It also depends upon what one means by saying that they are Jєωιѕн. Some Jєωs persecuted Christ and even arranged for His crucifixion; other Jєωs followed Him. Oftentimes today, what defines a Jєω is ritual circuмcision by a Moyle and simple observance of the Kashrut (כַּשְרוּת Jєωιѕн Kosher Laws). Whether such an observance is to be permitted to Christians is ultimately a matter of Church discipline. In the beginning it was permitted (but could not be required), especially for the congregation under St. James in Jerusalem, and also for the various Jєωιѕн proselytes around the world who had subsequently become Christians (Colossians 2:16-17). But because of Judaizers (as commented upon in the Epistle of St. Paul to the Galatians), the Church eventually had to forbid these practices, especially outside Israel, and then universally once Israel fell to the Romans. There, things have pretty much remained ever since, but it remains within the rights of the Church to grant an exception (dispensation), for example if one member of a Jєωιѕн married couple converts to the Faith, but wishes to live in peace with his or her unconverted spouse. Granted such a dispensation, a truly Catholic wife could rightly maintain a kosher kitchen for her unconverted Jєωιѕн husband.

Are Jєωs to be considered "Christ-killers"? I think that would most rightly depend upon the individual Jєω. Does he agree with Caiaphas' plot to have Jesus Christ killed for blasphemy? If so, then he is rightly to be considered party to it. But many Jєωs do not agree with such an action, and if they do not, even for merely contemporary reasons of political correctness (e. g. "it's not right to kill someone just because you disagree with his beliefs, so Caiaphas was wrong to have Christ killed"), then I don't see how the epithet of "Christ-killer" would apply to such a Jєω. He would of course still have need of saving his soul by joining the Church, but that is a separate issue. Likewise, the phrase "perfidious Jєω" as heard in the Holy Friday liturgy is not meant to label all Jєωs perfidious, but to address those particular Jєωs who are perfidious as to oppose and reject their own Messiah. A Jєω (by race) always remains a Jєω by race, but by Faith he can be a Catholic by conversion.

Quote from: rum

Given his un-Catholic view about Jєωs demonstrated in the post above I wonder who he would accuse of being "anti-semitic." I doubt solely nαzιs. Just to use the dubious term "anti-semitic" is problematic.

Since you both post on Te Deum, I think you should ask him if he considers Bishop Williamson to be an "αnтι-ѕємιтє."

Maybe I will when my ban expires.

Quote from: Matto

Quote from: rum

Maybe I will when my ban expires.

Oh you were temp banned? I didn't know. Was it because of your posts on race?

No it was because I insulted VoxPopulissuxx. Same reason I was temp-banned the first time.

That is a very long post and I don't have the time to read it all right now. Could you post here some of the strange things he wrote about the Jєωs? Thanks. I must say that I said on Te Deum Forums that I didn't think that Griff Ruby was a Catholic, not because of his opinions about the Jєωs, but because of his position on evolution.

