Author Topic: When "Pope" Francis "canonizes" John Paul II as a "Saint" hat will the (Read 9237 times)

Lover of Truth · « **on:** February 24, 2014, 02:14:05 PM »

I just had to share this. If someone knows how to make it a poll please do so:

When "Pope" Francis "canonizes" John Paul II as a "Saint" on April 27, 2014, what will the reaction of the Semi-Traditionalists be?

   They will grudgingly accept it and retract their criticism of "Saint" John Paul II.

   They will grudgingly accept it but it won't have any further impact on what they say or do.

   They will ignore it and hope nobody notices.

   They will say it's all a big mystery, no one knows, and besides, there's always "diabolical disorientation."

   They will refuse to accept it and claim that canonizations are NOT infallible.

   They will refuse to accept it and claim that though canonizations are normally infallible, NOVUS ORDO canonizations are not.

   They will refuse to accept it, reject Francis as an Antipope, and say Benedict XVI is still Pope.

   They will refuse to accept it, reject Francis as an Antipope, and say there is no Pope now, but Benedict XVI was the last true one.

   They will refuse to accept it and become sedevacantists, acknowledging that the last true Pope was Pius XII.

http://www.novusordowatch.org/wire/index.htm#.UwueoIWhZ5E

Matto · « **Reply #1 on:** February 24, 2014, 02:23:36 PM »

Please define "Semi-Traditionalists" for us so we know who you are talking about.

Ecclesia Militans · « **Reply #2 on:** February 24, 2014, 04:03:58 PM »

Quote from: Lover of Truth

They will refuse to accept it and claim that canonizations are NOT infallible.

The Church has never taught that the Pope is infallible in canonizations.

katholikos · « **Reply #3 on:** February 24, 2014, 04:44:21 PM »

Quote from: Ecclesia Militans

Quote from: Lover of Truth
They will refuse to accept it and claim that canonizations are NOT infallible.

The Church has never taught that the Pope is infallible in canonizations.

Oh yes, she has!

http://www.novusordowatch.org/wire/john-paul-canonization.htm

It is impossible that the entire Church venerate someone and hold him up for imitation who is in fact not a saint and not a model for Catholics.

pickoverthecliff · « **Reply #4 on:** February 25, 2014, 01:06:56 AM »

It is possible they will just delay and not go through with it. Their goal is just to get JP2 to be thought of as a saint, they don't need to actually "canonize" him.

Our local novus ordo parish already has St. JP2 calendars they've been offering since the beginning of the year, and we know he's not considered a saint yet.

crossbro · « **Reply #5 on:** February 25, 2014, 01:50:58 AM »

Only God knows who goes to heaven and who goes to hell.

The insult in making JPII and JXXIII saints is that the honor was one that went to people who accomplished great things during their lives and were an inspiration.

Now what has happened to the Church since JXXIII ? Has the Church grown under the JPII ?

Look at Pius X. It took decades after his death for him to receive the honor and he was the first Pope in centuries to be named a saint. He was a great Pope.

I really wish I could have been there in heaven when Pius X confronted JPII and know that meeting happened and I know that JPII got a butt kicking. It probably took a battalion of angels to get Pius X off of JPII.

Lover of Truth · « **Reply #6 on:** February 25, 2014, 04:51:37 AM »

Quote from: Ecclesia Militans

Quote from: Lover of Truth
They will refuse to accept it and claim that canonizations are NOT infallible.

The Church has never taught that the Pope is infallible in canonizations.

So we can pray to "Saints" in Hell in her official liturgy. Okay. Got it.

Lover of Truth · « **Reply #7 on:** February 25, 2014, 04:53:19 AM »

Novus Ordo Watch is on the ball. You can tell be the responses right here that people will accept anything by the truth on the situation. It reminds of a river in Egypt. Denial.

ggreg · « **Reply #8 on:** February 25, 2014, 04:57:30 AM »

What is a semi trad?

ggreg · « **Reply #9 on:** February 25, 2014, 04:59:09 AM »

Quote from: pickoverthecliff

It is possible they will just delay and not go through with it. Their goal is just to get JP2 to be thought of as a saint, they don't need to actually "canonize" him.

