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Author Topic: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral  (Read 2546 times)

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Offline Maria Regina

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Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2018, 01:11:43 PM »
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  • When I first read the title of this thread, I thought it said; NO priest commits ѕυιcιdє at funeral.
    This would not surprise me at all.

    There have been several ѕυιcιdєs (I lost count) committed by N.O. priests after they have been accused of sɛҳuąƖ abuse of boys or girls, drug running, embezzlement of church funds, and/or gun running. Without the true faith, these novus ordo priests are doing reprehensible things, and then they take the coward's way out by ѕυιcιdє when caught for the crimes they have committed.

    Lord have mercy and save us.
    Lord have mercy.


    Offline tdrev123

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #16 on: December 17, 2018, 07:57:57 PM »
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  • Apparently it was all a fraud the NO priest said God forgives even ѕυιcιdє.  


    Offline poche

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #17 on: December 17, 2018, 10:31:25 PM »
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  • Wrong. Define "mental illness", and who gets to "diagnose" the "mental illness"? Most of the "mental illnesses" are false constructs to excuse behavior and enslave people to a pill and get them data-mined on a state registry so their liberties, such as exercising the 2nd Amendment, are prohibited.

    ѕυιcιdє is a sin against the Holy Ghost. The person suffers eternal perdition.
    It is God who decides what mitigation if any comes from the mental illness of a ѕυιcιdє. Another thing is that if the ѕυιcιdє comes because of the hatred of others then those others also share in the culpability for the ѕυιcιdє.

    Offline poche

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #18 on: December 17, 2018, 10:35:38 PM »
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  • Apparently it was all a fraud the NO priest said God forgives even ѕυιcιdє.  
    There was an incident where it is recorded that St John Vianney stated that God had accepted the contrition of someone who committed ѕυιcιdє. 

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #19 on: December 18, 2018, 08:39:41 AM »
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  • .
    Apparently it was all a fraud [that?] the NO priest said God forgives even ѕυιcιdє.  
    .
    Since even poche forgives ѕυιcιdє, what else matters? 
    Most people who kill themselves think it's no big deal and God will forgive them. (BTW that's presumption, a cardinal sin.)
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.


    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #20 on: December 18, 2018, 08:58:34 AM »
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  • Quote
    Another thing is that if the ѕυιcιdє comes because of the hatred of others then those others also share in the culpability for the ѕυιcιdє.
    Maybe, maybe not.  No one can blame a mortal sin on the actions of others.  God gives to all of us the actual graces to resist sin, no matter the external pressures.

    Offline 1st Mansion Tenant

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #21 on: December 18, 2018, 01:40:22 PM »
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  • A person I know was being medicated for depression and suicidal thoughts. After conversion to tradition and learning that ѕυιcιdє leads to Hell they no longer consider ѕυιcιdє an option. Though still taking meds for depression, the temptation towards ѕυιcιdє has been removed due to the understanding of church teaching. I think the renewal of teaching on the subject may save other lives as well.

    Offline Stanley N

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #22 on: December 18, 2018, 04:56:00 PM »
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  • Surprised that people argued against what poche said.

    A mortal sin requires three elements: grave matter, sufficient knowledge, and full consent of the will. ѕυιcιdє is grave matter, sure, and that's why traditionally ѕυιcιdєs were not buried in church cemeteries. But the other two, we don't know. God may have granted a change of will in view of our later prayers.

    And from catechism, there are several ways to cooperate in the sin of another: counsel, command, consent, concealment, provocation, praise, participation, silence, and defense. If someone is driven to ѕυιcιdє by harassment, the harassers could very well participate by provocation, and possibly other ways.


    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #23 on: December 18, 2018, 05:27:58 PM »
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  • If ѕυιcιdє is "mitigated" due to mental illness, then exactly what ѕυιcιdє is not mitigated?  Do we really believe that a sane person would take his own life?  

    And if all ѕυιcιdєs are due to mental illness and therefore should be mitigated, then doesn't that also mean that the Catholic Church taught error for hundreds of years?
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline Quid Retribuam Domino

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #24 on: December 18, 2018, 05:36:35 PM »
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  • ѕυιcιdє is a weak, cowardly, faithless and selfish act.

    Jєω TV, music industry and social media glamorizes it by appealing to the narcissism and attention-seeking of youth and adults with arrested development of their Affective Domain, and it's targeted especially at white people.

    The Jєω wants you dead.
    From the woman came the beginning of sin, and by her we all die. ~ Ecclesiasticus 25:33

    International Women's Day is a day we all celebrate Eve's rebellion at the Tree and our plummet into sin.

