Catholic Info
Traditional Catholic Faith => Fighting Errors in the Modern World => Topic started by: Canuk the Lionheart on June 11, 2011, 10:02:28 PM
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This is something I've been wondering for a while, and a recent conversation on the matter has given me cause to look a little deeper into it. On both this and other forums I've seen plenty of threads on the Jews. I have read that they as a whole are responsible for Deicide, and in the same thread that they have little connection (religious, ethnic or cultural) to the Israelites or the population of Judea at the time of Christ (including the mob that condemned Jesus).
So my question is, in your opinions what is the connection of modern Jews to the Israelites, the population of Judea at the time of Christ, or the lack thereof?
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That is an excellent question and one that I have wondered myself. I think the answer is that the man who still claims to be a Jew, is not one in fact, but in intention, thereby incurring the charge of deicide, the ultimate penalty was that they would no longer truly form a nation or a people chosen and protected by God. Thus, dispersed for 2,000 years, the Hebrew has vanished only to be replaced by ignorant imposters. There are Old Testament prophecies that attest to this extinction of carnal Israel together with prophecies indicating a national, public repudiation of the Messiah, obviously the many individual conversions notwithstanding. So while I would contend that there are no more Jews strictly speaking, there are those who are so by inention and referred to as such by human convention. Our Lord's words to St. John in the Apocalypse seem to imply the above distinction: "I know thy tribulation and thy poverty, but thou art rich: and thou art blasphemed by them that say they are Jews and are not, but are the ѕуηαgσgυє of Satan." (2:9); "Behold, I will bring of the ѕуηαgσgυє of Satan, who say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie. Behold, I will make them to come and adore before thy feet." (3:9)
I do not think it can be otherwise for if one were to posit a diachronic identity, one would thereby posit that God has miraculously preserved this people, a mark and sign of credibility that can only be reserved for His true Israel, the Catholic Church (See Vatican I Council). In fact, the nouvelle theologians have seized upon this idea of being preserved as a people by God for an even longer duration than the Catholic Church and reinterpreted it in a positive light.
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Modern Jews are reputed to have originated here:
Khazaria had an ongoing entente with Byzantium. Serving their partner in wars against the Arabian Caliphate, Khazaria aided the Byzantine emperor Heraclius (reigned 610–641) by sending an army of 40,000 soldiers in his campaign against the Persians.[8] In 775, Leo IV was crowned as the sole emperor of the Byzantine Empire.
After fighting the Arabs to a standstill in the North Caucasus, Khazars became increasingly interested in replacing their Tengri shamanism with a state religion that would give them equal religious standing with their Abrahamic neighbors.
According to the Khazar Correspondence, Khagan Bulan summoned three clerics representing the three religions and had them dispute their creeds before him. But, no cleric could convince the others, or the sovereign, that his religion was the best. So the ruler spoke to each of them separately. He asked the Christian priest: "If you had to give up Christianity, which one would you prefer - Islam or Judaism?" The priest said: "If I were to give up Christianity, I would become a Jew." Bulan then asked the follower of Islam the same question, "Christianity or Judaism?" and the Moslem also chose Judaism. This is how Bulan came to choose Judaism for himself and the people of Khazaria in the seventh century A.D., and thereafter the Khazars lived according to Judaic laws.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars
Here is a pro/con site on Khazarian Jews
http://www.khazaria.com/khazar-diaspora.html
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Modern Jews do not practice the Oral Traditions of Moses which is the religion of Judaism at the time of Christ. They have a huge book of Rabbinical arguments called the тαℓмυd and their beliefs also come from there.
In the тαℓмυd some terrible things about Jesus are said. (and about Gentiles or "Goyim"---the cattle, that's us)
http://www.revisionisthistory.org/wire1.html
I am sure that most regular Jews do not take these docuмents of their faith seriously.
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The тαℓмυd Unmasked
The Secret Rabbinical Teachings Concerning Christians
By
Rev. I. B. Pranaitis
Roman Catholic Priest; Master of Theology and Professor
of the Hebrew Language at the Imperial Ecclesiastical
Academy of the Roman Catholic Church
in Old St. Petersburg.
St. Petersburg
Printing office of the
Imperial Academy of Sciences
1892
IMPRIMATUR
St. Petersburg,
April 13, 1892
KOZLOWSKY
Archbishop Metropolitan of Moghileff
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/тαℓмυd1.htm
Not a Catholic website but the page appears to be a booklet written by Fr. Pranaitis
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There are said to be two kinds of Jews, the Sephardic Jews who are the descendants of the Jews of the Old Testament, and the αѕнкenαzι Jews, who are the Khazars that "converted," a barbarian tribe.
