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Offline Santo Subito

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  • http://chiesa.espresso.repubblica.it/articolo/1349995?eng=y

    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI

    "I will do everything I can to make a syncretistic or relativistic interpretation of the event impossible." In a letter from the pope to a Lutheran pastor, the real reason for the convocation of the encounter

    by Sandro Magister

    ROME, October 26, 2011 – The following is an extract from a letter written by Benedict XVI on March 4, 2011 to Lutheran pastor Peter Beyerhaus, a longtime friend who had told him about his fears over the new convocation of the day of Assisi:

    "I understand very well," the pope writes, "your concern about participating in the encounter of Assisi. But this commemoration would have been celebrated in any case, and, in the end, it seemed to me the best thing to go there personally, in order to try to determine the overall direction. Nonetheless, I will do everything I can to make a syncretistic or relativistic interpretation of the event impossible, and to make it clear that I will always believe and confess what I had called the Church's attention to with 'Dominus Iesus'."

    This is the original German of the passage from the letter:

    "Ihre Sorge angesichts meiner Teilnahme an dem Assisi-Jubiläum verstehe ich sehr gut. Aber dieses Gedenken mußte auf jeden Fall gefeiert werden, und nach allem Überlegen erschien es mir als das Beste, wenn ich selbst dort hingehe und damit versuchen kann, die Richtung des Ganzen zu bestimmen. Jedenfalls werde ich alles tun, damit eine synkretistische oder relativistische Auslegung des Vorgangs unmöglich wird und klar bleibt, daß ich weiterhin das glaube und bekenne, was ich als Schreiben 'Dominus Jesus' der Kirche in Erinnerung gerufen hatte."

    These never-before-seen words from pope Joseph Ratzinger were made public last October 1, with the authorization of the recipient of the letter, Pastor Beyerhaus, at the beginning of a conference organized in Rome by the association "Catholica Spes" on the meaning of the encounter in Assisi.

    And previously, Beyerhaus had referred to it in an interview with the German newspaper "Kirchliche Umschau" last April.

    But the matter went unnoticed. Only on the eve of the October 27 encounter was it revisited and reissued by a few traditionalist websites.

    One of the speakers at the conference was Cardinal Raymond Leo Burke, prefect of the supreme tribunal of the apostolic signatura, who said among other things:

    "There are a number of dangers that such an encounter could bring in terms of the mass media communication of the event, of which – as it is clear – the pontiff is well aware. The means of mass media communication will say, even with the images alone, that all religions have come together to ask God for peace. A poorly formed Christian could draw from this the gravely mistaken conclusion that one religion is as good as another, and that Jesus Christ is one of the many mediators of salvation."

    For an overview of the day to be celebrated tomorrow in Assisi, see the following article from www.chiesa:

    Offline Telesphorus

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #1 on: November 06, 2011, 05:47:25 PM »
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  • Quote
    A poorly formed Christian could draw from this the gravely mistaken conclusion that one religion is as good as another


    For example, the mass of people who go to NO masses are poorly formed because they go to NO masses and hear the sermons there.

    Double talk from the double tongued.


    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #2 on: November 06, 2011, 06:08:16 PM »
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  • Actions speak louder than words.

    Ratzinger could say he will make sure the Traditional Latin Mass is said in all churches for all time, and say he will abolish the Vatican II council's teachings.... BUT if he still lets the church continue on as it is doing without enforcing his words, he is worthless.

    Which is exactly what is going on here.


    Nice try , you serpent you, Santo Subito.

    Offline Telesphorus

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #3 on: November 06, 2011, 06:58:27 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    And it was just a pilgrimage. Why cannot the Pope walk with non-Christians in a friendly manner and support peace together? Have you seen any news reports which confuse this with syncrenism? If not, maybe you shouldn't jump to conclusions


    Your approval of false worship in a Catholic venue under the auspices of the so-called Pope proves the contempt you have for the First Commandment.  You have already argued that God can accept idolatry.  You are a vile apologist for religious indifferentism.  Catholics don't call upon St. John the Baptist to protect Islam, and they don't pray in Mosques, showing approval for false worship.

    You really shouldn't be tolerated on this forum, truth and error don't deserve the same rights, the same venues.  This forum is for Catholics, not for indifferentists.

    Offline Telesphorus

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #4 on: November 06, 2011, 07:02:07 PM »
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  • If the "Pope" really doesn't approve of religious indifferentism and sycretism, he should tell those present that they must convert to Catholicism or they face damnation.

    But he's interested in praising Luther, etc, and if his words "Never before seen" - it's entirely his fault.

