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Offline Mark 79

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Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
« Reply #45 on: December 02, 2019, 08:21:11 PM »
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  • I'll be sure to throw that in if it becomes necessary.  

    I just spent more time than I'd like to admit composing a response to a (new) poster who stated the following:
    I have read, and am in full agreement, that one must know, and understand the the Old Testament, and the Law of the Old Testament, in order to fully, and properly, understand the New Testament and what it is saying.
    Unfortunately, most ignore the OT, and focus on strictly the NT, and in doing so lose much valuable information and insight.

    Again, my response was heavily influenced by the judaism.is sight, but it still takes time to put all of it together.  

    Adding to that, it's me versus five or more Protestants at the moment (only one of my co-religionists has dared stick his head up, but he abruptly left).  I'll let you know if/when I convert any of them.  :laugh1:

    One thing that occurred to me... the way these Protestants refer to "Israel" when talking about both the modern-day nation state founded in 1948, is the same as that as found in the Old Testament.  It's like naming a privately-owned reserve bank the Federal Reserve; for the most part, people just think that since it's got the word "Federal" in it, and it prints the cash, it MUST be run by the government.  Same concept applies to naming the modern-day nation-state 'Israel'.
    Exactly so! Call it "Counterfeit Israel" and they will go apoplectic. I rather like referring to "The Synagogue of Satan's MidEast Project."

    You have to force them to keep their eye on the ball. No sane Christian (= Catholic) says "disregard" the Old Testament, but one must unequivocally state the Mosaic Covenant is dead; it cannot save. Don't let them get away with their "disregard" straw man argument.

    Offline Bonaventure

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #46 on: December 05, 2019, 08:46:56 AM »
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  • The thread on the other forum has been quiet these past few days.  Until today.  Which is a bit unusual, as threads over there either burn strong and suddenly die out, or don't burn at all.

    This, which was not responsive to any particular post I had made, is from the guy who bragged he got an "A" in debate (and therefore you should listen to him!):

    Quote
    The whole underlying problem here with you, Mr. [Bonaventure] trying to devoid my statements, is that just because the word of God said one thing, it doesn't mean it has one meaning and that's it, it is to be taken in context of other scriptures and to be interpreted in light of other scriptures.

    A perfect example, when it is written that salvation is a GIFT and without works, and seems to be contradictory to other verses that say works are important - Yes works are important and they are a sign of believers. But they are not required to go to heaven.

    Take the two thieves that were on the cross with Jesus, he told one that today he will be in paradise (heaven) with Jesus. He had NO TIME to unhook himself, go do a bunch of works and guess that it will be enough, and he didn't have time to go be baptized. So that shatters all of that. And I could post examples that shatter everything you post but I don't have that kind of time. It is not going to glorify Christ, or do any good really.

    So Mr. [Bonaventure],
    I have no problem with you, I am not angry with you, I can go to another thread and still laugh at your pics, or give you a thanks.

    What this all is, is mental masturbation. I do not wish to continue some fruitless argument with you and I'm not saying the scriptures you post do not say what they mean.

    But they, and all scripture is to be interpreted in light of other scriptures.

    The only thing I have to say is your interpretation of Matthew 24 is not correct by any standard. Even though there was "destruction" in the area, the whole chapter is a prophecy of the last days when Jesus would return. He did not return "a few decades" after his Crucifixion. It is said in Mark 13:29, "So Ye in like manner, when Ye shall see these things come to pass (all events together in all writings of the apostles in the books I mention, Matt 24, Mark 13, Luke 21), know that it (his return) is nigh, even at the doors". Matt 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 are all parallel texts of the same last days events. Some things are found in others, they need each other to paint the complete picture, they are not wrong on their own, but they are also not complete on their own either. One event happening, or even several or many events happening at a time does not necessarily mean a prophecy is fulfilled, and certain prophecies need to be fulfilled before others can be, every event written has to be done for a prophecy to be fulfilled. The "abomination of desolation" was not in the temple "a few decades after his Crucifixion so it was not a possible fulfillment of Matthew 24. Another perfect example of scripture needing to be interpreted in light of other scripture.