I'd say this is true. The Sephardic Jews tend to have darker skin and look Middle Eastern. Clearly, in modern-day Israel, these are mostly Sephardic Jews.
The αѕнкenαzι Jews are not of the same breed. They look like Eastern European gypsies. Their foreheads tend to be flat and high like those of Klingons, and they have very distinctive eyes, beady, droopy, smoky, hooded eyes. Nicolas Sarkozy is a prime example, or Ben Mankiewicz, the Jєωιѕн host of Turner Classic Movies. Barbara Streisand, Steven Spielberg, etc. There are many others. These are the Hollywood Jews.
(http://www.foxnews.com/images/402959/0_62_072308_mank.jpg)
(http://img3.allvoices.com/thumbs/event/598/486/62549214-nicolas-sarkozy.jpg)
These are the kinds of Jew who, arriving in London in great numbers at the time, supposedly inspired Bram Stoker to write Dracula ( yes, Dracula is a Jew metaphor ).
However, beware of the idea, apparently pushed by the Jew Arthur Koestler, that the Sephardic Jews are the "good Jews" and the αѕнкenαzιs are the "bad Jews." Both are apostate until they convert, obviously. I know converts from both camps, or at least, I know one who is dark-skinned and middle Eastern ( my godmother, in fact ) and another who is more of a classic Noo Yawk αѕнкenαzι Jew.
Perhaps, though, when the conversion of the Jews occurs as predicted in the Apocalypse, it will be primarly the Sephardic Jews. Caminus' quote about the Jews who aren't really Jews is fascinating, I always forget about that, and then it stuns me when someone mentions it.
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Not to be too racist, but this one is hilarious:
Karl Radek and Ruth Bader Ginsburg have a baby:
(http://i9.tinypic.com/4ktbmrm.jpg)
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Nicolas Sarkozy is a prime example, or Ben Mankiewicz, the Jєωιѕн host of Turner Classic Movies. Barbara Streisand, Steven Spielberg, etc. There are many others. These are the Hollywood Jews.
Raoul the appearance that Sarkozy has, the shape of the smile and the nose comes from Mesopotamia.
I know an Arab/Iranian woman born in Baghdad, a lovely woman, she has
a similar sort of smile and the long nose.
Sarkozy is in fact related to Sephardic Jews from Salonika, originally from Spain.
I believe genetic testing has largely disproved Koestler's Khazar thesis.
In comparing the Sephardics and the αѕнкenαzιs in terms of appearance, the αѕнкenαzιs tend to be more rounded, to be more squat, whereas the Sephardics have the longer more arabid looks. Although someone like John Kerry has some αѕнкenαzι yet he has the very elongated features.
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A nice site:
http://www.shroudofturin4journalists.com/pantocrator.htm
I believe the Antichrist will probably resemble Christ in physical appearance.
David de Rothschild:
(http://images.nationalgeographic.com/wpf/media-live/photos/000/093/cache/derothschild_9316_600x450.jpg)
He's going to be 33 this year if he isn't already.
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will the antichrist be 33 when he makehis appearance?
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will the antichrist be 33 when he makehis appearance?
I have no idea. I was just pointing out the resemblance of this Rothschild character (he has books in the children section of the library with a polar bear on the cover about global warming) to the iconography of Christ.
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A nice site:
http://www.shroudofturin4journalists.com/pantocrator.htm
I believe the Antichrist will probably resemble Christ in physical appearance.
David de Rothschild:
(http://images.nationalgeographic.com/wpf/media-live/photos/000/093/cache/derothschild_9316_600x450.jpg)
He's going to be 33 this year if he isn't already.
He looks Anglo to me.
Or maybe Scottish.
?
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will the antichrist be 33 when he makehis appearance?
I would imagine so, although I don't think anyone has ever said for sure. All we know about the antichrist is that he will be a Jew born in the middle-east that will appear in the Holy Lands and will claim to be a prophet of Christ, perhaps even claiming to be Christ Himself. The antichrist will be possessed by the devil and will perform a "miracle" to get people to believe him. Those who are wise, however, will be able to see right through his lies.
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Telesphorus said:
Raoul the appearance that Sarkozy has, the shape of the smile and the nose comes from Mesopotamia.
I know an Arab/Iranian woman born in Baghdad, a lovely woman, she has
a similar sort of smile and the long nose.