Our local novus ordo parish already has St. JP2 calendars they've been offering since the beginning of the year, and we know he's not considered a saint yet.

I think that is unlikely as they have named the date they plan to do it.

Divine Mercy Sunday

ggreg · « **Reply #10 on:** February 25, 2014, 05:01:02 AM »

People paying 3000 for a pilgrimage are going to want their money back.

http://www.catholicpilgrimoffice.com/pop_john.php

Lover of Truth · « **Reply #11 on:** February 25, 2014, 05:03:17 AM »

Quote from: ggreg

What is a semi trad?

Someone who rejects the Novus Ordo but accepts the Novus Ordo "Pope". One who believes there are such things as both Catholic Popes and Non-Catholic Popes.

One who rejects V2 but accepts the "Pope" that approved and promulgated it.

One who rejects the V2 doubtful and invalid Sacraments but accepts the "Pope" who promulgated them.

One who rejects false ecuмenism and religious liberty but accepts the "Pope" that teaches those heresies.

One who rejects the canon law that teaches heretics can receive the Eucharist but accepts the "Pope" that promulgated it.

One who rejects worshiping with heretics but accepts the "Popes" that encourages us to do so.

One who rejects the "Saint" they "canonize" but accept the "Pope" that canonizes them.

One who insists that Bergi is "Pope" but denies he is a heretic.

One who insists the Bergi is "Pope" and admits he is a heretic.

One who "refutes" proof that these guys cannot possibly be Catholic Popes which are the unifying head of the one true Church by saying we cannot judge him.

One who reduces the Papacy that Christ died to give us to an office for meaningless figure-heads that we can and should ignore and disobey for 5 or more consecutive decades.

Just a hunch. But I think it is those type of Trads that the writer is speaking of.

I didn't write the article but that is my guess. Any other guesses?

Ecclesia Militans · « **Reply #12 on:** February 25, 2014, 06:31:12 AM »

Quote from: katholikos

Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
Quote from: Lover of Truth
They will refuse to accept it and claim that canonizations are NOT infallible.

The Church has never taught that the Pope is infallible in canonizations.

Oh yes, she has!

http://www.novusordowatch.org/wire/john-paul-canonization.htm

It is impossible that the entire Church venerate someone and hold him up for imitation who is in fact not a saint and not a model for Catholics.

In your link, please point to me that exact passage that contains the Church's teaching that canonizations are infallible.

Ecclesia Militans · « **Reply #13 on:** February 25, 2014, 06:32:23 AM »

Quote from: Lover of Truth

Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
Quote from: Lover of Truth
They will refuse to accept it and claim that canonizations are NOT infallible.

The Church has never taught that the Pope is infallible in canonizations.

So we can pray to "Saints" in Hell in her official liturgy. Okay. Got it.

I never said that. I simply said that the Church has never officially taught that the Pope is infallible in canonizations because She has never defined the conditions required for us to know with certainty that a particular canonization is infallible.

ggreg · « **Reply #14 on:** February 25, 2014, 07:03:24 AM »

Quote from: Lover of Truth

Someone who rejects the Novus Ordo but accepts the Novus Ordo "Pope". One who believes there are such things as both Catholic Popes and Non-Catholic Popes.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.

One who rejects V2 but accepts the "Pope" that approved and promulgated it.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.

One who rejects the V2 doubtful and invalid Sacraments but accepts the "Pope" who promulgated them.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.

One who rejects false ecuмenism and religious liberty but accepts the "Pope" that teaches those heresies.

One who rejects the canon law that teaches heretics can receive the Eucharist but accepts the "Pope" that promulgated it.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.

One who rejects worshiping with heretics but accepts the "Popes" that encourages us to do so.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.

One who rejects the "Saint" they "canonize" but accept the "Pope" that canonizes them.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.

One who insists that Bergi is "Pope" but denies he is a heretic.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.

One who insists the Bergi is "Pope" and admits he is a heretic.

That is every Catholic except sedevacantists. Why not just use the term non-Sedevacantists instead of Semi trad? It would be clearer.