    From the KJV bible, translated directly from the Greek and Hebrew:

    "Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their faith in him." Proverbs 30:5

    Yes, I am guilty of using some garbage translation off the internet when talking to you late at night that I Googled, and I didn't get my bible, sorry. The KJV version by the way is a direct translation from the Greek/Hebrew, any word not found in the original scriptures is in italics. There are no verses missing in it, or my Strong's concordance.

    But by now I know you, your interpretation against me is, I am a lazy protestant, don't know scripture, don't know jack [censored] don't take the time to do it right, etc lol. Doesn't mater if I worked 14 hours that day, have a migraine, have a pet dying, making other life changing decisions, I could be in the ER with minutes to live and typing something, etc, you will always manipulate some minor detail not in it's absolute completeness or context to try and slam me. Your twisting scripture in this thread arguing against me in my opinion, are exactly like the impeachment trial going on, it's a freaking joke lol. I'm out.

    I like that last paragraph.  First, he's taken my responses to his less-than-adequate posts as a personal attack.  Second, he attempts to diffuse his prior, inadequate comments by introducing a several excuses as to why they were inadequate, but of course none of them apply as he clearly admitted he was just being lazy from the get-go. 

    Also note... he now refers to me with the 'Mr.' suffix! 



    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #47 on: December 05, 2019, 09:40:38 AM »
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  • First, the context of the entire Bible, both Old and New Testaments is the faithlessness of the Jews who repeatedly voided the Mosaic Covenant, rejected their Messiah and His New Covenant, and killed Him.

    Your interlocutor perverts and weaponizes "context" as Hoffman so perfectly encapsulated here:

    “‘Context’ is everything for the defenders of the Talmud. Fair enough. But by ‘context’ they do not mean taking into account the surrounding text, but rather submitting to Judaism’s own narrative about itself, which includes how it presents problem texts to non-Judaic audiences.... The rabbis even deny in many cases that there is a plain meaning.... It is enough that [the rabbi] states it and gentiles believe it; anything else is ‘antisemitic.’ This pattern of intimidation and thought control is repeated with monotonous effect, by thought cops and apologists for Judaism. It is a stock response intended to frighten off the opposition, premised mainly on the moral authority of the declarative sentences used by the ‘expert’ on Judaism. Debate (‘polemic’) on the part of informed skeptics is not permitted, since it constitutes the ‘misuse’ of a scholar’s knowledge of rabbinic texts. Debating tactics and polemical tools are reserved solely for rabbis and their allies, along with just a dash of permissible dissimulation to leaven the burden of swallowing the pottage. And when deception and ‘out of context’ statements serve to advance Judaism, they are all well and good....”

    Michael Hoffman, Judaism Discovered: A Study of the Anti-Biblical Religion of Racism, Self-Worship, Superstition, and Deceit. ISBN 13: 9780970378453 pages 137-138

    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #48 on: December 05, 2019, 09:56:30 AM »
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  • Second, his sola fide heresy.

    That the Good Thief showed remorse and was forgiven and in Heaven the same day does not negate the faith and works required. Neither does the example of the Good Thief negate the existence of Purgatory.

    The Good Thief not only showed remorse, but while in his own agony showed kindness towards Jesus Christ, God. Quite evidently, that act earned unique merit. Who among us today has the opportunity to give succor to Our Redeemer in His very moment of agony? One other person, the Bad Thief, had the same opportunity, but choose to abuse Our Redeemer. God may have judged the Good Thief sufficiently "clean" (no defiled thing enters Heaven) to enter Heaven immediately OR God may have judged the Good Thief needed the rest of the day in Purgatory (after all, we have reports that an hour in Purgatory seems as 30 years). We do not know which way God judged (Purgatory or not) except that same day the Good Thief deserved to be in Heaven for his act of kindness and succor.

    Hence, the example of the Good Thief reinforces (1) the special circumstance of the Good Thief's act and (2) the normative way to Heaven indeed requires good acts and faith:

    “But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, offering up Isaac his son upon the altar?” James 2:20-21

    “Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doth the will of my Father who is in heaven, he shall enter into the kingdom of heaven.” Matthew 7:21

    “…But if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.” Matthew 19:17

    “And when he was gone forth into the way, a certain man running up and kneeling before him, asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may receive life everlasting?  And Jesus said to him, Why callest thou me good? None is good but one, that is God.  Thou knowest the commandments: Do not commit adultery, do not kill, do not steal, bear not false witness, do no fraud, honour thy father and mother.  But he answering, said to him: Master, all these things I have observed from my youth. And Jesus looking on him, loved him, and said to him: One thing is wanting unto thee: go, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.” Mark 10:17-21