    People to whom words mean nothing will call agnostics "Pilgrims of Truth" They will pretend to adhere to all the dogmas of the Church but they prove by their actions they have simply redefined all the terms so as to tolerate and accept any belief.  And their actions prove that that is what they do.


    Offline Telesphorus

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #5 on: November 06, 2011, 07:48:11 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    Sorry Telesphorus but you don't pay attention to arguments you just talk. So let me redirect this discussion to good Catholic question.  The SSPX said they were going to say 1000 masses in reparation for Assisi III. I don't agree with them, but it got me thinking: if Jesus's sacrifice was perfectly sufficient in itself, why do we offer masses in reparation. "Applying the fruits of the sacrifice" is one thing, but reparation is another. How do we as fellow Catholics explain this? How many times does the Father have to receive the same sacrifice??


    This proves you don't have a Catholic theology of the mass.




    Offline Telesphorus

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #6 on: November 06, 2011, 07:50:22 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    And look up the word "Islam" on the internet. The first definition is "the people of the Muslim faith". John Paul II asked St. John to protect the people of that faith from evils


    You approve the Pope calling on the greatest Catholic prophet to protect an anti-Catholic movement follows a false prophet and that rejects Christ because you're an indifferentist who approves of idolatry and false worship and pretends they can be pleasing to God.

    Real Catholics tell non-Catholics they must convert.  False Catholics call on Catholic saints to protect anti-Catholic religions.


    Offline Telesphorus

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #7 on: November 06, 2011, 07:53:15 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    I haven't found an answer to that question that satisfied me. Catholic should always deepen their understanding of their faith.


    You mean you don't believe in Catholic theology.  If you don't believe in masses offered in reparation you're not Catholic.


    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #8 on: November 06, 2011, 07:55:56 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    I haven't found an answer to that question that satisfied me. Catholic should always deepen their understanding of their faith.



    And there, sir, is your problem. The answer is not supposed to satisfy you , primarily. It should be assented to as truth, and if you don't "feel" it, then your feelings need to change.

    Just saying it how it is.

    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #9 on: November 06, 2011, 07:57:53 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    He prayed that the PEOPLE be protected from EVIL.



    People who are willingly choosing to worship evil cannot be protected from evil.  Thus all the stories and accounts of people who worship the devil, or do seances, or Ouiji board junk etc etc become demonically oppressed/possessed and experience symptoms of such.

    What sort of world do you live in? I seriously wonder, when I hear people like you speak its almost as if their brains were checked-in at the door.

    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #10 on: November 06, 2011, 08:00:07 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    I believe in it, but I have trouble understanding that one point. Why can't you ever give a charitable interpretation of someone's statement? You JUDGE OUR HOLINESS THE POPE?

    Why don't you answer my mass question that

    And did you look up that verse in Acts or not?



    No one is judging your holiness the Pope. All sedevacantists do is recognize who he is not, and go off that. We aren't going to his door step with a paper judgment against his so-called reign to the papacy.

    Ipso facto one is removed from their office by heresy, anyways...with or without proclamation by any Church official. Do you know of the SSPV, CMRI, or independent chapels that have been existing ever since Vatican II bloomed? They are places of safety in this storm of evil that has been rocking the world for 50 years now.


    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #11 on: November 06, 2011, 08:01:13 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    Quote from: PartyIsOver221
    Quote from: aquinasg
    I haven't found an answer to that question that satisfied me. Catholic should always deepen their understanding of their faith.



    And there, sir, is your problem. The answer is not supposed to satisfy you , primarily. It should be assented to as truth, and if you don't "feel" it, then your feelings need to change.

    Just saying it how it is.


    Its not about feelings, it about reason. I assent to it but don't understand it perfectly. Why don't you explain it



    What are you asking?

    Offline Telesphorus

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #12 on: November 06, 2011, 08:03:18 PM »
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  • It shouldn't be surprising that people who approve of false worship approve of calling on saints to protect the worshippers of a false religion, and confirming them in that religion, by suggesting St. John the Baptist will protect them in that false worship.  What's surprising is that they call themselves Catholic.  No true Catholic could ever do that.  No quibbling over words can change that.  It's false Christianity.  It's indifferentism.


    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #13 on: November 06, 2011, 08:04:00 PM »
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  • Quote from: aquinasg
    Go back and read my question


    You asked so many questions, and your posts have been jumbled, I'm not really sure what you are asking anymore.

    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The Truth about Assisi. Never-Before-Seen Words from Benedict XVI
    « Reply #14 on: November 06, 2011, 08:04:30 PM »
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  • And Tele, I really like your sig.


     

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