Author Topic: What is the JOINT DECLARATION ON THE DOCTRINE OF JUSTIFICATION? (Read 1376 times)

holysoulsacademy · « **on:** April 09, 2014, 12:36:49 AM »

When did this JOINT DECLARATION ON THE DOCTRINE OF JUSTIFICATION come out?

I honestly don't understand what all this means?
Is he really preparing to canonize Luther?
So, let's say we are willing to accept SSPX's position regarding the upcoming canonizations of Wojtyla & Roncali, how will they explain Luther's?

Mithrandylan · « **Reply #1 on:** April 09, 2014, 12:40:24 AM »

About fifteen years ago, I believe. Late nineties.

Look up the Balamand Declaration. That's a little over twenty years old. "The Church" promises not to convert Eastern Schismatics, among other things.

holysoulsacademy · « **Reply #2 on:** April 09, 2014, 12:48:04 AM »

Quote from: holysoulsacademy

When did this JOINT DECLARATION ON THE DOCTRINE OF JUSTIFICATION come out?

I honestly don't understand what all this means?
Is he really preparing to canonize Luther?
So, let's say we are willing to accept SSPX's position regarding the upcoming canonizations of Wojtyla & Roncali, how will they explain Luther's?

Here's the link to JOINT DECLARATION ON THE DOCTRINE OF JUSTIFICATION

Quote from: Mithrandylan

About fifteen years ago, I believe. Late nineties.

Look up the Balamand Declaration. That's a little over twenty years old. "The Church" promises not to convert Eastern Schismatics, among other things.

Here's the link to Balamand Declaration

It seems I have quite a bit of reading to do.

:reading: :reading: :reading:

poche · « **Reply #3 on:** April 09, 2014, 02:28:59 AM »

No one is preparing to canonize Luther. The point of all this is to lead the Lutherans into making a profession of the Faith into the Catholic Church.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #4 on:** April 09, 2014, 09:10:44 AM »

Quote from: poche

No one is preparing to canonize Luther. The point of all this is to lead the Lutherans into making a profession of the Faith into the Catholic Church.

But what it amounts to is having Catholics making a profession of Faith in Lutheranism. It completely caves on Tent's dogmatic teaching on justification regarding the need for the cooperation of the will for justification (which, related to BoD, is what Trent intended to teach with the votum passage).

Ladislaus · « **Reply #5 on:** April 09, 2014, 09:12:26 AM »

That Bishop Tony Palmer guy quoted from this to say that there's no need to "protest" anymore (i.e. to be Protestant) because the Catholics had come around to their way of thinking regarding salvation by faith alone.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #6 on:** April 09, 2014, 09:41:02 AM »

This is absolutely heretical:

Quote from: Joint Declaration on Justification

Together we confess: By grace alone, in faith in Christ's saving work and not because of any merit on our part, we are accepted by God and receive the Holy Spirit, who renews our hearts while equipping and calling us to good works.

All people are called by God to salvation in Christ. Through Christ alone are we justified, when we receive this salvation in faith. Faith is itself God's gift through the Holy Spirit who works through word and sacrament in the community of believers and who, at the same time, leads believers into that renewal of life which God will bring to completion in eternal life.

This is a heretical denial of Trent's dogmatic teaching on justification and a vindication of Protestantism.

holysoulsacademy · « **Reply #7 on:** April 09, 2014, 09:53:47 AM »

Quote from: Ladislaus

This is absolutely heretical:

Quote from: Joint Declaration on Justification
Together we confess: By grace alone, in faith in Christ's saving work and not because of any merit on our part, we are accepted by God and receive the Holy Spirit, who renews our hearts while equipping and calling us to good works.

All people are called by God to salvation in Christ. Through Christ alone are we justified, when we receive this salvation in faith. Faith is itself God's gift through the Holy Spirit who works through word and sacrament in the community of believers and who, at the same time, leads believers into that renewal of life which God will bring to completion in eternal life.

This is a heretical denial of Trent's dogmatic teaching on justification and a vindication of Protestantism.

Dear Lad,
What exactly is Trent's teaching on justification?
I am truly getting confused.

I am understanding that we are saved by His dying on the cross, and not by our faith. IOW, it is not our belief that saves us, although our belief brings us towards salvation.

Am I making sense?

