Author Topic: Institution of the Catholic Church dead-- Father Malachi Martin (Read 2749 times)

Dawn · « **Reply #15 on:** June 19, 2009, 04:45:03 PM »

Parents, for the record, my priest Fr. K. liked Fr. Malachi Martin and chuckles that so many who never met him or worked with him as he did calumniate a dead man.

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #16 on:** June 19, 2009, 06:10:59 PM »

I'd like to see the source you're quoting when Father Martin allegedly "boasted about how he helped the cause of the Jєωs with the Vatican II sect."

Thanks.

Raoul76 · « **Reply #17 on:** June 19, 2009, 07:46:17 PM »

Telesphorus · « **Reply #18 on:** June 19, 2009, 08:43:02 PM »

Quote from: Raoul76

Do you also agree with him that Satan and Lucifer are two separate beings? That one made me laugh.

Certainly sounds heterodox.

Prodinoscopus · « **Reply #19 on:** June 19, 2009, 09:16:50 PM »

Quote from: Dawn

Apostate is the word that you are looking for. He was and Apostate from the faith long before he ever was elected by his fellow Cardinals (not by the Power of the Holy Spirit). And therefore could never have been Pope.

You're missing the point. I understand full well that you believe that Benedict XVI is an apostate anti-pope. The point is that non-sedevacantists are morally justified in disobeying the unjust commands of a Pope whom we recognize to be a valid successor of St. Peter. You can feel free to condemn me for recognizing Benedict XVI as a valid Pope, but don't try to catch me out in an act of disobedience toward him. That's just a lame attempt to score some cheap debating points.

roscoe · « **Reply #20 on:** June 19, 2009, 11:25:04 PM »

Quote from: Raoul76

"At one time a professor of Semitic Languages in Rome, he served as secretary to Cardinal Bea, spokesman for Jєωιѕн interests at the Vatican Council. More recently, on the Art Bell radio talk show, he bragged that he had done more than anyone else to further the Jєωιѕн cause in Catholic circles."

Ask yourself this, my good lady. If Martin proposes the Siri thesis, that Siri was elected in both 1958 and 1963, then why did he support Paul VI and John-Paul II? If he knows that this was all a conspiracy to "change" the Church, why did he go along with these changes until the end? Why did he go out of his way to exonerate Wojtyla?

My impression of Martin is that, just like the crazed Irish man who runs In Today's Catholic World, he was an irrepressibly energetic con artist who would say or do anything to get attention, and who thrived on sowing confusion.

This is why, even though the Siri thesis may be true, I leave it alone for the most part. It seems to appeal to those who thrill at the idea of solving a mystery -- while sedevacantists know that some mysteries can't be solved. I do not feel that I would ever be able to find out if Siri were elected Pope, nor whether he has successors, nor where those successors are.

I have disagreements with TCW but to allege he is crazed is something I wouldn't agree with. It makes more sense to say the hierarchy is hidden because for one, it cannot be denied that this has happened more than a few times in Church history-- it begins in the catacombs. Second-- there has never been anything like the present scandal so.....

'sedevacantists know that some mysteries can't be solved'--- Those who believe Greg XVII was the true Pope are not 'sedes'. WE do recognise a different line of Popes and I will admit that I do not know who the Pope is at this time but this does not mean that there isn't one.

Besides from the perspective of the Church Triumphant, a Pope is not really needed as there is no longer any need for a Pontiff to put the final Imprimateur on any Dogmatic Article of Faith.

roscoe · « **Reply #21 on:** June 19, 2009, 11:30:43 PM »

Quote from: Catholic Martyr

The Siri thesis makes me think of Gnosticism.

The v2 'church' makes me think of Gnosticism-- among other things

roscoe · « **Reply #22 on:** June 19, 2009, 11:55:11 PM »

R76-- I disagree when you say there is no way to get to the bottom of what is going on now-- Card Siri was truely elected Pope in 1958.

