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Author Topic: The morphing of the Traditional Mass  (Read 1317 times)

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Offline parentsfortruth

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The morphing of the Traditional Mass
« on: May 29, 2011, 09:19:25 AM »
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  • So, it would seem that there are "new rules" for the "old rite" that are being implemented all over the country. I just heard from this lady in Illinois that said that the indult she's going to, run by the FSSP, is "incorporate the new Latin translations into my traditional" mass. Some of the most disturbing things in the  INSTRUCTION ON THE APPLICATION OF THE APOSTOLIC LETTER SUMMORUM PONTIFIcuм OF HIS HOLINESS BENEDICT XVI GIVEN MOTU PROPRIO

    Here's the link. I found it with digging. http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_commissions/ecclsdei/docuмents/rc_com_ecclsdei_doc_20110430_istr-universae-ecclesiae_en.html

    11. After having received the approval from the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments, the Pontifical Commission Ecclesia Dei will have the task of looking after future editions of liturgical texts pertaining to the forma extraordinaria of the Roman Rite.

    (Um... what? So they're GOING to change the Tridentine Mass, even after the 1962, which everyone seems to think is fine.)

    19. The faithful who ask for the celebration of the forma extraordinaria must not in any way support or belong to groups which show themselves to be against the validity or legitimacy of the Holy Mass or the Sacraments celebrated in the forma ordinaria or against the Roman Pontiff as Supreme Pastor of the Universal Church.

    25. New saints and certain of the new prefaces can and ought to be inserted into the 1962 Missal, according to provisions which will be indicated subsequently.   :stare: (Really? "New Saints?" "Subsequently indicated?" REALLY?  :stare: Yet another indication that they're CHANGING the 1962 missal again.)

    26. As foreseen by article 6 of the Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificuм, the readings of the Holy Mass of the Missal of 1962 can be proclaimed either solely in the Latin language, or in Latin followed by the vernacular or, in Low Masses, solely in the vernacular. (Am I seeing this wrong? The Latin was ALWAYS to be done, with the elimination of the vernacular, but NEVER the elimination of the LATIN! ANOTHER CHANGE!)

    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,


    Offline parentsfortruth

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    The morphing of the Traditional Mass
    « Reply #1 on: May 29, 2011, 09:33:28 AM »
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  • They know now that they can't get rid of the Traditional Catholics, and so, they're going to try to do their version of "inculturation" on US!

    I wonder how many people are going to fall for this stuff, before it turns into the same thing as the Novus Ordo?

    Incrementalism worked when the Novus Ordo was implemented. Not everything changed all at once. My prediction is that they're going to do the same thing, slowly over time, until they have everyone right where they want them, like a spider in a web, and with people not paying attention and only worrying about excessive obedience, the spider will strike.

    For those of you that don't know that we're allowed to have the Missal of Pope Pius V, and NO OTHER, I'll link it. Please don't ever forget this.

    http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius05/p5quopri.htm

    When this work has been gone over numerous times and further emended, after serious study and reflection, We commanded that the finished product be printed and published as soon as possible, so that all might enjoy the fruits of this labor; and thus, priests would know which prayers to use and which rites and ceremonies they were required to observe from now on in the celebration of Masses.

    Let all everywhere adopt and observe what has been handed down by the Holy Roman Church, the Mother and Teacher of the other churches, and let Masses not be sung or read according to any other formula than that of this Missal published by Us. This ordinance applies henceforth, now, and forever, throughout all the provinces of the Christian world, to all patriarchs, cathedral churches, collegiate and parish churches, be they secular or religious, both of men and of women - even of military orders - and of churches or chapels without a specific congregation in which conventual Masses are sung aloud in choir or read privately in accord with the rites and customs of the Roman Church. This Missal is to be used by all churches, even by those which in their authorization are made exempt, whether by Apostolic indult, custom, or privilege, or even if by oath or official confirmation of the Holy See, or have their rights and faculties guaranteed to them by any other manner whatsoever.

    Furthermore, by these presents [this law], in virtue of Our Apostolic authority, We grant and concede in perpetuity that, for the chanting or reading of the Mass in any church whatsoever, this Missal is hereafter to be followed absolutely, without any scruple of conscience or fear of incurring any penalty, judgment, or censure, and may freely and lawfully be used. Nor are superiors, administrators, canons, chaplains, and other secular priests, or religious, of whatever title designated, obliged to celebrate the Mass otherwise than as enjoined by Us.We likewise declare and ordain that no one whosoever is forced or coerced to alter this Missal, and that this present docuмent cannot be revoked or modified, but remain always valid and retain its full force notwithstanding the previous constitutions and decrees of the Holy See, as well as any general or special constitutions or edicts of provincial or synodal councils, and notwithstanding the practice and custom of the aforesaid churches, established by long and immemorial prescription - except, however, if more than two hundred years' standing.