Sarkozy is in fact related to Sephardic Jews from Salonika, originally from Spain.
I don't think so, Tele. When he exiled the gypsies it was mentioned, or I remember reading, that he had Eastern European gypsy Jew blood himself. To refresh my memory, I did some research and found this on a blog:
Periodically, EU politicians trying to win popular support or in trouble with the public try to use the gypsies as scapegoats, as did Silvio Berlusconi in spring 2008 and now Nicolas Sarkozy. It has been many years since I was in France, but the last time I was there the socio-cultural ambiance romanticized in my mind appeared friendlier and more cosmopolitan than any other western country I have ever visited. That Sarkozy, who traces his lineage to Eastern and South-Eastern European Jews, has decided to exile Roma from France is reminiscent of the nαzι persecution after 1935, leading to the “gypsy h0Ɩ0cαųst.”"
I have never heard that he's Sephardic. If you can get some proof, that's one thing, but saying he looks like an Iranian woman you know is not exactly compelling evidence. Just having a big nose doesn't make someone Sephardic; Poles also have big noses, and Basques, isn't it nice that I'm part Basque and half-Pole?
I question your judgment on this one because that guy is the ultimate Khazar. He's Hungarian, gypsy and Jєωιѕн. That is the hat trick, precisely what Dracula is based on. Even if there is no such thing as a Khazar Jew, which I grant is possible, he looks like the popular conception of a Khazar Jew.
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That Rothschild dude really does look like Jesus. Uncanny. It's like he stepped right off the Shroud of Turin.
Then again, Jesus was Jєωιѕн, so... There are light-skinned Jews who look Anglo. Paul Newman, for example.
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I don't think so, Tele. When he exiled the gypsies it was mentioned, or I remember reading, that he had Eastern European gypsy Jew blood himself.
Salonika is where the Young Turks started a revolution in 1908. They established the Grand Orient for the Ottoman Empire. Anyway the Jews there spoke there own version of Spanish:
Sarkozy’s mother is from the Mallah family, which originally came from Spain like all Jews of Salonika, northern Greece, and left with the expulsion of the Jews by King Ferdinand. They settled initially in France.
http://www.ejpress.org/article/16221
I have never heard that he's Sephardic. If you can get some proof, that's one thing, but saying he looks like an Iranian woman you know is not exactly compelling evidence. Just having a big nose doesn't make someone Sephardic; Poles also have big noses, and Basques, isn't it nice that I'm part Basque and half-Pole?
I wasn't talking about the size of the nose, I meant the shape. Anyway my point is just that those features of Sarkozy are characteristic of the Middle East.
he looks like the popular conception of a Khazar Jew.
αѕнкenαzιs aren't khazars, IMO. They spoke Yiddish because they were pushed East from the Rhine in the middle ages.
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Here's one αѕнкenαzι type:
(http://www.americanswhotellthetruth.org/images/portraits/emma_goldman.jpg)
You have a face that seems like it could be northeast asian.
I don't know of many middle easterners with that face shape.
A strange case of where far eastern features have a masculinizing effect.
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The OP asked what might objectively link present day "Jews" with the Jews of the Old Testament. Facial features hardly qualify a man to be deemed a "Jew" in any sense of the term. The only meaningful categories are religion and genealogical/geographical lineage. The concept of a Jєωιѕн "culture" if it means anything is bound up with and reduced to religion.
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Facial features hardly qualify a man to be deemed a "Jew" in any sense of the term. The only meaningful categories are religion and genealogical/geographical lineage.
Physical features can give information about genetic ancestry. Of course now that genetic analysis is possible the technique of trying to analyze one's geographic origin by examining the face is no longer the best method.
If we're talking about the khazar hypothesis, then one has to ask whether so-called "αѕнкenαzι" features seem to be middle eastern in origin or whether they are more central asian.
I would argue the askkenαzιs area middle eastern in origin, with european, central and east asiatic admixture.
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Facial features hardly qualify a man to be deemed a "Jew" in any sense of the term. The only meaningful categories are religion and genealogical/geographical lineage.
Physical features can give information about genetic ancestry. Of course now that genetic analysis is possible the technique of trying to analyze one's geographic origin by examining the face is no longer the best method.
If we're talking about the khazar hypothesis, then one has to ask whether so-called "αѕнкenαzι" features seem to be middle eastern in origin or whether they are more central asian.
I would argue the askkenαzιs area middle eastern in origin, with european, central and east asiatic admixture.
