Author Topic: The Errors of Sedevacantism and Ecclesiastical Law (Read 2949 times)

MyrnaM · « **Reply #15 on:** June 05, 2011, 09:35:36 PM »

Quote from: Caminus

Quote from: MyrnaM
Quote from: SpiritusSanctus
Myrna thinks Salza is still a secret mason, apparently. I do not think he is still involved in Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ. Do you really think Freemasons would let someone reveal all their secrets and beliefs in the form of criticism?

Your right SS, the Masons wouldn't stand for it, and many have been murdered for less than what he supposed disclosed. Of course he is still a Mason, continuing to destroy the Faith of Catholics.

The devil is very clever and will try to sway anyone they could from the sedevacantist position, because the devil hates the truth.

Salza, he discloses his own sins, he doesn't need any help from me.

Ah, the internet, where the birds of all colors meet to calumniate. This from one who thought she could be considered a Successor to the Apostles. The fact that your sins are hidden makes you worse. You'll be known as the pious fraud from now on, your conversion a mere pretense. If you are free to destroy a man's reputation at your slightest whim, then you should afford others to do the same to you. It's only fair, isn't it?

Be my guest and destroy me!

I fear no one but God.

I am not afraid of the truth, my sins will be known to all man on Judgement Day, for this is the way God will show His true Mercy and Justice. It is the Will of God.
Yes, my sins are many. My mistakes are many also. God knows the difference.

Take your advice from a Freemason if you will, and wonder why you can't see the facts, such as a heretic can not be a Pope.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #16 on:** June 05, 2011, 09:42:31 PM »

Quote from: SpiritusSanctus

Do you have any proof that he is still a mason? Because otherwise, it would be hard to believe he is still a mason and yet criticizes his own religion! And no offense towards you or your beliefs, but the sedevacantist position has never been proven as true. It's Traditional Catholicism that the devil tries to sway people away from. Once a person discovers Traditional Catholicism, I doubt the devil gives a flip whether or not they think we have a Pope. His main goal is to turn people away from the Church God established. Trads aren't going to be judged on whether or not they are a sedevacantist.

The proof is the Masons let him get away with Criticizing his own religion. (Mason) The average person will think, now this guy was a Mason and speaks the truth of how they operate, therefore when he speaks out against the Sedevacantist we must believe him. The devil is very clever SS.

SS you too admited his religion is Masonic when you posted above in the bolded portion.

The sedevacantist position doesn't need to prove anything, the fact are a Modernist can not be a pope. If you or anyone prefer to believe that a Modernist can be a pope you might be sinning against the Holy Ghost. A sin much worse than the wrath of Caminus.

Caminus · « **Reply #17 on:** June 05, 2011, 09:50:03 PM »

Quote

I fear no one but God.

If you truly feared God you would not so hastily break His Law. Let me make something perfectly clear, Sedevacantism is not a religion.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #18 on:** June 05, 2011, 10:23:54 PM »

Sedevacantist is the belief that the Chair of Peter is empty at this moment in time.

The religion I profess is Roman Catholic; like it Caminus or not.

Caminus · « **Reply #19 on:** June 05, 2011, 11:13:00 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Sedevacantist is the belief that the Chair of Peter is empty at this moment in time.

The religion I profess is Roman Catholic; like it Caminus or not.

It's not a "belief" its an opinion. And you can't restrict it to the Chair of Peter alone, but that is another issue. I recognize the fact that you profess the Catholic religion, but you have clearly just violated the precepts of charity and justice that this same religion demands of its adherents. I'll leave it at that.

s2srea · « **Reply #20 on:** June 06, 2011, 08:28:29 AM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

The proof is the Masons let him get away with Criticizing his own religion. (Mason) The average person will think, now this guy was a Mason and speaks the truth of how they operate, therefore when he speaks out against the Sedevacantist we must believe him. The devil is very clever SS.

SS you too admited his religion is Masonic when you posted above in the bolded portion.

The sedevacantist position doesn't need to prove anything, the fact are a Modernist can not be a pope. If you or anyone prefer to believe that a Modernist can be a pope you might be sinning against the Holy Ghost. A sin much worse than the wrath of Caminus.

You are acting very ignorant. I am ignorant, and am the first to say it. But suffice it to say you are acting very ignorant.

I would advise thinking a little bit longer before you post. If offense is taken, please consider I am stating an objective observation as I do not believe very few SVs would go along with your ridiculous calumnious void-of-fact comments Myrna.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #21 on:** June 06, 2011, 08:32:29 AM »

Quote

Related to OPINION
Synonyms: BELIEF, CONVICTION, EYE, FEELING, JUDGMENT (or JUDGEMENT), MIND, NOTION, PERSUASION, SENTIMENT, VERDICT, VIEW
Related Words: SAY; IMPRESSION, PERCEPTION, TAKE; ATTITUDE; ASSUMPTION, PRESUMPTION, PRESUPPOSITION; CONCLUSION, DECISION, DETERMINATION; DELIVERANCE, ESTEEM, ESTIMATE, ESTIMATION; CREDENCE, CREDIT, FAITH; CONCEPT, CONCEPTION, IDEA, THOUGHT; POSITION, STANCE, STAND; COMMENT, OBITER DICTUM, OBSERVATION, REFLECTION, REMARK; CONJECTURE, GUESS, HUNCH, HYPOTHESIS, SURMISE, THEORY; ADVICE, INPUT, RECOMMENDATION, SUGGESTION; ANGLE, OUTLOOK, PERSPECTIVE, SHOES, SLANT, STANDPOINT, VIEWPOINT; COUNTERVIEW
Near Antonyms: FACT, TRUTH
SEE ALL SYNONYMS AND ANTONYMS
MORE[-]HIDE

Synonym Discussion of OPINION
OPINION, VIEW, BELIEF, CONVICTION, PERSUASION, SENTIMENT mean a judgment one holds as true. OPINION implies a conclusion thought out yet open to dispute <each expert seemed to have a different opinion>. VIEW suggests a subjective opinion <very assertive in stating his views>. BELIEF implies often deliberate acceptance and intellectual assent <a firm belief in her party's platform>. CONVICTION applies to a firmly and seriously held belief <the conviction that animal life is as sacred as human>. PERSUASION suggests a belief grounded on assurance (as by evidence) of its truth <was of the persuasion that everything changes>. SENTIMENT suggests a settled opinion reflective of one's feelings <her feminist sentiments are well-known>.

For myself Sedevacantism is more than an opinion, it is my belief as above it is a deliberate acceptance and intellectual assent.
It is your opinion that sedevacantism is not correct, yet you can’t really bring yourself to believe that. Therefore it is not your belief.

An example of opinion/belief below:

Caminus said

Quote

but you have clearly just violated the precepts of charity and justice that this same religion demands of its adherents. I'll leave it at that.

You are selective as to who you rebuke here about the violation of charity, an inconsistency based on your opnion of that persons beliefs.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #22 on:** June 06, 2011, 08:38:01 AM »

Quote from: s2srea

Quote from: MyrnaM
The proof is the Masons let him get away with Criticizing his own religion. (Mason) The average person will think, now this guy was a Mason and speaks the truth of how they operate, therefore when he speaks out against the Sedevacantist we must believe him. The devil is very clever SS.

SS you too admited his religion is Masonic when you posted above in the bolded portion.

The sedevacantist position doesn't need to prove anything, the fact are a Modernist can not be a pope. If you or anyone prefer to believe that a Modernist can be a pope you might be sinning against the Holy Ghost. A sin much worse than the wrath of Caminus.

You are acting very ignorant. I am ignorant, and am the first to say it. But suffice it to say you are acting very ignorant.

I would advise thinking a little bit longer before you post. If offense is taken, please consider I am stating an objective observation as I do not believe very few SVs would go along with your ridiculous calumnious void-of-fact comments Myrna.

So this is all you can say on John Salza's defense?

s2srea · « **Reply #23 on:** June 06, 2011, 08:39:21 AM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

For myself Sedevacantism is more than an opinion, it is my belief as above it is a deliberate acceptance and intellectual assent.
It is your opinion that sedevacantism is not correct, yet you can’t really bring yourself to believe that. Therefore it is not your belief.

An example of opinion/belief below:

Caminus said
Quote
but you have clearly just violated the precepts of charity and justice that this same religion demands of its adherents. I'll leave it at that.

You are selective as to who you rebuke here about the violation of charity, an inconsistency based on your opnion of that persons beliefs.

Um... Myrna- maybe its because no one else was throwing out calumnious remarks with nothing to back them up except that "the proof is in the pudding." Sorry, but its a little hard to relate Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ and membership of someone who has declared they are a convert from it in it to pudding... Thats just calumny and it is a sin. See, thats what Caminus was trying to say. I believe (my opinion is) that he would have told anyone one that, sv or non-sv.

s2srea · « **Reply #24 on:** June 06, 2011, 08:42:17 AM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

So this is all you can say on John Salza's defense?

You really need to learn what caloumny and detraction is. Here:

Detraction is the unjust damaging of another's good name by the revelation of some fault or crime of which that other is really guilty or at any rate is seriously believed to be guilty by the defamer.

An important difference between detraction and calumny is at once apparent. The calumniator says what he knows to be false, whilst the detractor narrates what he at least honestly thinks is true. Detraction in a general sense is a mortal sin, as being a violation of the virtue not only of charity but also of justice. It is obvious, however, that the subject-matter of the accusation may be so inconspicuous or, everything considered, so little capable of doing serious hurt that the guilt is not assumed to be more than venial. The same judgment is to be given when, as not unfrequently happens, there has been little or no advertence to the harm that is being done.

