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Author Topic: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority  (Read 9638 times)

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Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
« Reply #75 on: October 27, 2021, 01:34:09 PM »
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    • Quote
    The idea that Newman or Rampolla are 'infiltrators' is trash...
     The man who attempts to discuss complex topics with 1 sentence responses...:laugh1:
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    Offline Marion

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #76 on: October 27, 2021, 02:29:20 PM »
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    • Quote from: Pax Vobis on October 27, 2021, 01:34:09 PM
    The man who attempts to discuss complex topics with 1 sentence responses...:laugh1:

    So far, I didn't find a single line refuting roscoe's main point. His interpretation of "I am the Church" is useless. But why believe that Rampolla was a freemason, or Pope Leo XIII liberal?
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    That meaning of the sacred dogmas is ever to be maintained which has once been declared by holy mother church. (Dei Filius)

    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #77 on: October 27, 2021, 03:37:43 PM »
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    • I don't think Leo XIII was liberal.  But I do believe there is evidence that Newton and Rampolla were liberal (at least) and possibly infiltrators (at worst). 

    Roscoe has been defending Rampolla for years, but he's never offered any proof of orthodoxy.  He just adds 1 sentence comments here and there.
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    Offline Marion

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #78 on: October 27, 2021, 03:48:43 PM »
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    • Quote from: Pax Vobis on October 27, 2021, 03:37:43 PM
    I don't think Leo XIII was liberal.  But I do believe there is evidence that Newton and Rampolla were liberal (at least) and possibly infiltrators (at worst). 

    Roscoe has been defending Rampolla for years, but he's never offered any proof of orthodoxy.  He just adds 1 sentence comments here and there.

    So far,

    you accuse a Cardinal of the Church without any proof, while roscoe rejects your unsubstantiated accusation.

    That's how things look to me,

    so far.
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    That meaning of the sacred dogmas is ever to be maintained which has once been declared by holy mother church. (Dei Filius)

    Offline LeDeg

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #79 on: October 27, 2021, 03:54:16 PM »
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    • As Leo XIII himself recognized, it was a complete failure. At an audience shortly before his death to Jules Méline, former President of the French Council, he said:
    Quote
    I have sincerely attached myself to the Republic, and that has not prevented the current government from recognizing my feelings and ignoring them. They unleashed a religious war that I lament and which harms France even more than the Church.

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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #80 on: October 27, 2021, 04:24:49 PM »
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    • Quote from: LeDeg on October 27, 2021, 03:54:16 PM
    As Leo XIII himself recognized, it was a complete failure. At an audience shortly before his death to Jules Méline, former President of the French Council,

    This is rich. 
    The above quote makes it clear.

    In the Pope’s final days, he became a conservative.

    The definition of a conservative is “a liberal mugged by reality”.

    The Pope finally admitted he was naive to trust the masons.

    :laugh1:
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #81 on: October 27, 2021, 04:35:31 PM »
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    In the Pope’s final days, he became a conservative.

    The definition of a conservative is “a liberal mugged by reality”.

    The Pope finally admitted he was naive to trust the masons.
    If you want to define a liberal as a person who is fooled, then ok, maybe Leo was one.  But he definitely wasn't a progressive/modernist, which is how I currently define a liberal.
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #82 on: October 27, 2021, 04:51:13 PM »
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    • Quote from: Pax Vobis on October 27, 2021, 04:35:31 PM
    If you want to define a liberal as a person who is fooled, then ok, maybe Leo was one.  But he definitely wasn't a progressive/modernist, which is how I currently define a liberal.

    A person who has delusions not based on reality.
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #83 on: October 27, 2021, 05:02:39 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marion on October 27, 2021, 03:48:43 PM
    So far,

    you accuse a Cardinal of the Church without any proof, while roscoe rejects your unsubstantiated accusation.

    That's how things look to me,

    so far.

    Explain why the men under Rampolla (protégés) became leading figures in the Church Crisis of the 20th Century?

    Was it just a coincidence?