    “And a certain ruler asked him, saying: Good master, what shall I do to possess everlasting life?  And Jesus said to him: Why dost thou call me good? None is good but God alone.  Thou knowest the commandments: Thou shalt not kill: Thou shalt not commit adultery: Thou shalt not steal: Thou shalt not bear false witness: Honour thy father and mother.  Who said: All these things have I kept from my youth.  Which when Jesus had heard, he said to him: Yet one thing is wanting to thee: sell all whatever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.” Luke 18:18-22

    “Amen, amen I say to you: If any man keep my word, he shall not see death for ever.” John 8:51

    “You are my friends, if you do the things that I command you.” John 15:14

    “Wonder not at this; for the hour cometh, wherein all that are in the graves shall hear the voice of the Son of God.  And they that have done good things, shall come forth unto the resurrection of life; but they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of judgment” John 5:28-29

    “For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision: but faith that worketh by charity.” Galatians 5:6

    “…and if I should have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.” 1 Corinthians 13:2

    “Wherefore, my dearly beloved, (as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but much more now in my absence,) with fear and trembling work out your salvation”  Phillipians 2:12

    “But he that shall persevere to the end, he shall be saved.” Matthew 24:13

    “What shall it profit, my brethren, if a man say he hath faith, but hath not works? Shall faith be able to save him? And if a brother or sister be naked, and want daily food: And one of you say to them: Go in peace, be ye warmed and filled; yet give them not those things that are necessary for the body, what shall it profit? So faith also, if it have not works, is dead in itself. But some man will say: Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without works; and I will shew thee, by works, my faith.” James 2:14-18

    “…Who will render to every man according to his works.” Romans 2:6

    “For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.” Romans 2:13

    “Know you not, that to whom you yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants you are whom you obey, whether it be of sin unto death, or of obedience unto justice.” Romans 6:16

    “Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.  For if you live according to the flesh, you shall die: but if by the Spirit you mortify the deeds of the flesh, you shall live.… For the Spirit himself giveth testimony to our spirit, that we are the sons of God.  And if sons, heirs also; heirs indeed of God, and joint heirs with Christ: yet so, if we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified with him.” Romans 8:12-17

    “For if God hath not spared the natural branches, fear lest perhaps he also spare not thee.  See then the goodness and the severity of God: towards them indeed that are fallen, the severity; but towards thee, the goodness of God, if thou abide in goodness, otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.” Romans 11:21-22

    “And being consummated, he became, to all that obey him, the cause of eternal salvation.” Hebrews 5:9

    “Follow peace with all men, and holiness: without which no man shall see God.” Hebrews 12:14

    “Take heed to thyself and to doctrine: be earnest in them. For in doing this thou shalt both save thyself and them that hear thee.” 1 Timothy 4:16

    “For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels: and then will He render to every man according to his works.”  Matthew 16:27

    “For we must all be manifested before the judgment seat of Christ, that every one may receive the proper things of the body, according as he hath done, whether it be good or evil.”  2 Corinthians 5:10

    “And I saw the dead, great and small, standing in the presence of the throne, and the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged by those things which were written in the books, according to their works.” Apocalypse 20:12

    “There shall not enter into it [Heaven] any thing defiled, or that worketh abomination or maketh a lie, but they that are written in the book of life of the Lamb.” Apocalypse 21:27

    The unrighteous are condemned for failing to do good deeds. Matthew 25:31-46

    “But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves. For if a man be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he shall be compared to a man beholding his own countenance in a glass. For he beheld himself, and went his way, and presently forgot what manner of man he was. But he that hath looked into the perfect law of liberty, and hath continued therein, not becoming a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work; this man shall be blessed in his deed. And if any man think himself to be religious, not bridling his tongue, but deceiving his own heart, this man’ s religion is vain. Religion clean and undefiled before God and the Father, is this: to visit the fatherless and widows in their tribulation: and to keep one’s self unspotted from this world.” James 1-22-27

    “Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are fornication, uncleanness, immodesty, luxury, Idolatry, witchcrafts, enmities, contentions, emulations, wraths, quarrels, dissensions, sects, Envies, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like. Of the which I foretell you, as I have foretold to you, that they who do such things shall not obtain the kingdom of God.” Galatians 5:19-21

    “Little children, let no man deceive you. He that doth justice is just, even as he is just.” 1 John 3:7


    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #49 on: December 05, 2019, 10:03:46 AM »
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  • Third, I have no idea what he is driving at in his Matthew 24 digression.

