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Author Topic: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position  (Read 15240 times)

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Offline happenby

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Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
« Reply #30 on: August 16, 2017, 03:46:53 PM »
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  • Dome above, from 50's encyclopedia


    Offline kiwiboy

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #31 on: August 16, 2017, 05:28:58 PM »
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  • Kiwiboy,

    While we may disagree with each other on this, I do want to acknowledge you engaging me in a civil and respectful way.  That is not often done when two sides disagree on this forum.

    I have seen a number of videos, for and against the theory.  I also have now watched yours.  I am not going to pretend that I get every concept and google, copy and paste rebuttals...i'm sure that has already been done back and forth.  I'll just mention a few things, in your video and with the concept that I have a hard time with.

    1) The idea that all the astronauts and were hypnotized or really good actors.
    2) The international space station is a holographic projection...so everyone is ok with communication, weather and gps satellites in space, but everything else coming from NASA is false.
    3) Being able to prove a couple points doesn't shatter the entire global (pun intended) system.  Proving one thing right or wrong doesn't validate then entire opposite theory.
    4) What is being implied here is that anyone that has a higher degree in the sciences is in on this vast conspiracy.  Nautical and aviation instructors, geologist, meteorologist, paleontologist, and scientists dating back hundreds of years have all been in on this monumental conspiracy.

    Sorry friend, but I'm going to have to agree to disagree.
     RoughAshlar,
    A few points;
    -The hypnotism notion is just a theory.
    -We never say that there are no scientific discoveries that come from NASA. Throw enough mud (money in this case) and some of it will stick.
    -On "proving a couple of points". Do remember the video is an INTRODUCTION. You are suppose to do your own research after that. The lack of curvature is fundamental to the globe earth theory. It COMPLETELY FALLS APART if there is no curvature. As for proving NASA frauds, it puts suspicion over the organization at the very least, but the main strength of the flat earth position is the lack of curvature. See this link for more infor on that http://flatearthtrads.forumga.net/t17-objects-over-the-horizon-proofs
    - the scientists being in on the conspiracy point was answered in the video.
    It's a pretty radical claim that the earth is flat. Most people are not going to come to it over one Cathinfo post. You have to be interested in doing your own research on it. Otherwise you will just go with the flow of the world.
    Eclipses neither prove nor disprove the flat earth.

    "As for whether or not I work for NASA, I'm sorry, but I fail to understand what that could possibly have to do with anything" Neil Obstat, 08-03-2017


    Offline AlligatorDicax

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    "Dome"/Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #32 on: August 17, 2017, 01:01:18 AM »
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  • Dome above, from 50's encyclopedia

    The ignorance about a major field of earth science, as exemplified by the quoted mention of a "Dome above" (claiming an unidentified "encyclopedia" as its source[†]), is both startling and seriously self-discrediting.

    Quote from: (unidentified alleged encyclopedia)
    [....] and made exploratory flights over unknown parts of the [Antarctic] continent until Jan. 18, 1956 [....]  These flights proved the inland areas to be featureless in character, with a dome 13,000 feet high at about latitude 80°S., longitude 90°E.

    Examination of the crude photo of an "encyclopedia" page, despite it being partially covered by a human finger, makes it clear enough that it's referring to 1 of Antarctica's geologic structures termed a "dome"--elevated ground--whether composed of rock or snow & ice.  But it certainly does not refer to any celestial hemisphere or firmament dome "above" of the kind that seems to be fundamental to preaching the Flat-Earth interpretation of Genesis.

    Quote from: (unidentified alleged encyclopedia)
    New mountain ranges were located at about latitude 85°S., longitude 50°W[text covered]

    Ah, yes: Mountains.  How would the all-encompassing "dome 13,000 feet high",  which the terse introduction seems to claim to be "above" everything else in Antarctica, fit its Mt. Vinson, which rises to an altitude more than 16,000 feet, hmmm?

    -------
    Note †: Another source on the Web identifies it as an article in an edition of the Encyclopedia Americana, flawed by editing out the phrase "snow and ice" from a quote by report about exploration under the command of "Rear Admiral Richard E. Byrd".

    Offline AlligatorDicax

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #33 on: August 17, 2017, 03:01:30 PM »
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  • Dude, WHAT are you talking about?

    WHO is the "Dude" from whom this newbie "boy" is rudely demanding an explanation?