    Therefore, no one whosoever is permitted to alter this notice of Our permission, statute, ordinance, command, precept, grant, indult, declaration, will, decree, and prohibition. Should know that he will incur the wrath of Almighty God and of the Blessed Apostles Peter and Paul.

    So you know something, they might say they have "authority" over the 1962 Missal. Yes, indeed, but NOT OVER THE 1570 missal, nor will they EVER be able to change it. Even if they DID, WE would be UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO FOLLOW THOSE CHANGES. Says right here. Infallibly. From a Pope, and a Saint.
    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,


    Offline TKGS

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    The morphing of the Traditional Mass
    « Reply #2 on: May 29, 2011, 02:23:39 PM »
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  • Quote from: parentsfortruth
    (Um... what? So they're GOING to change the Tridentine Mass, even after the 1962, which everyone seems to think is fine.)


    I have to be the bearer of bad news, but the Tridentine Mass has already been changed by Benedict 16 when he created a new Good Friday Prayer for the Jєωs in 2008.

    If you worship at an indult Mass center, you've already been a part of a changed Tridentine Mass for four years.  The Missal of 1962 no longer exists in the Conciliar church.  It is the Missal of 2008.

    Offline parentsfortruth

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    The morphing of the Traditional Mass
    « Reply #3 on: May 29, 2011, 02:52:41 PM »
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  • Quote from: TKGS
    Quote from: parentsfortruth
    (Um... what? So they're GOING to change the Tridentine Mass, even after the 1962, which everyone seems to think is fine.)


    I have to be the bearer of bad news, but the Tridentine Mass has already been changed by Benedict 16 when he created a new Good Friday Prayer for the Jєωs in 2008.

    If you worship at an indult Mass center, you've already been a part of a changed Tridentine Mass for four years.  The Missal of 1962 no longer exists in the Conciliar church.  It is the Missal of 2008.


    Good point....

    And thank God I don't attend an "indult." I go to the second oldest independent traditional Church in the country. There was an "indult" put here to try to drag people away from our Church, but more than 35 years later, we're still here. :)
    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,

    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    The morphing of the Traditional Mass
    « Reply #4 on: May 29, 2011, 04:00:08 PM »
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  • I won't stand for these changes to the TLM. It was perfect the way it was, Benedict doesn't need to change it. But I guess that's what you get when you have a modernist Pope.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.


    Offline PartyIsOver221

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    The morphing of the Traditional Mass
    « Reply #5 on: May 30, 2011, 09:02:15 PM »
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  • Quote from: SpiritusSanctus
    I won't stand for these changes to the TLM. It was perfect the way it was, Benedict doesn't need to change it. But I guess that's what you get when you have a modernist Pope.


    Wheres the Pope? I don't see one.

      :wink:


    Offline parentsfortruth

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    The morphing of the Traditional Mass
    « Reply #7 on: May 31, 2011, 10:50:06 PM »
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  • Quote from: stevusmagnus
    Parents,

    Where have you been?

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Fr-Z-on-the-Ordinary-Form-Enriching-the-Extraordinary-Form

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Cardinal-Koch-Pope-Benedict-XVI-in-first-step-of-a-reform-of-the-reform

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/MP-Instruction-Released-Pope-Locks-Down-Bishops-Unfriendly-to-MP

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Popes-reform-of-the-reform-in-liturgy-to-continue-cardinal-says

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/The-Meaning-of-the-Instruction-Universae-Ecclesiae

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/SSPXs-Commentary-on-the-Instruction-Universae-Ecclesiae

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/SSPX-Is-the-New-Mass-Legitimate


    Stevus,

    I know there's lots of people COMMENTING on these things, as I have done here.

    Not one of those articles you cited actually had a LINK to the actual TEXT of the "new rules." I have provided that here, so that everyone can look at it THEMSELVES. I don't need a whole bunch of commentary to help me make my decision on stuff. Perhaps some do, but I don't. I see what the enemies of the Church are attempting to do, and in light of that knowledge, I form my opinions. I am doing what everyone else is doing in the links you provided, except I've provided the actual official docuмentation.

    I've been here, stevus, even though I haven't commented on every single blinking article you've cited. I reply to posts when I think my opinion might be interesting, hence, the reason you have 2,916 posts, and have been here since Feb 2009, and I have 1,384, and have been here since May 2008.

    "Where have I been?" I've been here, just haven't commented and posted when I didn't think it was relevant, or my opine had already been stated aptly by someone else.
    Matthew 5:37

    But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over and above these, is of evil.

    My Avatar is Fr. Hector Bolduc. He was a faithful parish priest in De Pere, WI,


    Offline stevusmagnus

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    The morphing of the Traditional Mass
    « Reply #8 on: May 31, 2011, 10:59:21 PM »
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  • Sorry. Didn't mean to offend you.

    So you disagree with Fr. Z that the NO will enrich the TLM?

    Kidding.  :laugh1:

    Does anyone else find it funny that there are ads for Jesuit vocations that pop up here?

    If the Jesuits knew their ads were on a Trad board they'd have a heart attack!