Author Topic: Will the resistance go sede? (Read 19048 times)

soulguard · « **on:** June 07, 2014, 02:22:11 PM »

Honest question. I want to know what people think.
:reporter:

Matthew · « **Reply #1 on:** June 07, 2014, 02:31:45 PM »

There's no inherent or logical reason that it should.

If it does, it will be a coincidence like an individual man becoming a sede.

The SSPX, founded by +Lefebvre had a position on the Crisis which was good enough to last -- and thrive -- from 1971 to ~2003. Let me underline that point -- the SSPX position was so prudent and Catholic that the majority of Traditional Catholics chose this position. Let's not forget that.

And yes, numbers DO matter when you're talking about a body of Traditionally-minded Catholics trying to keep their Faith. What does it mean when the majority of good Catholics -- who pray, practice mortification and penance, are detached from the world and luxuries, who don't care what people think (human respect), who think carefully, etc. -- decide to go with the SSPX position?

My premise, though, is that you start out with a body of good-willed Catholics trying to find a solution to survive this Crisis with their faith intact. Some sedevacantists would suggest that the only good Catholics were the ones that went sedevacantist. But that is dogmatic sedevacantism and schism, which I and (any other sane Catholic) reject.

Once you grant that all Trads started out being of good will, it certainly says something when the lions' share of them went with the SSPX.

So there is no reason why a Catholic, or thousands of Catholics, couldn't decide right now to stay with that position. Why should +Fellay get to ѕυιcιdє-bomb a perfectly good position on the Crisis?

He doesn't have the right.

Just because +Fellay fell doesn't mean that everyone adhering to +Lefebvre's position NECESSARILY has to fall, or that the position is INHERENTLY untenable. I'm sure many have wondered about that in the past couple of years -- but it still doesn't make it a fact.

JPaul · « **Reply #2 on:** June 07, 2014, 02:35:37 PM »

No, its leaders are too soundly founded in the R&R position for that to happen. If the papal acts become more blatant and questionable, the position is likely to be adjusted to maintain itself as is.

soulguard · « **Reply #3 on:** June 07, 2014, 02:40:30 PM »

Are there not some resistance priests in south America that went sedevacantist? Or am I mistaken about this? If there are, how are they still part of the resistance?
:idea:

Cantarella · « **Reply #4 on:** June 07, 2014, 03:14:23 PM »

Most certainly not. The Resistance, in continuation with Archbishop Lefebvre's stand, has already declared a non-Sedevacantist position.

TKGS · « **Reply #5 on:** June 07, 2014, 03:58:31 PM »

From the sermons from Resistance priests that have been posted on this site that I have listened to, it would seem to me that the Resistance priests are even more anti-sedevacantist than the SSPX. No, I don't see the Resistance going sedevacantist.

Mithrandylan · « **Reply #6 on:** June 07, 2014, 04:03:32 PM »

I think you'll have to define it before you ask that question.

Will Fr Pfeiffer go sede? I doubt it. There's a better chance of Bishop Fellay going sedevacantist before he does, I think.

Seems to me maybe the American society goers have been bit by the anti-SV bug more than throughout the world. Seems, anyways. Definitely not the case in South America, so far as I can tell. Nor in Europe, based on what's been translated anyways. I'm sure it has to do with "the nine." I'd venture that factors into +W's aversion to it, as well.

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #7 on:** June 07, 2014, 04:08:42 PM »

It seems that the SSPX likes to label the people thrown out of there as sedes. It's an effective way, sadly, of marginalizing people. Kinda like when certain folks call anyone who is a traditional Catholic an "anti semite."

Here's an example of a conversation at an SSPX chapel regarding the "resistance people."

Lady 1 (Curious person): What is with these resistance priests anyway? I'm interested in finding out what their gripe is.

Lady 2 (Accordista): Oh, don't bother. They're all a bunch of sedevacantist fanatics. They think that even talking to the Pope is wrong, and that's all that Bishop Fellay was doing anyway.

Ferdinand · « **Reply #8 on:** June 07, 2014, 08:26:15 PM »

Quote from: Cancerella

Most certainly not. The Resistance, in continuation with Archbishop Lefebvre's stand, has already declared a non-Sedevacantist position.