    Fourth, it is amusing how quickly he excuses himself from the discussion.


    Offline klasG4e

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #50 on: December 06, 2019, 01:09:14 AM »
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  •  Who among us today has the opportunity to give succor to Our Redeemer in His very moment of agony?

    Actually, since our omniscient Saviour has transcended time ever since time was created, we arguably have the wonderfully blessed opportunity of offering consolation to His most Sacred Heart whenever we in good faith meditate on His cruel passion and ignominious death.  Who can say that Christ did not, much less could not, receive succor by such meditation at the very moment of His agony?  Something to ponder -- especially during a holy hour in front of the Blessed Sacrament!

    Offline Bonaventure

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #51 on: December 06, 2019, 08:45:30 AM »
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  • So, got up this morning, and found that someone had sent me this private message over on the other forum in relation to the 'Christian Zionist' thread:

    Quote
    Keep on keeping on there, [Bonaventure]; I've fought a bit with the forum on the same topic, and now pretty much just spectate.  People have been so brainwashed into the Darby/Scofield ideology that they can't see the obvious, even when written in Scripture.  I'm just slightly to the Christian side of Agnostic, but the warnings in the Bible are pretty plain to see, to me.  I've got good money on the fact that none of these worshipers of the State of Israel know anything of the "Seven Noahide Laws", who would be affected by them, and the punishment for breaking them, either.  And the fact that they've already been mentioned in our Congress - unlike "Sharia Law" which everyone thinks is the real threat. Too many Christians I know are far more apt to become angry over criticism of Israel than they do over someone criticizing their own Christ.  The complete Zionist education since WWII is amazing.

    (emphasis mine)

    So, I've got at least one admirer watching from the sidelines.  However, as shown in the emphasized above, he's still not fully on board with the One True Faith.  My response to him will be along the lines that it's time to get off the sidelines (with his agnosticism), and join the team, which is the first step (of many) to setting things right.

    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #52 on: December 06, 2019, 09:26:00 AM »
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  • Good work! Bring him into the fold.

    If you need anything on "The 'Seven' (actually 620) Noahide Laws"… http://judaism.is/noahide-deceit.html

    (I recently added some scans from Pike's Morals and Dogma, 1871 edition)









    Offline Bonaventure

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #53 on: December 06, 2019, 03:30:52 PM »
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  • Third, I have no idea what he is driving at in his Matthew 24 digression.

    So I went through the thread again to see what he's complaining of the citation of "Matthew 24."  I made reference to it in only two places, the second of which he seems to have latched onto, which was itself a continuing thought on Joshua 23:16 alluding to the Jews being "...taken away from this excellent land..." when they "...shall have transgressed the covenant...," to which I added:

    Quote
    And that's precisely what happened a few decades after Christ's crucifixion, with the fall of the Second Temple. Which Jesus too said would come. ("Amen I say to you there shall not be left here a stone upon a stone that shall not be destroyed." Matthew 24:2

    Now, I believe his complaint was that it wasn't the destruction of the temple that was being discussed in Joshua 23:16, but the falling of the Second Temple was the most proximate cause as to why the Jews physically left Jerusalem/Judea, regardless of them had having it spiritually taken from them a few decades earlier at the time of the Crucifixion.

    But even then, his response is not even on point.  I think he's just rambling to make himself sound like he knows what he's talking about.  I mean, he did get an "A" in debate class, so he's always go that going for him. 

    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #54 on: December 06, 2019, 03:41:38 PM »
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  • …I mean, he did get an "A" in debate class, so he's always go that going for him.
    I hope you told him that. Priceless.

