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Author Topic: What keeps us from taking the leap?  (Read 3840 times)

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Offline 2Vermont

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What keeps us from taking the leap?
« on: September 27, 2013, 04:40:53 PM »
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  • I have noticed that there are a number of posters that are saying things like "I haven't decided to become sedevacantist/take the sede view but it's becoming increasingly more probable".

    For those of you who are saying this (and I guess I'm there too to some extent although my posts really do sound like I've made a decision), what is keeping you from making the jump to SV?  I think your comments will help me immensely.

    (And I LOVE that I can ask this question unlike FE)
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)


    Offline Matto

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #1 on: September 27, 2013, 05:07:27 PM »
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  • Unless you think that there is a secret hierarchy underground hiding from Freemasons, if sedevacantism is true there would be no hope for normal times under a pope to ever happen again, barring a miracle from God.
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.


    Offline 2Vermont

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #2 on: September 27, 2013, 05:13:26 PM »
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  • Quote from: Matto
    Unless you think that there is a secret hierarchy underground hiding from Freemasons, if sedevacantism is true there would be no hope for normal times under a pope to ever happen again, barring a miracle from God.


    I'm not following...why couldn't it happen again?
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline Matto

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #3 on: September 27, 2013, 05:16:59 PM »
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  • Quote from: 2Vermont
    Quote from: Matto
    Unless you think that there is a secret hierarchy underground hiding from Freemasons, if sedevacantism is true there would be no hope for normal times under a pope to ever happen again, barring a miracle from God.


    I'm not following...why couldn't it happen again?

    How will we ever get a new Pope if sedevacantism is true? Lucian Pulvermacher? Pope Michael?
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #4 on: September 27, 2013, 05:23:56 PM »
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  • Simply a matter on voting, right?  Even a layperson could become elected as pope but then he'd have to enroll in a seminary (ideally one run by the SSPX or a sede group).

    Any validly consecrated Bishop could become the pope.  

    Times are tough, there's no doubting that!  :cool:


    Offline 2Vermont

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #5 on: September 27, 2013, 05:31:14 PM »
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  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    Simply a matter on voting, right?  Even a layperson could become elected as pope but then he'd have to enroll in a seminary (ideally one run by the SSPX or a sede group).

    Any validly consecrated Bishop could become the pope.  

    Times are tough, there's no doubting that!  :cool:


    How many validly consecrated bishops are there?
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline OHCA

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #6 on: September 27, 2013, 06:22:11 PM »
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  • I had never heard of sedevacantists until I found CI.  When I first heard of it, my position was that would necessarily mean that the gates of hell had prevailed.  I read some further information about it.  I became convinced that a heretic cannot be pope and there is considerable evidence that the Vat II popes have been heretics.  Also I think the Siri conspiracy that everybody quickly dismisses as nutty sounds quite plausible.  And there are provisions for the election of a pope in crisis scenarios.  I now understand that the sedevacantism doesn't mean the gates of hell have prevailed.

    I am not a theologian and am not comfortable saying that the sedevacantists position is definitely correct.  But neither am I comfortable saying that what we have had for "popes" (especially the current) are definitely popes.  I am leaning heavily toward thinking that the sedevacantists position is correct and am now at peace with it if that's the case--the Lord is still in charge even if we are in a sedevacantists position and he will provide according to His will and according to His time.  Meanwhile I assist at a valid Mass with a valid priest, though I cringe a little that we use the 1962 missal and I cringe a little when we pray for the intentions of the Holy Father, especially when his name is articulated with the crispness & clarity bespeaking complete confidence.

    Offline Binechi

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #7 on: September 27, 2013, 06:34:26 PM »
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  • It sounds like you are attending a SSPX Mass.  The SSpx and sedevicantism are like oil and water.  The Sede s leave out the name of the Pope in the Canon, as I understand it.
    You might have to do a little more soul searching to find what position you want to hold.. Prayer is the best route in my opinion.

    Good luck


    Offline 2Vermont

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #8 on: September 27, 2013, 06:42:15 PM »
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  • Quote from: Director
    It sounds like you are attending a SSPX Mass.  The SSpx and sedevicantism are like oil and water.  The Sede s leave out the name of the Pope in the Canon, as I understand it.
    You might have to do a little more soul searching to find what position you want to hold.. Prayer is the best route in my opinion.

    Good luck


    I'm not even an SSPXer.  I only have a NO church with a weekly TLM celebrated by a VII priest.  Right now, I'm leaning towards not even attending the latter.

    But you're right.  I'm not sure yet where I stand.  That's why I was hoping this thread would be helpful.
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline Binechi

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #9 on: September 27, 2013, 06:48:34 PM »
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  • Are you in USA, and if so , what part of the country.

    Offline 2Vermont

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #10 on: September 27, 2013, 06:54:04 PM »
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  • Quote from: Director
    Are you in USA, and if so , what part of the country.


    See my Screenname...lol
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)


    Offline Binechi

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #11 on: September 27, 2013, 06:57:43 PM »
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  • How far up from Mass ?

    Offline 2Vermont

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #12 on: September 27, 2013, 07:02:49 PM »
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  • Quote from: Director
    How far up from Mass ?


    We are hours from any valid mass in MA or any other state.  We are hoping to attend Mass and Confession in NY at some point.

    I found this chapel:

    https://www.google.com/#q=Sacred+Heart/Our+Lady+of+Mount+Carmel+Shrine%2c+Hudson%2c+ny

    (click on second result)

     
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline songbird

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #13 on: September 27, 2013, 07:40:14 PM »
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  • Vatican I which needs to be read or understood, explains how one is to nominate a cardinal to pope.  Pope is defined and it is said, in Vatican I that a manifest nominee can not be a nominee, can not be pope.  A Catholic nominee for Pope.

    Chapter 12 of Daniel explains and is in translation of the Church, that his " continual" Precious Blood, the  Mass will come to an end and for how long- 3 and a half years.  If God/Christ set thing in place, then to put them back is not impossible with God.

    The Gates of Hell shall not prevail, true, Christ's Precious Blood is "eternal".  The Bible explains to us what is coming.

    Offline Binechi

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    What keeps us from taking the leap?
    « Reply #14 on: September 28, 2013, 09:21:33 AM »
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  • Quote from: 2Vermont
    Quote from: Director
    How far up from Mass ?


    We are hours from any valid mass in MA or any other state.  We are hoping to attend Mass and Confession in NY at some point.

    I found this chapel:

    https://www.google.com/#q=Sacred+Heart/Our+Lady+of+Mount+Carmel+Shrine%2c+Hudson%2c+ny

    (click on second result)

     


    Need to question the Priest s, and who the
    Bishop is , and then check him out.  One has a right to question

    Looks like a No to me  ??  Nice looking old bldg., Nice to be a church. with all that old world stained glass