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #25 on: December 18, 2018, 05:37:45 PM »
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  • Surprised that people argued against what poche said.

    ... But the other two, (sufficient knowledge, and full consent of the will) we don't know. God may have granted a change of will in view of our later prayers.
    .
    God does not change our will. Our will is our own and ours alone. We are the only ones who can operate it. It's called Free Will, and is a tenet of the Catholic Faith. God does not take back His gifts.
    .
    And how could you ѕυιcιdє without sufficient knowledge. Would you ask yourself "Will this action cause my death. I think I'll give it a try?"
    .
    What Pax said is correct. God does not give us more than we are able to bear. As Catholics we must believe and remember this.
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.


    Offline Vintagewife3

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #26 on: December 18, 2018, 06:27:08 PM »
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  • Surprised that people argued against what poche said.

    A mortal sin requires three elements: grave matter, sufficient knowledge, and full consent of the will. ѕυιcιdє is grave matter, sure, and that's why traditionally ѕυιcιdєs were not buried in church cemeteries. But the other two, we don't know. God may have granted a change of will in view of our later prayers.

    And from catechism, there are several ways to cooperate in the sin of another: counsel, command, consent, concealment, provocation, praise, participation, silence, and defense. If someone is driven to ѕυιcιdє by harassment, the harassers could very well participate by provocation, and possibly other ways.
    It’s not an unknown fact in the world that ѕυιcιdє is a sin. It’s been taught that for years, and was even illegal at one point.

    Offline tdrev123

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #27 on: December 18, 2018, 09:26:23 PM »
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  • My cousin committed ѕυιcιdє but mental health was an issue.  Apparently he had multiple concussions from sports in high school and it made him have a lot of mental health issues.  So his brain was sent of to a university for testing and he did have severe CTE.  I do not know how real CTE is but I have not heard anyone claiming it does not exist.  My sspx priest told me I could go to his novus ordo funeral, I told him what I knew at the time, which was that he had concussions and that was the suspected cause of his mental health issues.  He grew up in a upper middle class household, going to expensive private novus ordo schools, and lived a normal life.  Most likely he never returned to the faith, never giving a confession before he died.  I most likely assume he had premarital sex etc, but he was a baptized catholic, who killed himself but what fault was truly his?...   
    I am totally against ѕυιcιdє, I would bet my life savings he is not in heaven, but I do not know for sure.  ѕυιcιdє in the modern age is very tricky and complicated.  

    So long story short, I went to his funeral, which had over a thousand people attend (his father had a lot of business associates).  There were 3 or 4 novus ordo priests at the "service"; at the "sermon" the "priest" said my cousin was in heaven and he had left his pain in this world.  He said he was in heaven multiple times.  We left the service and waited until the end to go the a luncheon at he church.  

    Did I do the right thing?  I do not know, my priest told me I could go, and I do not know for a certainty he was not insane, or not in sanctifying grace.  

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #28 on: December 18, 2018, 10:28:59 PM »
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  • I think a person who has no faith, if he has CTE, on reading this,   https://www.protectthebrain.org/Brain-Injury-Research/What-is-CTE-.asp
    Would be sorely tempted to commit ѕυιcιdє, Especially in a world where perfect health, beauty, sporting prowess, intelligence etc are the non-plus-ultra which must be attained, and there are no other values worth seeking after, like unity with God.
    .
    THey are certainly not thinking for Eternity.
    .
    THis is what it sounds like in the case you mentioned tdrev. Another factor, I think, is that parents don't raise their kids by preparing them for the hard knocks, so when the hard knocks come, and they do, the kids are traumatised by them and don!t cope well.
    .
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    Offline poche

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    Re: N.O. Priest condemns ѕυιcιdє at funeral
    « Reply #29 on: December 18, 2018, 10:53:46 PM »
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  • .
    Since even poche forgives ѕυιcιdє, what else matters?
    Most people who kill themselves think it's no big deal and God will forgive them. (BTW that's presumption, a cardinal sin.)
    I do not forgive ѕυιcιdє. Only God can forgive sins. There is anecdotal evidence that God may have accepted the contrition of those who committed ѕυιcιdє. But who are those whose contrition that god accepts and those who God rejects? Without a special revelation from God we can only conjecture. maybe we would be right, but then maybe we would be wrong. In this case I think it would be best to pray for the eternal repose of their souls and leave the rest in the hands of God. Remember, one day we will all die and have to stand before the judgement seat of God. will we be saved? Or will we be lost? maybe we will need to spend time in Purgatory. In this case because I would like for others to pray for me I pray for them that God's judgement of them be a merciful one and that their time in Purgatory be a short one, just as I would like for my time in Purgatory to be a short one also.