Common sense says that there is no evidence for anyone other than two poss popes in 1958. Siri and Roncalli. Since we know that Roncalli was anti-pope, there is then no other possibility.

roscoe · « **Reply #23 on:** June 20, 2009, 12:14:13 AM »

It is most unfortunate that Bea was at one time the confessor to Pius XII. This along with the stories of Mrs Martinez led me to presume Card Pacelli as an anti-pope but this is in error. As Sen Mc Carthy did not understand that his greatest enemy was right next to him, the Apostate Bea was not suspected.

I was an Art Bell fan in the early days when he was all politics. Ever since he went UFO, I wouldn't trust anyone who he is on good terms with.

roscoe · « **Reply #24 on:** June 20, 2009, 12:38:54 AM »

Art Bell is into the occult big time-- all of these people mix truth and lies. TCW thinks M Martin abjured of his errors b4 he died.

Raoul76 · « **Reply #25 on:** June 20, 2009, 03:59:32 AM »

When I say that Hobson is "crazed" I do not mean to say that the Siri thesis in itself is crazed. It is half-sane, in my view. While it is very likely that Siri was elected at some point, I fail to see how he could have created his own cardinals and had a successor elected while under supposedly strict supervision. The story of Archbishop Thuc is about as far as I go into cloak-and-dagger and seems far more plausible.

What bothers me about Hobson is that he tries to make the Siri election into an article of faith, into dogma, and works on peoples' fear by misinterpreting the statement of Vatican I about a perpetual succession of Popes. This was not PROPHECY. Vatican Councils do not deal in prophecy. It was meant to defend the office of the papacy against those who thought it was an antiquated office, and that the Church should become democratic, as most of the nations were becoming at that time. Therefore, those who said that there SHOULD NOT be Popes, and said instead that there should be collegiality, for instance... Let them be anathema.

Hobson also says "Blessed is he who has not seen but has believed" to refer to those who believe in this invisible line of Popes. This was said by Jesus referring to those ( us ) who never walked with Him or saw His resurrection. It made me intensely angry when I saw Hobson using this line as part of his salesman patter to bolster his pet theory. Jesus did not ask us to believe in invisible Popes.

I am also much less than impressed by Fr. Khoat. The sermon that I saw him give on video was pure Spielberg, trying to pull on emotional heartstrings, painting a picture of the suffering, saintly Siri. The look on Khoat's face was nauseatingly insincere, bad acting. That doesn't mean that Siri wasn't Pope, or that he didn't suffer! But I don't need puppy dogs and rainbows. I want facts. Khoat and Hobson don't have them.

There is no "gnosticism" among the Siri proponents, though. Whoever said that may have been picking up a trace of Dan Brown-style Rosicrucian mysticism from them, but I don't think it applies. Believing that the election in 1958 was rigged or corrupted is far more believable than saying that Mary Magdalene's baby with Jesus became a Merovingian king whose descendant is currently prepping for his role as Great Monarch

My feeling about them is more that they are afraid to take the sedevacantist leap. They are trying to cover all their bases with God, just in case. I think they're making God out to be rather small-minded, and that God will not hold us to account for not being able to dig to the bottom of an immense conspiracy where many, many interests are at stake. But I do not think their position is spiritually harmful. If they are afraid of being all-out sedevacantists, it is better they latch onto Siri than to SSPX.

Sorry, Parentsfortruth, I do not have the Art Bell program. What those articles say is far more damaging than what he supposedly said on Art Bell anyway.

Judith Gordon, the writer of the second article, is a Siri-thesist like yourself. She mentioned two of his books written under the pen name Michael Serafian that are Jєω-friendly. If you are concerned about the truth behind this St. Germain-like figure, go read them. For me, it's a waste of energy. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it's a duck. Whatever my other sins, and they are numerous, I am a straight-shooter to the marrow and it is easy for me to see people who aren't. Whenever I listen to this man he leaps from one absurd statement to the next, most of them contradictory.