this be far fetched? Oh, not that you will necessarily, but if you're just going to tell me that I'm stupid or the like, then let's spare us both and you just not respond at all, okay?

     If I said God will convert the ex Christian Pagans of America and Europe by waving His hands, without free will, that would be nonsense.

    Why?

    In the case of Russia today, they are at least christian while others are Catholic. It seems to me that their conversion to traditional Catholicism seems more realistic to any other scenario I can think of.

    So, you posit a kind of probabilistic if not naturalistic species of the supernatural?

    ...
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The Real Reason Our Lady Wanted Russia Consecrated
    « Reply #14 on: October 31, 2017, 08:45:44 PM »
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  • Because JPII tried, Pius XII didn't.

    Ridiculous.  Both did essentially the same thing.  You probably just never heard about the Pius XII consecration.

     

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