    E.g., the initial quote in my reply #32 on Aug. 17, 2017 (01:01:18 CDT) provides a link to the terse posting by 'happenby' to which I was replying.  Has the newbie not yet noticed that quote boxes that are automatically generated by CathInfo also provide a link to the posting whose text they display?

    As for "WHAT", my cited reply is grammatically valid English, free from infusions of potentially confusing nonEnglish Latin, other Indoëuropean, or Semitic vocabulary.

    Please try to make your posts somewhat coherent.

    Again I ask you, arrogant newbie, WHO?

    CathInfo as a forum does not provide threaded display within topics; it's strictly chronological.  So a "coherent" post needs to begin with unambiguous identification of the member to whom you're replying.  Which you failed to do.  Lazy dependence upon readers to accurately identify the member(s) targeted by replies based solely on chronological arrivals of postings in a topic is not acceptable.

    Offline kiwiboy

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #34 on: August 18, 2017, 02:51:23 PM »
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  • now to actually answer the thread.

    Being flat earth is not a "position".

    It is science. It is what we see with our eyes. That some people before thought the earth was round is understandable because they did not have technology to prove otherwise. Technology that we have nowadays.

    Therefore the fruits can only be that of being in conformity to the truth.
    Eclipses neither prove nor disprove the flat earth.

    "As for whether or not I work for NASA, I'm sorry, but I fail to understand what that could possibly have to do with anything" Neil Obstat, 08-03-2017


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #35 on: August 22, 2017, 01:45:26 PM »
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  • now to actually answer the thread.

    Being flat earth is not a "position".

    It is science. It is what we see with our eyes. That some people before thought the earth was round is understandable because they did not have technology to prove otherwise. Technology that we have nowadays.

    Therefore the fruits can only be that of being in conformity to the truth.
    .
    How wrong can you be, all in one post?
    .
    Your flat-earthism is not science, because it ignores what we see with our eyes.
    .
    All you have to do is observe the phases of the moon, and you can readily see that the surface of the earth is spherical.
    .
    There is no way the moon can have the appearance it does from earth unless we are observing it from the surface of a sphere.

    To insist on your flat-earthism in the face of the evidence only proves your determined agenda to ignore the obvious.
    .
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: "Farthest"/Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #36 on: August 22, 2017, 01:55:59 PM »
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  • As scripture and Fathers of the Church teach, there is a dome above the earth with water above it.  Nothing about what you wrote above contains any serious content because science-fictional space is a scam.  
    My Douay-Rheims bible with Challoner commentary explains that the firmament mentioned in Genesis refers to the area from the earth's surface to the closest stars, and that the waters separated by the firmament is the water vapor in the clouds separated from the liquid water on the surface of the earth. So maybe you ought to be arguing with Bishop Richard Challoner. Except you're only 2.5 centuries too late! 
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #37 on: August 22, 2017, 01:58:03 PM »
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  • .
    The bad fruits of flat-earthism......
    .
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    Offline hismajesty

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #38 on: August 22, 2017, 02:25:40 PM »
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  • .
    How wrong can you be, all in one post?
    .
    Your flat-earthism is not science, because it ignores what we see with our eyes.
    .
    All you have to do is observe the phases of the moon, and you can readily see that the surface of the earth is spherical.
    .
    There is no way the moon can have the appearance it does from earth unless we are observing it from the surface of a sphere.
    .
    To insist on your flat-earthism in the face of the evidence only proves your determined agenda to ignore the obvious.
    .
    can you see this with your eyes?
    "....I am at a loss what to say respecting those who, when they have once erred, consistently persevere in their folly, and defend one vain thing by another" - Church Father Lactentius on the globe earth

    Offline Meg

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    Re: "Farthest"/Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #39 on: August 22, 2017, 03:06:31 PM »
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  • My Douay-Rheims bible with Challoner commentary explains that the firmament mentioned in Genesis refers to the area from the earth's surface to the closest stars, and that the waters separated by the firmament is the water vapor in the clouds separated from the liquid water on the surface of the earth. So maybe you ought to be arguing with Bishop Richard Challoner. Except you're only 2.5 centuries too late!


    How can the water that is separated by the firmament be vapor clouds, when clearly in scripture it says that there are waters ABOVE the firmament, and that the firmament consists of the sun, moon, and stars? Unless you think that vapor clouds are above the sun, moon, and stars?

