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Traditional Catholic Faith => Fighting Errors in the Modern World => Topic started by: crossbro on December 29, 2013, 03:01:09 PM

Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: crossbro on December 29, 2013, 03:01:09 PM
(This post got me infracted at CAF and was deleted)

This is a brief summary on what I know how this came about with some info on why altar boys were used in the first place.

Firstly, the altar boy was used as a position not of necessity, but to cultivate vocations to the priesthood and for training in the priesthood. As such it is not a ministry. Therefore, since there can never be such a thing as female ordination, there is no point for there ever to be female altar servers.

So, what happened ?

1) Germany began using female altar servers. This was in violation of canonical law.
2) For some reason Germany was granted an exception.
3) For some reason the entire planet, starting with Canada and the USA, thought the exception applied universally.
4) The argument was made that since the new codes did not specifically mention that altar servers must be male, then it was okay to use females. This ignores the fact that the new code specifically states that any issue not specifically addressed in the new code defer to the 1917 codes which specifically state altar servers must be male.
5) JPII rewarded the bad behavior.

The result:

When the girls showed up the boys disappeared. Less vocations.

 Useful reference: Ministeria Quaedam 1973 Pope Paul VI did not feel that women could be used as lector and acolyte as these were minor orders for preparation of the priesthood.

 There are two current rules governing what a priest and bishop can do in this regards:

 1) If a priest chooses to use only men and boys as altar servers it is his right and the bishop cannot order otherwise.

 2) A bishop may bar females in his diocese from being altar servers and all the priests must abide by his preference. I believe that there are at least 2 dioceses in the USA that bar women from serving; 1 in VA and one in NB.

 Your views ?

Quote
Dear CrossBro,

 You have received an infraction at Catholic Answers Forums.

 Reason: Agenda posting
 -------
 Agenda posting is not allowed.
 -------


I guess those tens of thousands of posts promoting gαy marriage in the RCC and masturbation at CAF homophileville at not "Agenda posting is not allowed."




Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: Capt McQuigg on December 29, 2013, 08:03:32 PM
Over at CAF, if JP II approved something, it is praiseworthy!  
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: Charlemagne on December 29, 2013, 09:08:58 PM
crossbro, considering that you attend the NOM and spend time at CAF, I can only guess that you're performing a lengthy penance.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: Matto on December 29, 2013, 09:13:50 PM
crossbro, so you attend the Novus Ordo? Do you enjoy the Novus Ordo more of the traditional Mass?
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: crossbro on December 29, 2013, 09:21:23 PM
Quote from: Matto
crossbro, so you attend the Novus Ordo? Do you enjoy the Novus Ordo more of the traditional Mass?


I prefer the TLM, would toss NO if I could.

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: crossbro on December 29, 2013, 09:23:31 PM
Quote from: Charlemagne
crossbro, considering that you attend the NOM and spend time at CAF, I can only guess that you're performing a lengthy penance.


when I received that infraction on Nov 1, I did not log in again until today to copy and paste the message. I had only been a member there for less than 3 weeks. I have no intention of returning to that homophile cesspool.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: Matto on December 29, 2013, 09:23:55 PM
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: Charlemagne on December 29, 2013, 09:28:48 PM
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Charlemagne
crossbro, considering that you attend the NOM and spend time at CAF, I can only guess that you're performing a lengthy penance.


when I received that infraction on Nov 1, I did not log in again until today to copy and paste the message. I had only been a member there for less than 3 weeks. I have no intention of returning to that homophile cesspool.


That's good to know. They won't hear the truth; they don't want to hear the truth.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: crossbro on December 29, 2013, 09:28:50 PM
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: Matto on December 29, 2013, 09:36:47 PM
Quote from: crossbro

What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ?

Most of the Novus Ordo clergy are heretics who hate God and tradition and the Church. They should not be allowed to function as priests anymore and should be forced to retire. :incense:

The church would be far better off with one twentieth of the priests it has now if they were orthodox (if they are actually valid priests. I would prefer them to be conditionally ordained by unquestionably valid bishops.)
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: Charlemagne on December 29, 2013, 09:45:19 PM
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.


This begs the question: If NO priests would treat the TLM so sacrilegiously, don't you think that perhaps they have no intention to "do what the Church does" in the first place, even regarding the NOM (assuming it's valid, which I don't). In other words, even if the NOM were valid, one's attendance at it would bring, at most, limited grace because of the NO priest's faulty intention. That's one of the things (among many) that I don't understand about those who attend the NOM: They seem to have this notion that because it's valid (in their eyes), they must attend. What they forget (or ignore) is that many, if not most, NO priests lack true intention to effect transubstantiation. Honestly, does anyone truly believe that Father Gladhand, with his altar girls, drum set, and felt banners, truly possesses a sensus Catholicus?
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: crossbro on December 29, 2013, 09:50:43 PM
Quote from: Charlemagne
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.