    Roncalli was kicked out of the Lateran college in the 1920s for teaching Rudolf Steiner’s (OTO) theosophy.  Then he’s made Pope in 1958 :confused:

    Card Newman was a prolific writer who hung himself multiple times by his own letters, way after he converted.

    His canonization was surely a time of celebration and laughs in Lodges all over the world.
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Marion

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #84 on: October 27, 2021, 05:44:48 PM »
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    • Quote from: Incredulous on October 27, 2021, 05:02:39 PM
    Explain why the men under Rampolla (protégés) became leading figures in the Church Crisis of the 20th Century?

    Was it just a coincidence?

    Roncalli was kicked out of the Lateran college in the 1920s for teaching Rudolf Steiner’s (OTO) theosophy.  Then he’s made Pope in 1958 :confused:

    Card Newman was a prolific writer who hung himself multiple times by his own letters, way after he converted.

    His canonization was surely a time of celebration and laughs in Lodges all over the world.

    If you accuse a Cardinal of the Church, then it's your job to prove your point, not mine to prove that you're wrong.

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    That meaning of the sacred dogmas is ever to be maintained which has once been declared by holy mother church. (Dei Filius)

    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #85 on: October 27, 2021, 06:14:36 PM »
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    • Quote from: Marion on October 27, 2021, 05:44:48 PM
    If you accuse a Cardinal of the Church, then it's your job to prove your point, not mine to prove that you're wrong.

    So you defend Newman in an unspecified way... just “He’s a Cardinal”.

    Do you believe he’s a saint?

    I accuse Card Newman of being a marrano and I can prove from his own writings he acted in a way to undermine both the Papacy and the Church.

    This forum’s archives contain reams of evidence on Newman.

    Concerning Rampolla, do you not believe St. Pope Pius X later realized he was a mason and had his apartment belongings burned?  

    Yes or No?

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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline roscoe

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #86 on: October 27, 2021, 08:27:32 PM »
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    • Quote from: Incredulous on October 27, 2021, 05:02:39 PM
    Explain why the men under Rampolla (protégés) became leading figures in the Church Crisis of the 20th Century?

    Was it just a coincidence?

    Roncalli was kicked out of the Lateran college in the 1920s for teaching Rudolf Steiner’s (OTO) theosophy.  Then he’s made Pope in 1958 :confused:

    Card Newman was a prolific writer who hung himself multiple times by his own letters, way after he converted.

    His canonization was surely a time of celebration and laughs in Lodges all over the world.
    Roncalli was not a student of Card Rampolla as far as I know. Even if he was it would be a betrayal.

    Fr Pacelli on the other hand was. I imagine you will claim Pius XII was a liberal-- there are others here who agree w/ you.

    Pope Pius X supported Card Newman-- that is good enough for moi.

    Whose canonisation are you referring to? :popcorn:
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #87 on: October 27, 2021, 08:45:15 PM »
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    • Rampolla & Roncalli were both OTO... certainly they knew each other.

    If St. Pope Pius X knew what Rampolla was he never would have put him in charge of the Vatican archives.  (If you recall this Pope also thought the anti-Christ was already present).

    Rampolla’s breach of Vatican security was analogous to Pollard’s spy career.

    Pope Pius XII opened the Vatican doors for the rats to play.  My sense is that he was a man very conflicted about his faith and his race.  

    That he allowed the jew homo, traitor Montini to keep his clerical collar is evidence of that.
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline roscoe

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #88 on: October 27, 2021, 09:02:10 PM »
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    • If Card Rampolla 'certainly' knew Roncalli then I would expect Some Kind of evidence other than a post by U. We are waiting.

    Whose canonisation are you referring to? :confused:
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    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: Leo XIII: The First Liberal Pope Who Went Beyond His Authority
    « Reply #89 on: October 28, 2021, 12:10:31 PM »
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    • Mary Ball Martinez was a journalist and Vatican observer. Her book Undermining of the Catholic Church discusses the unusual tutelage of Rampolla's protégés, Montini and Pacelli, both were also connected to the Bauer "Rothschild" banking dynasty. 

    pdf here:  http://www.olvrc.com/reference/general/docuмents/UnderminingOfTheCatholicChurch.pdf
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