    Offline Bonaventure

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #55 on: December 07, 2019, 04:07:56 PM »
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  • One other thing... the guy above makes note of the fact that he's now using a KJV Bible (after I pointed out a poor translation he made prior), with the qualification "...translated directly from the Greek and Hebrew...."  The inference being that the KJV is superior.  So what is the argument that it is not, especially vis-a-vis the D-R based off of the Latin Vulgate?  I looked online to see if I could find an answer, most especially from a traditional Catholic standpoint, but there's a lot of noise out there on the subject. 

    So, in other words, what would be a Catholic traditionalist's response when someone cites the KJV as being superior to the D-R?  Other than point to the Council of Trent, of course.


    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #56 on: December 07, 2019, 06:04:25 PM »
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  • Other than relying upon the fraudulent Masoretic "Hebrew Bible (instead of the canonical Greek Septuagint)? dumping 7+ books from the Bible? making ~30,000 changes of convenience to Protestant innovations (heresies)? that King James himself was an uncloseted faggot?

    Other than those "little" things, not much is wrong with the KJV.  Laugh in his face next time he crows about his KJV! :laugh1:

    The "Hebrew Bible" Fraud
    http://judaism.is/hebrew-bible.html


    Problems with the King James Version
    http://www.catholicapologetics.info/scripture/translations/kjversion.htm

    Offline Bonaventure

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #57 on: December 14, 2019, 09:08:46 PM »
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  • So... some more time has passed with not much going on in the thread on the other forum. So I made a comment there today to bump the thread, and it got the following two more responses:

    Quote
    [Bonaventure!!]  I have gone through this thread and I will add the following!!

    I just got home from Virginia where I laid my Mother to Rest next to my father at Quantico  National Cemetery..  That in its self means nothing, but being the good christian that I think I am here goes!!

    My hat is off to you as a devote Catholic.  Your ability to quote the bible and its meaning is well above  me.    But I believe with my heart of hearts that when our Lord and Savior does come back to this earth he will not worry about who could quote the bible and its scriptures as you have done so well.  But I must believe that he will judge us my our deeds and how we treated our fellow man.  I hope and pray that it will not be on if we are Catholic or Protestant .. Jew or some other religion..  

    I may be wrong in this thought but I will place my faith in the Lord that if I follow he's teachings as best I can when the Book of Lambs is opened my name will be in that book..  for my actions not not my ability to quote the scriptures..
    Carry On!!

    My initial reaction to this: I have thus relied heavily upon quoting scripture because my perceived audience is Protestants who have been brought up in their mother's milk under the heresy of sola scriptura. I can, however, start going beyond scripture, quoting Church magisterium, as well as doctors and saints, if he should desire.  But, being that most Protestants automatically discredit such sources, I have yet to quote/rely upon them.

    I also got this from the Happy-Dappy Jesus guy who didn't think Jesus would send anyone to Hell for committing adultery (whom I believe is a N.O. Catholic):

    Quote
    [Bonaventure], what was the act of kindness of the good thief?  I've always viewed that scene as one of an example of Jesus bestowing his Devine Mercy upon another who asks for it sincerely even just before their earthly end.

    I... see it more as a conversion in the good thief and he just reaches out to Jesus in that conversation they had since he could not go out and do acts.  Acts are important of course, though people can be saved at any time.

    Now, this was in response to essentially what Mark 79 previously stated, namely that the Good Thief not only showed remorse, but while in his own agony showed kindness towards Jesus, and that that act earned unique merit. The thief just didn’t think to himself “I believe” and was thus saved. It was through his act of kindness, in connection with his belief, that saved him.  Nonetheless, the above poster is still having questions as to what 'act' the Good Thief committed. I'm not sure how to more succinctly state what has already been stated.

    Regardless, it appears the hard-core Protestants are now sitting back in the weeds.  However, none of my co-religionists have jumped in to the thread to offer any help.  

    Best part?  Thread hasn't been closed, and no warnings from the admins that I'll be banned.  Result?  Carry on!

    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #58 on: December 15, 2019, 10:19:27 AM »
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  • Knowing you as best I do, I doubt that you have ever claimed that your ability to quote Scripture can save you, so you should state that his "Scripture saves" tangent is a straw man argument, then I would stick with Scripture as deeply into the discussion as you can. Only after they have been beaten by Scripture into accepting Tradition can you use the Fathers and Magisterium against their Judeo-Protestant heresies.