Ladislaus · « **Reply #8 on:** April 09, 2014, 10:01:13 AM »

Trent teaches that justification happens as a COOPERATION between grace and free will (i.e. works) This declaration says that justification happens by "grace alone", which then predisposes or "calls" us towards "good works". No, even in the act of justification, the will must cooperate with the grace in order to make it happen. This has us being passively "accepted by God" through "grace alone". It's Protestantism in a nutshell and a total capitulation by the Roman Modernists.

Nishant · « **Reply #9 on:** April 09, 2014, 10:20:44 AM »

To be saved, Trent teaches that two things are necessary. Justification, which is the translation to the state of grace. And, perseverance in the justice received or the state of grace until the end of life.

Post justification or baptism, good works are indispensably necessary because "the justice received is preserved and also increased before God through good works". Yet, no one can perform a meritorious work without the actual grace of God preceding and assisting, to wit, God "continually infuses strength into those justified, which strength always precedes, accompanies and follows their good works."

So, those who neglect good works will be more likely to fall away completely, whereas those who perform good works, as St. Peter says and Trent quotes "Labor the more, that by good works you may make sure your calling and election." St. Paul and others show the real possibility of falling away after being really justified, which Trent quotes as proof, "I therefore so run, not as at an uncertainty; I so fight, not as one beating the air, but I chastise my body and bring it into subjection; lest perhaps when I have preached to others, I myself should become a castaway."

The prime heresy of Protestantism was the notion of imputed justice or righteousness. Thus the justice of Christ is not infused into us, but is only imputed, and for this reason can neither be increased or lost. Thus, "once saved, always saved", good works are nothing more than fruits of justification and other heresies.

"If anyone says that ... that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, let him be anathema"

If anyone says that a man once justified can sin no more, nor lose grace, and that therefore he that falls and sins was never truly justified ... let him be anathema."

bowler · « **Reply #10 on:** April 09, 2014, 10:30:31 AM »

Quote from: Ladislaus

Trent teaches that justification happens as a COOPERATION between grace and free will (i.e. works) This declaration says that justification happens by "grace alone", which then predisposes or "calls" us towards "good works". No, even in the act of justification, the will must cooperate with the grace in order to make it happen. This has us being passively "accepted by God" through "grace alone". It's Protestantism in a nutshell and a total capitulation by the Roman Modernists.

All our good works come from God's grace. Without God's grace we could not perform any good works. All our good thoughts come from God's grace. When we die, we will know what little we actually did to save ourselves, it may be as little as inclining ourselves 0.0010% toward God and He did the rest (by giving us the Grace), HOWEVER, we did do something to save ourselves. We were not just robots.

The Lutherans take what I just wrote, and say that we do NOTHING of our own, that it ALL comes from God's Grace. That heresy is akin to the Arian Heresy, where they said that Christ was God, however, that He was 1/10 of one hair away from the Father.

songbird · « **Reply #11 on:** April 09, 2014, 10:36:09 AM »

There was a web site on this but I lost it. It was in chapters. The idea is globalization, pluralism and false ecuмenism by the year 2017? the anniversary of the split of the Church and Luther and his 92 thesis. Anyway, it is to me the One World religion idea. I hope to find this site again. It had the same orange background. I liked that reading alot more. It declared that religions are less in this part of the world and more over here. We need to form. People have forgotten the past and it needs to be interpreted for us and etc. A Common Faith is the goal of WHO! That is right, the World council of churches, the Secret Societies.

songbird · « **Reply #12 on:** April 09, 2014, 11:19:00 AM »

I found it! I googled: It is "From conflict to Communion Luther-Catholic Common Commemoration of the Reformation in 2017. Very interesting!

Charlemagne · « **Reply #13 on:** April 09, 2014, 11:31:14 AM »

Quote from: poche

No one is preparing to canonize Luther. The point of all this is to lead the Lutherans into making a profession of the Faith into the Catholic Church.

You never disappoint, poche!

poche · « **Reply #14 on:** April 09, 2014, 10:56:38 PM »

Quote from: Charlemagne

Quote from: poche
No one is preparing to canonize Luther. The point of all this is to lead the Lutherans into making a profession of the Faith into the Catholic Church.

You never disappoint, poche!

Laugh now but remember, the true home of all the Christians is within the Catholic Church.
:cool: :cool: :cool: