Author Topic: Hey Roscoe, about Sarkozy (Read 2592 times)

Dawn · « **on:** July 20, 2008, 04:36:20 PM »

Dear Roscoe,
What do you know of Nicolas Sarkozy? Is he a Rothchild or just a puppet of theirs?

roscoe · « **Reply #1 on:** July 20, 2008, 07:57:24 PM »

Acc to DBS at iamthewitness, he is a judaic and so is his wife. I have no idea if he might be a Rothschild. Ciao

roscoe · « **Reply #2 on:** July 21, 2008, 01:37:00 AM »

Hey Dawn; have you declared formally on the Earth/Sun controversy?

Dawn · « **Reply #3 on:** July 21, 2008, 06:56:37 AM »

The sun revolves around the Earth where God lived as man. That is what I know. Is that what you mean?

roscoe · « **Reply #4 on:** July 21, 2008, 12:54:50 PM »

Dawn--Pope Gregory XIII has approved the re-organised Calendar of 1582 to be the Authoritative one for our Church. The idea that the Earth revolves around the Sun has been approved by him and used in the calculations for that calendar. This is a historical truth.

Although it is rare for me to use wikipedia as a source, in this case it is appropriate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwig_von_Pastor

See vol19 for re-organisation of Calendar and v 25 for first Galileo case: see contents of each vol for relevant pages.

I tend to pay attention to the Pope even when he is not speaking ex cathedra in matters of faith and morals.

It is interesting that the two Protestants that agreed with Copernicus that the Earth revolves around the Sun(Kepler and Osiander) also approved of the new calendar. While Luther, Calvin, Beza, Melanthon, Bacon, and King James among others all believed that the Sun revolves around the Earth and rejected the Authority of the Gregorian Calendar.

Dawn--do you accept the authority of the Roman Gregorian Calendar? The point here is that one cannot accept the Greg Calendar and reject the idea that the Earth revolves around the Sun because they are one and the same system. It might help to read the first 11 chaps of book 1 in De Revolutionibus

roscoe · « **Reply #5 on:** July 21, 2008, 12:56:25 PM »

The Earth is the center of the Universe in a spiritual sense irregardless of its physical location.

roscoe · « **Reply #6 on:** July 21, 2008, 01:12:27 PM »

The Bible implies and says in many places that the Sun is in motion, but I am not aware of any phrase that says specifically the Sun revolves around Earth. Please give source for your hypothesis.

roscoe · « **Reply #7 on:** July 21, 2008, 04:05:49 PM »

Look what I found--go to http://used.addall.com and type in Il Saggiatore by Galileo

roscoe · « **Reply #8 on:** July 21, 2008, 07:44:07 PM »

$58,000

roscoe · « **Reply #9 on:** July 21, 2008, 10:44:30 PM »

I was thinking just what is so damaging about your approach to the idea that the Earth revolves around the Sun. True this is a matter of purely natural science which your salvation does not depend on. Never the less it is also true that the idea was used in computing the Gregorian Calendar. So it was approved by the Pope and while I have much respect for the posts you make here, I will defer to the judgement of the Pope.

Most likely you think Galileo was a heretic and I would agree with you on that. But the real reason is of a much more serious consequence than a matter of purely natural science.

In the end(1633) it is Galileo's quantum theories about physics that get him in troujble with the INQ. Where these theories lead, is smack into a confrontation with the Doctrine of the Real Presence in the Eucharist. This is the first thing done by all the heretics--Luther, Calvin etc.

So it is important not to dismiss the Galileo case as being only about astronomy. At any rate, in strictly astronomical terms, Copernicanism is a false doctrine when taken as a whole, but one part of it is correct and was later to be proven by Newton and Bradley.

roscoe · « **Reply #10 on:** July 21, 2008, 11:20:33 PM »

Actually, Galileo was never legally adjudicated a heretic so it would be more accurate to say that certain ideas he held were heretical than to describe him as such.

In strictly astronomical terms, the prob with Galileo was his adaptation of the Copernican, Pythagorean idea that the Sun was fixed in the center of the Universe. Science has shown these things to be wrong.