Caminus · « **Reply #25 on:** June 06, 2011, 09:22:35 AM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Quote from: s2srea
Quote from: MyrnaM
The proof is the Masons let him get away with Criticizing his own religion. (Mason) The average person will think, now this guy was a Mason and speaks the truth of how they operate, therefore when he speaks out against the Sedevacantist we must believe him. The devil is very clever SS.

SS you too admited his religion is Masonic when you posted above in the bolded portion.

The sedevacantist position doesn't need to prove anything, the fact are a Modernist can not be a pope. If you or anyone prefer to believe that a Modernist can be a pope you might be sinning against the Holy Ghost. A sin much worse than the wrath of Caminus.

You are acting very ignorant. I am ignorant, and am the first to say it. But suffice it to say you are acting very ignorant.

I would advise thinking a little bit longer before you post. If offense is taken, please consider I am stating an objective observation as I do not believe very few SVs would go along with your ridiculous calumnious void-of-fact comments Myrna.

So this is all you can say on John Salza's defense?

Unbelievable. You completely fabricate a claim about someone, pulled out of thin air, without the slightest shred of evidence except because you say so, and then you demand proof that it is not the case when someone challenges your malicious absolutely baseless accusation. You need your head (and heart) checked.

And you shouldn't rely on loose synonyms when dealing with precise Catholic terminology.

ServusSpiritusSancti · « **Reply #26 on:** June 06, 2011, 09:28:37 AM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Quote from: SpiritusSanctus
Do you have any proof that he is still a mason? Because otherwise, it would be hard to believe he is still a mason and yet criticizes his own religion! And no offense towards you or your beliefs, but the sedevacantist position has never been proven as true. It's Traditional Catholicism that the devil tries to sway people away from. Once a person discovers Traditional Catholicism, I doubt the devil gives a flip whether or not they think we have a Pope. His main goal is to turn people away from the Church God established. Trads aren't going to be judged on whether or not they are a sedevacantist.

The proof is the Masons let him get away with Criticizing his own religion. (Mason) The average person will think, now this guy was a Mason and speaks the truth of how they operate, therefore when he speaks out against the Sedevacantist we must believe him. The devil is very clever SS.

SS you too admited his religion is Masonic when you posted above in the bolded portion.

The sedevacantist position doesn't need to prove anything, the fact are a Modernist can not be a pope. If you or anyone prefer to believe that a Modernist can be a pope you might be sinning against the Holy Ghost. A sin much worse than the wrath of Caminus.

No, I did not admit his religion is Masonic. I said if he was still a Mason then why would he criticize his own religion? Masons do not allow that. What makes you think that because he cuts down sedevacantism he must still be a Mason? The logic in that statement is way off.

Regarding the sedevacantist position, a modernist can in fact be a valid Pope. Now, I'm well are that neither a Freemason nor a ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ can be Pope, although you must make sure you have enough evidence to declare them as anti-pope for being Masonic or gαy. But I've never seen any proof that you can't be Pope if you're a modernist. And you say I MIGHT be sinning against God if I don't take the sede position. I have never in my life heard of someone being condemned because they thought a modernist was Pope. What matters is that you are a Traditional Catholic.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #27 on:** June 06, 2011, 09:42:08 AM »

SS, a Modernist is the mother of all heresies. Think about that!
I know Masons don't allow their members to disclose their religion, but John does it and gets away with it. Have you ever wondered why! Others have been found dead for that.

To the others here, just a note. A person does not become a 32 degree Mason just because he has the best smile at his lodge.

Trust him not!

Quote

Unbelievable. You completely fabricate a claim about someone, pulled out of thin air, without the slightest shred of evidence except because you say so, and then you demand proof that it is not the case when someone challenges your malicious absolutely baseless accusation. You need your head (and heart) checked.

And you shouldn't rely on loose synonyms when dealing with precise Catholic terminology.

You should read my note before you post, where am I demanding any proof, all I said was, is this all you can offer in Johns defense? Waiting .... :geezer:

At least you admit that sedevacantist is precise Catholic terminology, since this was the word in question about opinion vs belief.

ServusSpiritusSancti · « **Reply #28 on:** June 06, 2011, 04:53:06 PM »

Again Myrna, I fail to see how he is still a Mason. If he was, there's no way they'd let him get away with cutting down Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ. The reason he gets away with it is because he's not a member of Masonry anymore!

MyrnaM · « **Reply #29 on:** June 06, 2011, 10:58:02 PM »

SS, this isn't the first time you and I disagree, and it probably won't be the last time either.

I too fail to see, how a Modernist can be a pope.

Carry on!