At some point, all that mixing becomes meaningless, bording on the ridiculous. Where do you draw the line in terms of defining someone's nationality, race or lineage? One must first define the term "Jew" and then determine whether a man fits that definition or not. All this, half-jew, quarter-jew talk is senseless.
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All this, half-jew, quarter-jew talk is senseless.
In Brazil there are dozens of designations depending on the type of racial mixture.
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will the antichrist be 33 when he makehis appearance?
I would imagine so, although I don't think anyone has ever said for sure. All we know about the antichrist is that he will be a Jew born in the middle-east that will appear in the Holy Lands and will claim to be a prophet of Christ, perhaps even claiming to be Christ Himself. The antichrist will be possessed by the devil and will perform a "miracle" to get people to believe him. Those who are wise, however, will be able to see right through his lies.
i thought it was just theological specualtion that he will be a jew. caminus said that jews dont really exist and jesus said beware of those who will call themselves jews but are not. am i confused?
i mean isn't it possible that the antichrist will be an irishman from baltimore?
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Nationality is meaningless for determining any ethnic/racial blood lines.
Here is an Irishman for instance. How confusing is that?
(http://www.spd.dcu.ie/main/news/images/Ugba_Abel.jpg)
It depends on whether people think "nationality" is more significant than "ethnicity" or "racial" categories. This day in age, with push of NWO, nationality is becoming arbitrary but the consequences (unintended?) is to destroy distinct populations.
Racial categories are scientifically valid and these groups have defineable and distinct/special charactersitics. I had to take this into consideration everyday during my career.
Scientifically and environmentally/ecologically I am interested in ethnic/racial categories because I believe that God created hundreds of distinct ones and it is our responsible to preserve their unique characteristics.
Although I have limited scientific training in such.
I am currently involved in eco-preservation of native growing plant species (weeds, ha-ha) but none the less they all are unique and deserve to exist in some habitat, where they can thrive without obliterating the otner species surrounding.
I am trying to get a species of wild flower that is becoming extinct to grow on my property. We will see if I can do that without transgressing the law.
tee-he.
Well, I am against 'genocide' or 'soft genocide' which is disturing the ability of any group, that identifies itself as belonging to a unique population, from prospering (without infringing on the prosperity of coexiting populations, of course).
If specific human populations want to form as a "nation" they should be allowed their soverignity and right to self-determination. (Take the passion of Jews for their sovereign religious nation state, for instance...and almost everyone agrees they have a right to such.)
What a long post for a half a glass of wine.
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Nationality is meaningless for determining any ethnic/racial blood lines.
Only if the term nationality has been emptied of its meaning.
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Nationality is meaningless for determining any ethnic/racial blood lines.
Only if the term nationality has been emptied of its meaning.
Yeah. That appears to be on the agenda.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5dmG5ht60A&
Europe must change, apparently.
Israel is expected to keep their ethnic/racial/religious/ identity intact.
ok. I'm rolling and bending.
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Haven't you heard the news?.......
'Hey, hey, ho, ho, Western Civ has got to go!'
Attacks on our culture, our identity, and our religion.
Even the Japanese are being told to import more immigrants to keep their economy afloat as the population ages, with a lack of any real birth rate to keep it stable.
If I was Japanese I'd say to hell with the economy.
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Multiculturalism is nice and all, I love ethnic food, but with various cultures coming together you have various values also. What results is a culture war.
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Multiculturalism is nice and all, I love ethnic food, but with various cultures coming together you have various values also. What results is a culture war.
I love pizza and meatballs! Stuffed cabbage and strudel!
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_is_a_Jew%3F
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will the antichrist be 33 when he makehis appearance?
I would imagine so, although I don't think anyone has ever said for sure. All we know about the antichrist is that he will be a Jew born in the middle-east that will appear in the Holy Lands and will claim to be a prophet of Christ, perhaps even claiming to be Christ Himself. The antichrist will be possessed by the devil and will perform a "miracle" to get people to believe him. Those who are wise, however, will be able to see right through his lies.
i thought it was just theological specualtion that he will be a jew. caminus said that jews dont really exist and jesus said beware of those who will call themselves jews but are not. am i confused?
i mean isn't it possible that the antichrist will be an irishman from baltimore?
He will be of Jєωιѕн race, from what I understand.
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Multiculturalism is nice and all, I love ethnic food, but with various cultures coming together you have various values also. What results is a culture war.
And people not knowing how to make enchiladas or chicken mole right. :barf: