Author Topic: the diamond bros  (Read 6452 times)

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Offline steelcross

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the diamond bros
« on: February 05, 2015, 09:11:26 AM »
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  • I heard and seen some of brother Michael diamond's videos and written material. Some of the things he says are interesting. However, does anyone know if he is a real brother, and if so what order does he belong to? God love you. †

    Offline TKGS

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #1 on: February 05, 2015, 10:54:49 AM »
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  • Some of what the Dimond Brothers publish is very good.  Some of what the Dimond Brothers publish is rubbish.  This is why the Dimond Brothers cannot be trusted.  Like EWTN, they mix the good with the bad and pronounce it all Catholic.  One has to know his faith very well to listen to them, otherwise one is likely to fall into the pit.  They are very vocal and claim an air of theological competence that is simply not present.

    Are they "real" brothers?  They claim to be Benedictine (I think) monks and have a monastery (which is their house).  I have never heard of authority under which they have established their monastery or taken vows, though their claims to this cannot be discounted due to the crisis in the Church.  

    I would not use them as an authority.


    Offline Matto

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #2 on: February 05, 2015, 12:14:45 PM »
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  • The Dimond brothers were my introduction to traditional Catholicism so I owe them a great debt of gratitude. I may have found out about traditional Catholicism without them but I don't know if I would have. I do not agree with them about everything but I think they are good at pointing out the errors of Vatican II and the recent popes.

    Just yesterday I read their book on Padre Pio again which is not bad. My former SSPX priest liked their book about Padre Pio so much that he got many copies of it and gave it out to us at Mass, even though he opposes the Dimond Brothers on many issues.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #3 on: February 05, 2015, 01:07:09 PM »
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  • Yes, the Dimond brothers are a mixed bag.

    Some of the work they do is tremendous.  Their biography of Padre Pio has to be one of the best I've ever read.  They wrote this pamphlet "How the Bible Proves the Teachings of the Catholic Church" that's a masterpiece of apologetics.  Their stuff on UFOs was tremendous.  They have done absolutely terrifc work showing the problems with evolution ... from a scientific standpoint.  Their video on "Hell" is very motivational.  And they practically give their materials away (most of it is available free online, while the rest they must be taking a loss on).  I consider them to be right on a number of issues, e.g. NFP and MOST of their thinking on EENS.

    Where they crossed the line, however, is in having gone dogmatic both with regard to BoD and with regard to Sedevacantism.  To call even CLASSIC BOD such as held by St. Thomas Aquinas "heretical" and to label non-sedevacantists as non-Catholics crosses a very dangerous and very serious line ... into a schismatic mentality.  Sometimes they fail to make the appropriate distinctions and make everything a dogmatic black-and-white.  It's this dogmatic stuff (which they have more in common with the dogmatic SVs than the classical Feeneyites, most of whom are R&R or in communion with Rome) that has caused them to go off the rails.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    « Reply #4 on: February 05, 2015, 01:11:32 PM »
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  • Quote from: TKGS
    Are they "real" brothers?  They claim to be Benedictine (I think) monks and have a monastery (which is their house).  I have never heard of authority under which they have established their monastery or taken vows, though their claims to this cannot be discounted due to the crisis in the Church.


    No, they're not brothers in the strict canonical sense, but then a LOT of Traditional Religious groups lack the same canonical approval.  So that's neither here nor there.  People who despise their positions tend to use that as an ad hominem.  If they live according to the rule of St. Benedict, they're at least informal Benedictines; there was some link to a former Benedictine but it wasn't very strong.  Yet that part is neither here nor there.  Anyone can decide to live like a Benedictine.


    Offline Bellator Dei

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #5 on: February 05, 2015, 01:16:26 PM »
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  • Quote from: TKGS
    Are they "real" brothers?


    From what I understand, they took their vows before a validly ordained Priest.
    Please pray for all of the holy souls in purgatory.

    Offline steelcross

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #6 on: February 05, 2015, 04:47:52 PM »
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  • Thanks to all who commented, and all with very well explanations. I once called them to place an order, and whomever I spoke with, seemed rude. I seen one of their videos on YouTube that explained purgatory in scripture, pretty good there. And it seems I am not the only one who sees this. Its good to know there are Catholics out there such as everyone here on this site, that see and call things as theyare. Again, thank you my bbrothers and sisters in Christ. God love you. †

    Offline Croixalist

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #7 on: February 05, 2015, 10:02:26 PM »
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  • Ah yes. Frederick "Michael" and Robert "Peter". The same "Home Aloners" who regularly attend a VII Rome-aligned Eastern Rite church in plain clothes. They also claimed that JPII was the Antichrist and Benedict was the False Prophet... then Bergoglio happened. lol.

    I've seen commercials for their website about a year ago on late night CNN (it's always on where I work). They've been sued by a naive man who joined their "monastery" thinking they were true Benedictines and gave them his life savings... only to find out who they really were and left without being able to get his money back. Their videos don't require a lot of overhead, where does all the money go?

    TV commercials?

    Fred's narrative style oozes with the malice and arrogance of an obnoxious high school debate team member. Seeing the sheer amount of trads who mirror their beliefs now, I just can't justify straining out all their garbage to get a kernel of truth.

    Avoid them like the plague!
    Fortuna finem habet.


    Offline Matto

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #8 on: February 05, 2015, 10:17:48 PM »
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  • If I ever manage to save my soul, I will have the dimond brothers to thank for it as much as anyone else because they enlightened me in this world of shame. Even though I now disagree with them about some things I will always be grateful to them for starting me on the road to (hopefully) salvation.

    Offline TheKnightVigilant

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #9 on: February 05, 2015, 10:52:59 PM »
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  • I credit the Dimond Brothers (along with Bishop Williamson) for bringing me to the Catholic faith. Without their influence I'd probably still be either an atheist or some kind of Calvinist. When I was in the initial stages of my conversion to Christianity, I was mainly exposed to Calvinist videos and writings, partly because they have a much larger internet presence than traditional Catholics and are regrettably much more involved in evangelizing. But it was, somewhat ironically, through the conduit of anti-Catholic Calvinism that I found the Catholic Church. I was researching some kind of anti-Catholic conspiracy theories when I stumbled upon the Dimond Brothers material. The things they were saying about Christianity and about history just made so much more sense than any of the Prottie claptrap I'd been reading up to that point. Unlike most trad Catholics, they make themselves heard. They have a forceful style which compels you to listen. They proselytize.

    I don't agree with all of their positions now. Hell, I'm not even sure if I'd call myself a sedevacantist at this point. But I still think they do some great things. Peter Dimond's debate with the rabid Calvinist Keith Thompson is simply the best refutation of Protestantism I've ever heard. He literally obliterates their religion.

    Offline Bellator Dei

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #10 on: February 06, 2015, 06:51:59 AM »
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  • Quote from: Croixalist
    they've been sued by a naive man who joined their "monastery" thinking they were true Benedictines and gave them his life savings... only to find out who they really were and left without being able to get his money


    They won that lawsuit, by the way.  


    Quote from: Croixalist
    Avoid them like the plague!


    Why?


    I know that a lot of the information that they provide is hard to take in sometimes, but blanket statements like these are just ridiculous.  They have a wealth of information that they've made available for people to look into, for free.

    If you know that they're wrong about something, prove it.  Challenge them to a debate and prove that they're wrong.  

    It really makes me laugh sometimes that individuals like Siscoe, Sungenis, Ferrara, Salza, et al, claim to be these modern day lay theologians - but NONE of them will debate the Dimonds....why is that?




     
    Please pray for all of the holy souls in purgatory.


    Offline JezusDeKoning

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #11 on: February 06, 2015, 07:12:03 AM »
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  • The Dimonds do some things right but their very "us-vs.-them" attitude can be kind of jarring. If they weren't both Feeneyite and dogmatic sedevacantist, they'd be brilliant.
    The second Monday of October is Columbus Day, not Indigenous People's Day. Without Columbus discovering the Indies and giving them the True Faith, they would still be cannibals worshipping the Sun.