This begs the question: If NO priests would treat the TLM so sacrilegiously, don't you think that perhaps they have no intention to "do what the Church does" in the first place, even regarding the NOM (assuming it's valid, which I don't). In other words, even if the NOM were valid, one's attendance at it would bring, at most, limited grace because of the NO priest's faulty intention. That's one of the things (among many) that I don't understand about those who attend the NOM: They seem to have this notion that because it's valid (in their eyes), they must attend. What they forget (or ignore) is that many, if not most, NO priests lack true intention to effect transubstantiation. Honestly, does anyone truly believe that Father Gladhand, with his altar girls, drum set, and felt banners, truly possesses a sensus Catholicus?


I am very careful and have high standards about my attendance at NO Mass. For instance, On Veteran's Day when I noticed the priest who was scheduled to say the Mass was not present, but another priest I know false preaches and is a libtard was going to celebrate, I simply got up and left.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: poche on December 29, 2013, 10:45:46 PM
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.

It is not permitted to use altar girls at the TLM.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: crossbro on December 29, 2013, 10:48:45 PM
Quote from: poche
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.

It is not permitted to use altar girls at the TLM.


it is not permitted to use them in NO either, El Poche.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: holysoulsacademy on December 29, 2013, 11:01:54 PM
I can guarantee you that 99.9% of NO "priests", or should I say pastors, would wreck the TLM.  The Indult TLM I used to attend slowly disintegrated into a NO/TLM combo, despite the rubrics, that I could not bear it any longer.  It was actually my boys who gave up on the whole thing first.  
They refused to serve at the Mass because they started changing things at the altar and my boys were expected to follow along and take their cue from the mc - an exmonk!
Who supposedly left his order because of modernism which is why he now serves as mc at the TLM.
It is a fiasco and we have stopped going, instead we are now at an SSPX chapel.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: poche on December 30, 2013, 11:59:41 PM
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.

Allowing a person who is not a deacon or a priest to preach the homily during mass is prohibited in the Novus Ordo. If this really happened then what you describe is an abuse.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: crossbro on December 31, 2013, 12:08:36 AM
Quote from: poche
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.

Allowing a person who is not a deacon or a priest to preach the homily during mass is prohibited in the Novus Ordo. If this really happened then what you describe is an abuse.


It really happened alright, the priest read the gospel and then announced that instead of giving a homily Sr. Kathleen Bryant ( the vocational director from the diocese of LA) instead would talk about her retreat. She instead talked about the gospel which was Jesus and the woman at the well, she stated that Jesus was tired of hanging around with all those men who were always arguing who was the greatest. After speaking for about 10 minutes about her opinion on the gospel she then said this was the kind of stuff she would be discussing during her retreat, which I attended and I thought was awful.

Look up Sr Bryant on the internet to see what men who she has turned away from the priesthood, presumably for being against female ordination have to say about her.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: poche on December 31, 2013, 12:58:48 AM
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: poche
Quote from: crossbro
Quote from: Matto
Quote from: crossbro

Let's say we tossed NO tonight, what do you think they would be doing to the TLM tomorrow ?

Drinking champagne :alcohol:


What do you think the NO clergy would do to the TLM ? You think they are just going to throw on lace and cassocks, not use altar girls, not have some teenage chick wearing a mini-skirt while lecturing ?

Trust me, you do not want TLM to become the norm in NO Church without NO Church being purged first. Heck, I even went to a Sunday Mass where Sister Pant Suit gave the homily.

Allowing a person who is not a deacon or a priest to preach the homily during mass is prohibited in the Novus Ordo. If this really happened then what you describe is an abuse.


It really happened alright, the priest read the gospel and then announced that instead of giving a homily Sr. Kathleen Bryant ( the vocational director from the diocese of LA) instead would talk about her retreat. She instead talked about the gospel which was Jesus and the woman at the well, she stated that Jesus was tired of hanging around with all those men who were always arguing who was the greatest. After speaking for about 10 minutes about her opinion on the gospel she then said this was the kind of stuff she would be discussing during her retreat, which I attended and I thought was awful.

Look up Sr Bryant on the internet to see what men who she has turned away from the priesthood, presumably for being against female ordination have to say about her.

That still constitutes an abuse for her to do that.
Title: Taking The Boy Out of Altarboy
Post by: holysoulsacademy on December 31, 2013, 04:23:35 PM
Considering the number of times I have seen all sorts of people give the homily, I thought this was the norm in the NO.  Thanks for enlightening me. Just goes to show you poche, NO Masses are riddled with abuse because they are set up for abuse.  From poorly formed priests to deliberate attempts at subverting the church.

But the NO mentality eventually infiltrated the TLM Indult at our church.  And yes, the pastor allowed someone other than the priest, someone raising funds for an overseas mission, to speak during the homily.