    Worth noting by "Bible Believers" who reject God's judgment regarding His Church when he spoke to the 72 disciples:
    "He that heareth you, heareth me; and he that despiseth you, despiseth me; and he that despiseth me, despiseth him that sent me." Luke 10:16 …then you can cite the Scripture showing thta God invested Peter with the authority to govern (Matthew 16:19 & 18:18), teach (Matthew 28:19-20), and sanctify (Matthew 28:18-19; John 20:23). Divinely and logically consistent with His commissions, Jesus founded one Church, singular, with one central authority (Matthew 16:19 & 18:18), a visible organized society (Mark 4:11), and called for oneness of doctrine (John 17:11, 21-23).

    Worth noting by "Bible Believers" who think the unbaptised have a normative path to Heaven:
    "He that believeth and is baptized, shall be saved: but he that believeth not shall be condemned." Mark 16:16
    Of course, you will need to point out that the verse does not read "only faith" and adduce the three dozen verses that teach good acts are necessary for salvation.

    You can point out the absolute necessity of receiving the true sacramental Body and Blood of Jesus Christ:
    "Then Jesus said to them: Amen, amen I say unto you [a marker for a teaching that must be taken literally]: Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, you shall not have life in you. He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life: and I will raise him up in the last day." John 6:54-55

    “And he is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he may hold the primacy:…” Colossians 1:18

    “And he said to them: Go ye into the whole world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized, shall be saved: but he that believeth not shall be condemned.” Mark 16:15-16

    “Being subject one to another, in the fear of Christ.  Let women be subject to their husbands, as to the Lord:  Because the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ is the head of the church. He is the saviour of his body.  Therefore as the church is subject to Christ, so also let the wives be to their husbands in all things.  Husbands, love your wives, as Christ also loved the church, and delivered himself up for it: That he might sanctify it, cleansing it by the laver of water in the word of life:  That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy, and without blemish.  So also ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife, loveth himself.  For no man ever hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, as also Christ doth the church:  Because we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.” Ephesians 5:21-30

    “But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.” 1 Timothy 3:15

    “And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. [19] And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.” Matthew 16:18-19

    “Let us be glad and rejoice, and give glory to him; for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife [The Church is the Bride of Christ] hath prepared herself.” Apocalypse (Revelation) 19:7

    “He that heareth you, heareth me; and he that despiseth you, despiseth me; and he that despiseth me, despiseth him that sent me.” Luke 10:16

    “Not forsaking our assembly, as some are accustomed; but comforting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching. For if we sin willfully after having the knowledge of the truth, there is now left no sacrifice for sins,  But a certain dreadful expectation of judgment, and the rage of a fire which shall consume the adversaries.” Hebrews 10:25-27 [Commentary from the Douay-Rheims translation: “If we sin willfully”: He speaks of the sin of willful apostasy from the known truth; after which, as we can not be baptized again, we can not expect to have that abundant remission of sins, which Christ purchased by his death, applied to our souls in that ample manner as it is in baptism: but we have rather all manner of reason to look for a dreadful judgment; the more because apostates from the known truth, seldom or never have the grace to return to it.”]

    “Then Jesus said to them: Amen, amen I say unto you [a marker for a teachung that must be understood literally]: Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, you shall not have life in you. He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life: and I will raise him up in the last day.” John 6:54-55 His Body and Blood is available only in His Church.

    “And taking bread, he gave thanks, and brake; and gave to them, saying: This is my body, which is given for you. Do this for a commemoration of me.  In like manner the chalice also, after he had supped, saying: This is the chalice, the new testament in my blood, which shall be shed for you.” Luke 22:19-20 His Body and Blood is available only in His Church. [Commentary from the Douay-Rheims translation: “Do this for a commemoration of me”: This sacrifice and sacrament is to be continued in the church, to the end of the world, to shew forth the death of Christ, until he cometh. But this commemoration, or remembrance, is by no means inconsistent with the real presence of his body and blood, under these sacramental veils, which represent his death; on the contrary, it is the manner that he himself hath commanded, of commemorating and celebrating his death, by offering in sacrifice, and receiving in the sacrament, that body and blood by which we were redeemed.]

    Offline klasG4e

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    Re: Response to Genesis 12:3
    « Reply #59 on: December 15, 2019, 09:10:24 PM »
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  • You may wish to refer them to this link: The Catholic Religion Proved by the Protestant Bible


     

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