Vatican, Lutherans Preparing Docuмent on Reformation
Pope's Trip to Homeland Will Have Ecuмenical Focus

ROME, AUG. 30, 2011 (Zenit.org).- According to the Vatican official on ecuмenism, the Church and the World Lutheran Federation are preparing a Joint Declaration on the Reformation, in view of the 500th anniversary of Martin Luther's 95 Theses.

Cardinal Kurt Koch, president of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity, announced this in an interview with the German Catholic agency KNA.

In this context, Vatican Radio reported Monday that Benedict XVI wants his Sept. 22-25 trip to Germany to have an ecuмenical focus.

The Catholic-Lutheran docuмent will "analyze the Reformation in the light of 2,000 years of Christianity," noted Vatican Radio.

"The joint commemoration of this anniversary could be the occasion for a mutual mea culpa," the report suggested. For Cardinal Koch, "a common purification of the memory" is necessary.

During his trip to Germany, Benedict XVI will visit Erfurt, where Luther carried out part of his studies. Cardinal Koch said that it was the Pope himself who wished to give this trip a notable ecuмenical dimension.

Benedict XVI's third trip to his native land has as its motto "Where There Is God, There Is a Future." The trip will also include stops in Berlin, Etzelsbach and Freiburg im Breisgau.

For her part, German Chancellor Angela Merkel, the daughter of a Protestant pastor, pointed out that Benedict XVI's trip encourages "convergence and solidarity between Christians and present-day society."

Intense preparation

In fact, to prepare his trip to Germany, the Pope held a meeting of more than three hours Aug. 13 with an official delegation of the German episcopate, made up of the archbishop of Munich and Freising, Cardinal Reinhard Marx; the president of the episcopal conference, Archbishop Robert Zollitsch; and the bishops of Osnabruck and Essen, Bishop Franz-Josef Hermann Bode and Bishop Franz-Josef Overbeck, respectively.

The meeting took place "in a profound spirit of fraternity," according to Vatican Radio, and the Pope and prelates shared a meal together.

In a communiqué published on the meeting, the German bishops explained that they informed Benedict XVI about a process of national dialogue established by the Church in Germany. This program involves some 300 lay and religious Catholic leaders, who are reflecting on faith and the future of the Church. The initiative was proposed in the fall of 2010, and the first meeting took place last month.

The bishops said the Holy Father was very interested in this program, saying that it could be an important impulse for the future of the Church. Benedict XVI pointed out that this dialogue is a spiritual path of renewal and he encouraged the German bishops to continue. The Holy Father also stressed the link that should be established with the 50th anniversary of the Second Vatican Council.

Program

The Pontiff will begin his trip on Sept. 22 in the German capital. That day he will meet with Merkel and President Christian Wulff. He will also have a meeting with the Jєωιѕн community, and celebrate a public Mass.

The next day he will meet with representatives of the Muslim community. Then he will go to Erfurt, in Thuringia, to the places where Luther lived.

After visiting St. Mary's Cathedral, he will meet with representatives of the German Evangelical Church Council and then take part in an ecuмenical celebration in the church of the Augustinians' convent in Erfurt.

In the afternoon, the Pope will go to the shrine of the Virgin of Etzelsbach, where he will preside over vespers. That night he will return to Erfurt.

On Saturday, Sept. 24, he will preside over Mass at 9 A.M. in the Domplatz of Erfurt. In the afternoon, he will go to Freiburg: Here, after visiting the cathedral and greeting the citizens, he will meet with former Chancellor Helmut Kohl.

Later he will hold three meetings: with the representatives of the Orthodox Churches, with seminarians and with the Council of the Central Committee of German Catholics. That night he will take part in a vigil with young people.

On Sunday, Sept. 25, the Pontiff will celebrate Mass and pray the midday Angelus in Freiburg. After lunching with the members of the German Episcopal Conference, he will meet with the judges of the Federal Constitutional Court and with Catholics involved in the Church and in society.

The farewell ceremony will take place at 6:45 P.M. in the Lahr airport, before the return flight to Castel Gandolfo that night.

"Mutual mea culpas"? What on earth does the Pope have to apologize for? Rabid heretics causing social chaos, violence, and loss of souls? The cleaving of Christendom? The precursor to rationalism and modernism? This is absurd.

What could the Church and Lutherans possibly jointly say about the "Reformation"? They see it as a triumph, us as a tragedy. Are they going to play nice and come up with some mushy joint statement talking about fraternity and mutual respect while completely overlooking the fact that Luther was an evil deranged heretic who started a bloody revolution and destruction of Catholic social order? Will the Pope rehabilitate Luther? If so he may as well rehabilitate Judas while he's at it.

This will simply encourage Lutherans to remain Lutheran as the Pope thinks Luther was ok after all. They will see the Pope not ONCE call for their conversion to the true Faith to save their soul and instead see him compliment and be friendly with their leaders.

Behavior like this can only come from a belief that all Christians are most probably saved and just as likely to go to Heaven in their heretical sect as the Catholic Church. Otherwise he would have a duty and obligation to tell them the Truth!

A Dominican priest was waiting or a bus.  A man comes up to him and says, "So, Father, why do you where that white robe?"  

The Dominican says, "I am a Dominican, and it is the habit of my order."

The man says, "I went to  Jesuit high school.  The priests there wore black.""

The Dominican nodded.

"So," the man asked, "What's the difference anyway?"  

The Dominican replied, "The Dominicans were founded in the 13th Century to combat Albigensianism.  The Jesuits were founded in the 16th century to combat Protestantism."

"I see" said the man.  "So, tell the truth, Father.  Which one do you think is better?"

"Well, the priest said, "You don't see any Albigensian churches around, do you?"

SO why aren't you a Sedevacantist?

Because I think it is absurd that Christ would abandon his Church for 50+ years with no visible head, make almost all bishops and priests orders invalid, and invalidate the sacraments for 99% of Catholics. Then the idea that some invisible smattering of Catholics is the Church with no hierarchy, and no means to resurrect itself is not believable to me. I think the whole train of thought is a blind alley. It removes sedes from all relevant discussion on the crisis and neutralizes them from making any real change in Rome. As I've said before, I think it is a trick of the devil. No offense, but that's my opinion. In addition sede-ism produces rotten fruit. Constant squabbling and bickering between different branches, the SGG mess, no obedience to any authority, the constant derisive polemics against other Trads, the conclavists, etc.

Despite all of the killed trees in defense of sedevacantism, it can find no historical precedent and fails to conclusively prove that the modern day Popes are not Popes. It is nothing more than a speculative theory that some accept as fact. Barring inarguable proof that the current Popes are not Popes, I'll stay on the more prudent side of the fence ala ABL.

There already is a perfect docuмent concerning this.

Bull Decet Romanum Pontificem, Leo X Pont Max, 1521.

The devil always attacks the greatest soldiers of Christ.  Look at what was done to Jesuits.  No attacks are needed on the conciliar church since it damages itself.

Quote from: Gregory I

SO why aren't you a Sedevacantist?

Because I think it is absurd that Christ would abandon his Church for 50+ years with no visible head, make almost all bishops and priests orders invalid, and invalidate the sacraments for 99% of Catholics.

I'll ask this question again since I never get an answer.

Why do you want to blame Christ for abandoning His Church rather than the Churchmen for abandoning Christ?

When nearly 95% of all bishops abandoned Christ for Arianism, why is it so impossible that 99% of all bishops would abandon Christ today for Modernism?  After all, Modernism is a much easier religion to follow than Arianism was as there is very little in the way of discipline.