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Author Topic: The New Mass Lacks The “Mystery Of Faith” (Novus Ordo Modernists Refuted)  (Read 7618 times)

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Offline Angelus

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First of all, you need to stop lumping "the Greeks" in with Protestants, as if they were somehow opposed to "Roman Tradition".  Secondly, the statement made by Innocent III was not infallible.  Innocent III also issued a few douzies in his day, like when he claimed that the consecration was valid even if the priest merely thought the words of consecration (for which he was rightly taken to task by St. Thomas Aquinas).  Thirdly, I believe he said that mysterium fidei was of Apostolic Tradition in the Roman Church, not that Our Lord necessarily stated those words.

I believe that the consecration would have remained valid had the mysterium fidei been simply removed, but the fact that it was moved and re-defined as referring not to the consecration but to the Life, Death, and Resurrection of Our Lord makes it extremely problematic.  That's to say nothing about the rest of the NO Missal, which absolutely guts references to "sacrifices" and, most significantly, removes the Catholic offertory, replacing it with a тαℓмυdic table blessing.

My point was that the Roman Missal itself states that Jesus said the words "the mystery of faith." Here again are the translated words from the Roman Missal:


Quote
"In like manner, after He had supped, taking also this excellent chalice into His holy and venerable hands, also giving thanks to Thee, He blessed and gave It to His disciples saying: "Take and drink ye all of this, FOR THIS IS THE CHALICE OF MY BLOOD, OF THE NEW AND ETERNAL TESTAMENT: THE MYSTERY OF FAITH: WHICH SHALL BE SHED FOR YOUR AND FOR MANY UNTO THE REMISSION OF SINS. As often as ye shall do these things, ye shall do them in memory of Me."

The Latin word for "saying" is "dicens." And the speaker of those words is clearly Jesus Christ. He is being quoted in that formula.

So the Church, through the Roman Missal, has stated infallibly that Jesus actually said those sentences, which include the words "the mystery of faith."

If you are saying that Our Lord did not "necessarily" speak those words, then are you not also saying that the Church, through the Roman Missal, is possibly propagating a falsehood, through the prayer of the priest, in the most solemn part of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass?

Either Jesus said those words or he did not. The Roman Catholic Church says that Jesus said them. I say he said them. What do you say?

My point was that the Roman Missal itself states that Jesus said the words "the mystery of faith." Here again are the translated words from the Roman Missal:


The Latin word for "saying" is "dicens." And the speaker of those words is clearly Jesus Christ. He is being quoted in that formula.

So the Church, through the Roman Missal, has stated infallibly that Jesus actually said those sentences, which include the words "the mystery of faith."

If you are saying that Our Lord did not "necessarily" speak those words, then are you not also saying that the Church, through the Roman Missal, is possibly propagating a falsehood, through the prayer of the priest, in the most solemn part of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass?

Either Jesus said those words or he did not. The Roman Catholic Church says that Jesus said them. I say he said them. What do you say?
Dear Angelus,

This is exactly the problem of modernism in a nutshell. How much can be parsed and dissected, so that it can be altered? And since in one way or the other it had been altered, can that alteration now be justified? The mystery is taken out of the Faith, and the Faith becomes a belief; one of many, a religious freedom.

The Eastern churches, the Uniates, understood that not everything needs to be scientifically explained and categorized. Let us pray they withstand the onslaught of the Novus Ordo, if it is not already too late.

Thank you for your comments.