Dawn · « **Reply #11 on:** July 22, 2008, 07:12:53 AM »

I have not studied Galileo and his ideas. I realize that this is not dogma so that we are not going to hell for either thought. I will take into consideration what you say on the Gregorian calendar.
I must say that I have spent the past several years, since I realized that something was wrong (to put it mildly) in Rome just trying to figure out where I stood on the Sede issue. Luckily I am assisted with the blatant heresies and blasphemy that Benedict commits.
Anyway, I had come to the conclusion that the sun revolves around the earth as it seems to me everything in the universe would revolve around where God walked as man.
Still, your point that it is the "center" simply because God walked here and that the earth revolves around the sun will make me find time to investigate your position.

Cletus · « **Reply #12 on:** July 22, 2008, 12:03:28 PM »

God walked on this planet as man.

But He walked here "despised and rejected of men."

He walked here "veiled in flesh."

He seems to have been one of the younger members of His clan. Joses and Simon were probably ordering Him about like a lackey for most of His life after His own father Joseph died. What a rude and condescending tone they take with Him in the Gospels!

It is probable that HE had to follow all of those foolish rules of the Pharisees on a thousand or so Sabbaths in His Life. That He bowed and scraped before the Doctors of the Law with the rest of the Nazarene nobodies. Stooped to kiss their enlarged tassels or what have you. Not something Giotto or Murillo would be minded to paint. Not a scenario that St Louis de Montfort would be likely to preach on: no one likes to consider the ways in which the Son of Man was REALLY humiliated in this world.

True, the King of the Jєωs then had His time of glory as Founder of the True Church. As Christ the King generally honored as such by the mighty of this world.

I am old enough to remember a time when this was still somewhat the case.

Now you can practically deny that He ever existed, and become a top dog in what would seem to be that Church, and you can control the Jesus-thinking of the Catholic world, and your opponents will get pious and persnickety lectures even from the half-way orthodox on how the historicity of Scripture and of that ancient Jєω Himself does not fall under the heading DE FIDE DIVINA ET CATOLICA in the way naive Fundamentalists might think.

You can display extremely dirty pictures of Him amidst the treacherous sepulchres of His former glory on earth (provided that you are a top dog in what would seem to be this glorious Church of His) and the earth (or is it the sun?) does not stop spinning in its tracks the way it should for a God. For a Religious Figure Who, it turns out, was accorded more respect by Old Hollywood than He is by the New Church.

But one day the sun will not give its light and the stars will fall from heaven.

On that day we probably won't get too bookish about what's going on. Or about why...

roscoe · « **Reply #13 on:** July 22, 2008, 01:20:50 PM »

Dawn-reading the above sources by Pastor will help your understanding of this--it is also highly recommended that you ACTUALLY READ the first 11 chaps of book 1 of De Revolutionibus where the general theory is set out. Copernicus letter to Paul III is also very valuable.

Another example would be the schism with the 'East' over Icons that happened in the first millenium. It is not the physical location of the schism that is important--it is the heresy that caused the schism that matters. If that schism with the icons had happened in the 'West' it still would be caused by the same heresy.

This is the way the INQ reconciled the idea that the Earth was still the center of the Universe while still using the Gregorian Calendar which uses 1 of the 3 axioms of 'Copernicanism'.

And yes Cletus all will go dark here in a very few yrs.

ldybraveheart · « **Reply #14 on:** July 22, 2008, 01:26:22 PM »

I think what you are saying Cletus is that with all of the rotten blasphemous filth taking place in supposed Catholic schools/Churches/Vatican by supposed leaders and teachers.
(Case in point the positively pornographic/pagan "Mass" and Stations of the Cross at WYD) God will act and as you say the Sun will be dark and the Moon will be blood red, and the Earth will keep spinning but we shall know the truths of the Catholic Church that we are required to accept for our salvation. And, that what spins around what does not matter.
I find it damn sad indeed that what the "ignorant" knew and accepted, such as a Mass in Latin, we "enlightened ones have such trouble accepting.

Of course I may have misunderstood you and in that case I am sorry.