    Santo subito!

    Offline Ladislaus

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #12 on: February 06, 2015, 07:42:04 AM »
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  • Quote from: JezusDeKoning
    The Dimonds do some things right but their very "us-vs.-them" attitude can be kind of jarring. If they weren't both Feeneyite and dogmatic sedevacantist, they'd be brilliant.


    No, if they weren't DOGMATIC "Feeneyite" and dogmatic sedevacantist, they'd be brilliant.  They do struggle with their syllogisms and their logic (an inability to make appropriate distinctions when warranted) and their grasp of Latin, due to lack of formal theological training, but they make a great contribution in a lot of ways.

    Offline Croixalist

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #13 on: February 06, 2015, 09:18:31 AM »
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  • Quote from: Bellator Dei
    Quote from: Croixalist
    they've been sued by a naive man who joined their "monastery" thinking they were true Benedictines and gave them his life savings... only to find out who they really were and left without being able to get his money


    Quote
    They won that lawsuit, by the way.
     

    That's not the point.

    Of course, if they want to say they're Benedictine, there's very little recourse to secular law. They can't be punished by the Church because they're already operating outside of it.  Like I said, the man was naive. Once he left their monastery his money stayed in their pockets. Was it moral for them to do so after it's obvious he wasn't aware of their history? I'd say no.

    They're swindlers on top of being frauds, false prophets, and raving home-aloner hypocrites.

    Quote
    I know that a lot of the information that they provide is hard to take in sometimes, but blanket statements like these are just ridiculous.  They have a wealth of information that they've made available for people to look into, for free.


    It wasn't a blanket statement, it was a piece of advice coming from someone who doesn't believe a good portion of what they teach is true.

    Quote
    If you know that they're wrong about something, prove it.  Challenge them to a debate and prove that they're wrong.


    That won't be necessary. If JPII was the "Final AntiChrist" and Benedict was his "False Prophet", then what pray tell, is Bergoglio? Just another VII antipope? An evil "Peter the Roman"! You tell me. I'm not wading through one more of their screeds. Any version of the Final Antichrist that does not naturally conclude with the return of Christ Himself doesn't fit in with anything I've ever read on the subject. It also doesn't help that JPII died as an old man from natural causes after a very long decline.

    Quote
    It really makes me laugh sometimes that individuals like Siscoe, Sungenis, Ferrara, Salza, et al, claim to be these modern day lay theologians - but NONE of them will debate the Dimonds....why is that?


    I remember Salza saying that they were ducking him. I guess we'll just have to trust in their angelic personalities and hope they'd never mislead their throng of dedicated YT subscribers and paypal donators!
    Fortuna finem habet.

    Offline Bellator Dei

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    the diamond bros
    « Reply #14 on: February 06, 2015, 09:38:31 AM »
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  • Quote from: Croixalist
    Like I said, the man was naive. Once he left their monastery his money stayed in their pockets. Was it moral for them to do so after it's obvious he wasn't aware of their history? I'd say no.


    Of course, you are entitled to your opinion.  I was merely pointing out that just because there was a lawsuit, it doesn't necessarily qualify as reason to discredit them.  


    Quote from: Croixalist
    It wasn't a blanket statement, it was a piece of advice coming from someone who doesn't believe a good portion of what they teach is true

    Right....   But when confronted about providing proof, you answer like most who cannot provide an adequate answer, such as:  
    Quote from: Croixalist
    That won't be necessary.


    Quote from: Croixalist
    I remember Salza saying that they were ducking him.


    Doubtful, but certainly within the realm of possibilities.  The point, however, is that if you're going to accuse them of being frauds, debate them in a public setting and prove it.  Saying that they're frauds on an internet forum doesn't do your accusation any justice.

    I'm not trying to hold you to anything here on the forum, but if you believe they are truly frauds, then expose them in a debate setting so we can all have proof.




       
    Please pray for all of the holy souls in purgatory.

     

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