If we really have transitioned from the Christian Covenant to some new Novus Ordo Marxist Covenant, then there is one most interesting difference.  In the early days of Christianity, the Christians were persecuted by the Jєωs.  It was only several centuries later they had sufficiently grown in size to “turn the tables” and even begin persecuting Jєωs, which seems a rather shocking lack of Christian forgiveness as I see it.  But now a bunch of corrupt churchmen come together in a council called Vatican II and by their own limited human authority decree a new Divine Covenant into existence, and this time they are armed with the whole force and wrath of the world, the flesh, and the Devil at their beck and call.  And they have wasted no time in persecuting right from the get-go those of us who alone remain of the Christian Covenant, namely we traditional Catholics.
   But you know what I think?  I think that the “New Marxist Covenant” has already passed its peak, and has nowhere left to go but downhill.  Perhaps in less than 500 years there will be more of us traditional Catholics than Novus Ordoites, and by at least a couple of orders of magnitude.  Will we be more forgiving of our persecutors this time?  For that matter, ought we be?  Forgiving, yes.  Welcoming (as is), no.
   For one foreseeable future for the Church might be seen in present Judaism today.  There are three main basic kinds of Jєωs, Orthodox, Conservative, and “Reform.”  The Orthodox are quite comparable to the traditional Catholics, committed to adhering to the whole Law (or at least as much of it as is feasible given the absence of the Temple etc.), and do all in their power to take it very seriously.  Likewise it is only the Traditional Catholics who truly adhere to the entirety of the Christian Gospel and Church and Faith, and again take it most seriously.  One other interesting thing that the Orthodox Jєω and the Traditional Catholic have in common is that neither of us is interested in engaging in “ecuмenical dialogue.”  Another is that where they lack the Temple, we lack a valid and true Pope.  So the race is on to see which happens first, last, and best:  Do they get a Temple or do we get a real Pope?  I think I have already made it clear in all my writings which horse I am backing.  Truth is One.  It’s either them or it’s us; it isn’t anybody else.
   Then there is the Conservative, and here one finds in both Judaism and Catholicism quite a continuum from the nearly Orthodox/Traditional to the nearly Reform/Novus Ordo, some availing themselves the authentic Divine worship in the non-vernacular liturgical language, while others are far removed from it, totally immersed in the modern irreligious culture.
   And finally, there is the Reform, much comparable to the Novus Ordo, except that where the Reform does seem to be accepted as Jєωιѕн by virtually all Jєωs, the Novus Ordo is clearly not Catholic, unless in the secrecy of the hearts of some very misled persons.  Even many of the same horrific liturgical abuses are as much rife in Reform Judaism as they are in the Novus Ordo.  In that they are also victims of the same satanic strategy as the Novus Ordoites themselves.
   So is the Christian Covenant finally thrown aside, to be given the same fate as the Jєωιѕн Covenant?  Must we too now proceed to endure centuries of persecutions and pogroms as the Jєω has long known far too well?  Must we remain scattered and few and disunited until some such time, centuries hence, that some monstrous regime slaughters six million of us?  Are we to be called perfidious for failing to see the glorious Springtime of the New Man-made Pentecost of Vatican II?  I know that in a certain prayer recited by the Church once a year we make reference to “perfidious Jєωs.”  But is “perfidious” a descriptive adjective or classifying adjective?  Does it mean to imply that all Jєωs are perfidious, or does it mean to single out certain particular Jєωs who merely happen to also be perfidious?
   And by the way, I just thought I would mention here that “perfidious” in this particular liturgical usage merely means “unbelieving,” and in this case, quite specifically “unbelieving in the messianic claims of Jesus of Nazareth.”  It was never meant as an insult and should never be so taken.  It is simply a bare fact that they themselves would not deny (as understood here) and why it is they are in our prayers.

Might one from the above glean an idea that I am some kind of Jєωιѕн sympathizer?  I wouldn’t go quite that far.  But one thing I will say, and that is I am sick to death of times when my fellow Catholics who, when speaking of the “great conspiracy,” for some reason seem obsessed with emphasizing its supposed “Jєωιѕнness.”  Well excuse me, but if that’s the case why have they not exerted their incredible political and economic power to destroy the Pork industry and make only kosher foods available in the local supermarket?  If they can put all of Europe (and most of the world) on the Metric system, why can’t they also put so many people on the Jєωιѕн calendar?
   Of course, there are bound to be some members of the conspiracy who happen to have Jєωιѕн mothers, or even some very few who have been Bar Mitzvah’ed, etc., but apart from such technicalities (on par with the technicality which would make any validly baptized person a “Catholic” no matter the degree of their defection from the Faith in every sense of the word) they are no more Jєωs than I am, or even for that matter, than those who love to go on and on about the supposed “Jєωιѕн conspiracy.”  At most, one might concede a disproportionate number of those in the conspiracy to be of Jєωιѕн ancestry, due to the simple fact that the price of entry is a great deal of money.
   In case you haven’t noticed, Jєωs, almost to a man, are quite keen on getting a higher education which enables them to get better and higher paying jobs, to which they work harder, live frugally, save their money, and invest it carefully and wisely, over many years, and even across generations.  Even more important, when one or another of them is down on his luck the others gladly pitch in to help get their fellow Jєω back on his feet.  And they do this even where one may disagree violently with another about a great many things.  Rabbi argues virulently with Rabbi over some finer point of Rabbinical Law, but at the end of the day they have a drink together, laugh it off, and there exists a powerful bond between them, almost, or in a way even more than, that of family.  Why do we all know so much more of the Jєωs who died under the nαzιs than we do of all the others?  Because of their strong sense of family and community in which no one is forgotten.  “One does not perish among Jєωs.”
   In what few occasions I have had to be around them, I have felt it myself.  It is something quite profound and in a way even emotionally moving.  I can recall sitting at a dinner some years ago among them, and across the table from me sat a garrulous old woman who was forever going on (and on and on and on!) about her son (or was it her nephew?) and his progress through medical school, and despite the perfect boredom such a situation would normally inspire, I am actually interested to hear it.  Why that is I do not know, for I have nothing of Jєωιѕн blood in me, and as a faithful Catholic the most I could ever aspire to be among them would be a “Righteous Gentile.”  But, given my overt desire to bring them to my Lord Jesus Christ, I don’t see them commemorating me thus in Yad Vashem, even should I voluntarily take a bullet to save the life of a Jєω.  After all, in all justice Pope Pius XII should be honored there for he also risked much to save many Jєωs from the nαzιs, but he isn’t, and the only reason that is, is because he converted the Chief Rabbi of Rome to Catholicism and Jєωry has never forgiven him for that.