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Author Topic: Thuc-line priests?  (Read 5424 times)

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Offline Incredulous

Re: Thuc-line priests?
« Reply #45 on: November 22, 2021, 08:27:27 AM »
Quote from: Stanley N on November 19, 2021, 12:51:50 PM
Fr. Peter Scott identifies "lesser reasons". Doubts can vary in strength.

That FAQ page is very old and Fr. Peter Scott is generally viewed as "old school".
I believe bishop de Castro Mayer said much the same thing - who would have known better than des Lauriers.

Still, it would appear the old SSPX viewed the Thuc-line clergy as questionable.


In hindsight, after reading different "old school" SSPX docuŠ¼ents and articles, I feel the Society had a political motivation from the beginning.

They were carving out their traditional Catholic market, establishing their reputation with the intent to dominate the movement. 
They would not hesitate to to take a swipe at honest critics and traditional priestly competition.

The SSPX historically uses labels and code words to indoctrinate their faithful and demean their enemies and competition. 
("schismatic, sede-vacantist, anti-semitic and even now, biblicists and anti-vax conspiracy theorist").

Granted, Archbishop Thuc made a lot of mistakes and was clearly taken advantage of.
Consider that he had pitted himself against the madness and confusion of the whole Novus ordo world.

Lastly, in Father Scott's Thuc arguments, he uses the term "schismatic". 

In hindsight, we can now say with confidence that newChurch IS the "false throne" spoken of in Pope Leo XIII's St. Michael's prayer. 

Excerpt:

"These most crafty enemies have filled and inebriated with gall and bitterness the Church, the Spouse of the Immaculate Lamb, and have laid impious hands on her most sacred possessions. In the Holy Place itself, where has been set up the See of the most holy Peter and the Chair of Truth for the light of the world, they have raised the throne of their abominable impiety, with the iniquitous design that when the Pastor has been struck, the sheep may be scattered."

It would ultimately mean that the schismatic term was used incorrectly and that the SSPX's recent mission to unite with the "False Throne" is truly misguided.
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Offline Puzzle

Re: Thuc-line priests?
« Reply #46 on: November 22, 2021, 08:33:38 AM »
Quote from: Stanley N on November 19, 2021, 11:53:17 AM


Are the Masses of Thuc-line priests valid, and can we attend them?

My 2 cents....

The simple answer is "maybe".  

Validity of ordination is not the end all.  

Consider Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer.  He is valid.  Would you want to go anywhere near his cult, his santeria-worshipping pfeiffer-appointed "lay-exorcist" "chief-in-charge"?  Probably not.

There are many Thuc-line priests and bishops whose mass I would attend and receive sacraments from without hesitation.  There are many I wouldn't. 
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Offline Last Tradhican

Re: Thuc-line priests?
« Reply #47 on: November 22, 2021, 08:44:06 AM »
Excellent thread. Thanks to all the contributors.
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Offline Ladislaus

  • Supporter
Re: Thuc-line priests?
« Reply #48 on: November 22, 2021, 10:58:08 AM »
Quote from: Puzzle on November 22, 2021, 08:33:38 AM
Consider Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer.  He is valid.

That's debatable.  We have video proof that Bishop Webster originally mangled the essential form of the consecration to where it was unrecognizable.  He's certainly a valid priest.

I knew Bishop Webster very well, and I like him a great deal.  And I hold most of the +Thuc lines to be valid.  But this one poses some real problems.  If Fr. Pfeiffer were to produce the video of the conditional that was allegedly done later, that might change things.  But he hasn't.  And given how bad the first attempt was, and Father Pfeiffer's assertion that it was valid anyway, we can't simply take his word that the second attempt was any better.  Also, I don't know if you can just repeat the essential form in isolation of the entire ceremony and all the surrounding context and have that be valid.
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Offline SeanJohnson

Re: Thuc-line priests?
« Reply #49 on: November 22, 2021, 12:11:48 PM »
From Bishop Williamson (excerpted from an email):

"I have heard it before.

The Archbishop was a competent theologian, and scrupulous about ceremonies and ceremonial. Little is less likely than that he would have confused the one hand of the diaconate with the two hands of the priesthood."


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