Come Hell, High Water (or even reality) we're stikin to the party line :stare:

Ferdinand · « **Reply #9 on:** June 07, 2014, 08:32:30 PM »

Quote from: Mithrandylan

I think you'll have to define it before you ask that question.

Will Fr Pfeiffer go sede? I doubt it. There's a better chance of Bishop Fellay going sedevacantist before he does, I think.

Seems to me maybe the American society goers have been bit by the anti-SV bug more than throughout the world. Seems, anyways. Definitely not the case in South America, so far as I can tell. Nor in Europe, based on what's been translated anyways. I'm sure it has to do with "the nine." I'd venture that factors into +W's aversion to it, as well.

Remember, Kool-Aide is an American beverage :rolleyes:

Matthew · « **Reply #10 on:** June 07, 2014, 09:47:30 PM »

Quote from: Ferdinand

Quote from: Mithrandylan
I think you'll have to define it before you ask that question.

Will Fr Pfeiffer go sede? I doubt it. There's a better chance of Bishop Fellay going sedevacantist before he does, I think.

Seems to me maybe the American society goers have been bit by the anti-SV bug more than throughout the world. Seems, anyways. Definitely not the case in South America, so far as I can tell. Nor in Europe, based on what's been translated anyways. I'm sure it has to do with "the nine." I'd venture that factors into +W's aversion to it, as well.

Come Hell, High Water (or even reality) we're stikin to the party line :stare:

Remember, Kool-Aide is an American beverage :rolleyes:

Then learn how to spell it. I thought you were from America. It's not like Kool-Aid hasn't been around for OVER SIXTY YEARS. Even if you don't have kids and have never bought it (or drank it when you were a kid), how do you avoid seeing it at the grocery store, advertisements, etc.?

I love it when people criticize the "sheeple" drinking the "cool aid", "kool aide" and every other spelling. (Besides, in the Jim Jones cult it was actually Flavor Aid, not actual name-brand Kool-Aid.)

And your caricature of the non-Sedevacantist position is not accurate.

I don't choose to be non-Sedevacantist because it's "the party line"; I choose it because I find it to be the more prudent position to take. I don't see any benefit to Sedevacantism; therefore I have not embraced the position.

Neil Obstat · « **Reply #11 on:** June 07, 2014, 09:57:08 PM »

Quote from: Ferdinand

Quote from: Mithrandylan
I think you'll have to define it before you ask that question.

Will Fr Pfeiffer go sede? I doubt it. There's a better chance of Bishop Fellay going sedevacantist before he does, I think.

Seems to me maybe the American society goers have been bit by the anti-SV bug more than throughout the world. Seems, anyways. Definitely not the case in South America, so far as I can tell. Nor in Europe, based on what's been translated anyways. I'm sure it has to do with "the nine." I'd venture that factors into +W's aversion to it, as well.

Remember, Kool-Aide is an American beverage :rolleyes:

You gave it away, Fernie; you're not American!

Ambrose · « **Reply #12 on:** June 07, 2014, 10:26:49 PM »

From what I have read and heard, the non-American resistance is moving towards sedevacatism, while the American resistance is gravitating to a fiercely anti-sedevacatist position in defence of Francis' claim to the Papacy.

Francisco · « **Reply #13 on:** June 08, 2014, 01:10:11 AM »

Quote from: Ambrose

From what I have read and heard, the non-American resistance is moving towards sedevacatism, while the American resistance is gravitating to a fiercely anti-sedevacatist position in defence of Francis' claim to the Papacy.

Non-American meaning European, Latin-American and Asian (in the person of Frenchman Fr Chazal)?. American meaning Frs Girouard,Hewko and Pfeiffer?

Guiseppe Sarto · « **Reply #14 on:** June 08, 2014, 05:51:23 AM »

Most certainly the resistance will not turn sedevante. The priests and the faithful of the so-called resistance need to read a pre-1940 theological treatise De Ecclesia and compare its conclusions with the position of SSPX and SSPX-resistance!