    Genesis, Douay Rheims Challoner version:

    https://www.bible.com/bible/55/GEN.1.7.drc1752
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Meg

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #40 on: August 22, 2017, 04:12:04 PM »
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  • https://www.bible.com/bible/55/GEN.1.14.drc1752


    From Genesis 1:7 (Douay Rheims, Bishop Challoner version)

    "And God made a firmament, and divided the waters that were under the firmament from those that were above the firmament."

    We'll jump ahead a little bit to Genesis 1:14 - 1:18:

    1:14

    "And God said: Let there be lights in the firmament of heaven, to divide the day and the night, and let them be signs, and for seasons, and for days and years."

    1:15

    "To shine in the firmament of heaven, and to give light upon the earth. And it was done.

    1:16

    "And God made two great lights: a greater light to rule the day, and a lesser light to rule the night: and the stars."

    1:17

    "And he set them in the firmament of heaven to shine upon the earth."

    1:18

    "And to rule the day and the night, and to divide the light and the darkness. And God saw that it was good."
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #41 on: August 22, 2017, 04:45:13 PM »
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  • .
    A most conspicuous bad fruit of flat-earthism is that those outside the Church look at flat-earthers who represent themselves as being extra specially faithful to traditional Church teaching (which is not true) and they respond by saying these guys are a bunch of cretins. Why would they want anything to do with traditional Catholicism if they would have to associate with a throwback mentality? 
    .
    If the Catholic faith is going to have any appeal to outsiders it had best not adopt a patently false cosmology like flat-earthism.
    .
    It is not by advocating fables and errors that can be shown erroneous by simple observation that we will ever be able to spread the true Faith.
    .
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: "Farthest"/Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #42 on: August 22, 2017, 04:49:56 PM »
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  • How can the water that is separated by the firmament be vapor clouds, when clearly in scripture it says that there are waters ABOVE the firmament, and that the firmament consists of the sun, moon, and stars? Unless you think that vapor clouds are above the sun, moon, and stars?

    Genesis, Douay Rheims Challoner version:

    https://www.bible.com/bible/55/GEN.1.7.drc1752
    .
    Try reading the notes written by commentators, which give explanation and exegesis for the scripture, some of which were written by Bishop Richard Challoner. If you have an argument with what they're saying, you might do well to re-think your position. Ask yourself for example, does Bishop Challoner say anything whatsoever that gives you the impression that he values the flat-earth model as anything better than utter myth?
    .
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #43 on: August 22, 2017, 04:55:21 PM »
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  • can you see this with your eyes?

    .
    I have already given detailed responses to this nonsense video, previously. If you missed it then you ought to go back and read the earlier posts. I'm not going to repeat myself.
    .
    The video you post is chock full of errors, shallow nonsense and self-contradiction. It shows one thing and tries to claim that it means the opposite. It's astounding that flat-earthers can be so dogmatically narrow-minded and conspicuously blind. Like the blind leading the blind, they both fall into the pit. So you're a fulfillment of prophesy. Congratulations!!
    .
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    Offline Meg

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    Re: The Fruits of the Flat Earth Position
    « Reply #44 on: August 22, 2017, 04:56:57 PM »
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  • .
    A most conspicuous bad fruit of flat-earthism is that those outside the Church look at flat-earthers who represent themselves as being extra specially faithful to traditional Church teaching (which is not true) and they respond by saying these guys are a bunch of cretins. Why would they want anything to do with traditional Catholicism if they would have to associate with a throwback mentality?
    .
    If the Catholic faith is going to have any appeal to outsiders it had best not adopt a patently false cosmology like flat-earthism.
    .
    It is not by advocating fables and errors that can be shown erroneous by simple observation that we will ever be able to spread the true Faith.
    .

    How can it be a throwback mentality when there were Church Fathers who believed in a flat earth? Unless you mean to say that this form of Tradition is outdated. We simply are going back to an older tradition from before the Protestants, atheists and pagans began to rule the sciences and society in general.  

    I understand that you are embarrassed by us. As if those who are looking into tradition would want nothing to do with tradition because some trads believe in a flat earth. Well, we are a distinct minority. Most trads believe as you do. And any prospective trads will see that there are divergent opinions regarding this issue, and they can decide for themselves. Hopefully, they will see that our side is more mature and charitable (well, for the most part).
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29